Guardiola to be found out in the premier league

[roydo]

Do you respect United?

Yeah. Self generated success, built on graft.

 

[HongKongToffee]

Astounding 1.2 billion euros NET spend since 2008 for Man City.

PSG net spend since 2008 is 721 million,their state owned ownership came in 2011.

Here's some notable net spends in same time frame.

United 709 million.
Chelsea 410 million.
Bayern 410 million.
Real 440 million.
Barca 610 million.
Arsenal 188 million.
RS 210 million.
Spurs 154 million.
Us 170 million.

 

[Billy Dean]

http://www.football365.com/news/premier-league-winners-and-losers-97

Pep Guardiola, doing what he promised he would
If Guardiola was surprised by anything in his first season in English football, it was not the nature of our game but the strength of the criticism that followed every setback. Manchester City’s manager was specifically mocked for revealing that he didn’t coach tackling, but the overarching theme of all this criticism was that Guardiola’s footballing philosophy had blurred into arrogance.

‘If Pep thinks he’s going to turn up and outplay everybody in the Premier League, and that team are going to let his side have the ball for 90% of the time and pass pretty patterns around them so they can get a result, then he is absolutely deluded,’ as one pundit wrote (and there were others).

The insinuation was clear. Nobody comes into the Premier League and succeeds without meeting English football half way. Last season was proof not of City’s journey to Guardiola’s Enlightenment taking longer than he had hoped, but that his way could not work in England without adaptation or dilution. Passing around the back? Pah. Full-backs pushing into midfield? Lunatic. More than 900 passes per game? Not here, son.

And yet he has been proven emphatically correct. Guardiola’s Manchester City have become a blend of Guardiola’s Barcelona and Guardiola’s Bayern Munich, the short passing triangles of the former and the extraordinary positional fluidity of the latter. Their league title has been virtually secured since November, and they may still set records for points and matches won, and goals scored. The competition in the Premier League is stronger than Guardiola faced at Bayern and Barcelona. That only makes this more impressive.

Of course Guardiola has had access to significant transfer budgets, but that is a reality shared by other elite managers too. Whatever Jose Mourinho’s media buddies may have you believe, the spends by the two managers do not equate to a 16-point lead. The same people who believe that the Premier League’s lack of depth has assisted City were telling us last week that City had flaws that could be exposed. You can’t have both.

Guardiola failed in the Champions League, at least according to pre-season hope. Combining domestic dominance with European glory outside of Barcelona remains his holy grail. But again, we must be careful of over-criticism. Real Madrid only managed the league and European Cup double for the first time in their history last season; there is a reason this is unusual. And if Guardiola’s City failed in the Champions League, so too did Barcelona, Manchester United, Chelsea, Paris Saint-Germain and Juventus. So too will one of Bayern Munich and Real Madrid.

So beware the tendency to re-write history, and beware those who tell you that this Premier League waltz was always a foregone conclusion. The internet is a magical place; one search brings up a queue of pundits, writers and ex-professionals who predicted a different title winner and warned Guardiola about his new signings and the new season. Most of those will be happy to stand and applaud what has followed, one of the most astonishing Premier League campaigns in which a side has dropped 12 points in nine months. The others should learn some grace.

This Premier League title, secured improbably early, is a victory for financial strength, a victory for long-term planning and a victory for free-flowing attacking football after the comparative pragmatism of Chelsea and Leicester’s recent title victories. But more than that, it is a victory for Guardiola; against Mourinho and against those who claimed he could not put up a paradise in this parking lot. They told him that he would have to change; he showed them why he refused to countenance changing. Now it is his peers who must adapt to compete with him.

 

[cityfanrob]

Yeah. Self generated success, built on graft.

I'd say that's the misty-eyed narrative rather than a completely true reflection of reality. They've had significant investment at various points in their history and were one of the pioneers in turning football clubs into corporate entities being the second English club (after Spurs iirc) to become a plc. I agree they've had some shrewd businessmen at the helm able to leverage their position into greater financial dominance, signing Rio Ferdinand for £30m in 2002 was something no other club could even consider at the time and they really hit the jackpot by winning their first title in 3 decades just as Sky TV was taking off and money was flooding into the game.

Thing is it was going that plc route that eventually allowed the Glazers to take over the club and immediately burden it with hundreds of millions in debt, all money that's been sucked out of the game instead of maybe putting some of it into upgrading the stadium, having a women's team or helping local community projects etc.

They're not exactly a shining example of a football club imho

 

[Walken]

I'd say that's the misty-eyed narrative rather than a completely true reflection of reality. They've had significant investment at various points in their history and were one of the pioneers in turning football clubs into corporate entities being the second English club (after Spurs iirc) to become a plc. I agree they've had some shrewd businessmen at the helm able to leverage their position into greater financial dominance, signing Rio Ferdinand for £30m in 2002 was something no other club could even consider at the time and they really hit the jackpot by winning their first title in 3 decades just as Sky TV was taking off and money was flooding into the game.

Thing is it was going that plc route that eventually allowed the Glazers to take over the club and immediately burden it with hundreds of millions in debt, all money that's been sucked out of the game instead of maybe putting some of it into upgrading the stadium, having a women's team or helping local community projects etc.

They're not exactly a shining example of a football club imho

Utd were in a position to take advantage of those situations because sir alex had genuinely built something, like wenger did, maybe times have changed and such jobs aren't possible now, but people take exception to pep because he stands on someone elses shoulders and people call him 12ft tall

 

[roydo]

I'd say that's the misty-eyed narrative rather than a completely true reflection of reality.

Not really. Fergie took them from an occasional cup winning side into a/the dominant club in England, and at times, in Europe. Sure, he spent cash, but cash generated by the success he built. Unlike you.

They're not exactly a shining example of a football club imho

And for all your shiny community stuff, let me know when a local lad gets a game.

 

[cityfanrob]

Utd were in a position to take advantage of those situations because sir alex had genuinely built something, like wenger did, maybe times have changed and such jobs aren't possible now, but people take exception to pep because he stands on someone elses shoulders and people call him 12ft tall

Ferguson's first title winning squad cost over £20m which was a lot of money for the time. Not knocking him for spending it but there seems to be a perception it was all done "organically". Yeah he had a once in 50 years crop of youth players to add to the mix but it was still an expensive group of players and he'd been trying and failing for 6 years to win the league. Then the Sky money and CL money kicks in and it's goodbye financial parity, only Arsenal who paid top wages had a hope of competing with them.

I don't think they have any right whatsoever to question other clubs spending money to compete with them, they've been happy to exploit every angle they can in order to try and maintain financial dominance over everyone else.

 

[Walken]

Ferguson's first title winning squad cost over £20m which was a lot of money for the time. Not knocking him for spending it but there seems to be a perception it was all done "organically". Yeah he had a once in 50 years crop of youth players to add to the mix but it was still an expensive group of players and he'd been trying and failing for 6 years to win the league. Then the Sky money and CL money kicks in and it's goodbye financial parity, only Arsenal who paid top wages had a hope of competing with them.

I don't think they have any right whatsoever to question other clubs spending money to compete with them, they've been happy to exploit every angle they can in order to try and maintain financial dominance over everyone else.

like it or not, I'm afraid fergie earned the right to be at the top table with utd, in a way pep has never done. fergie won the clubs first title for 26 years. city had won it 2 years ago when pep took over, bayern the year before, barca 1 year before. Pep has his legion of sycophants in the press, but it was mancini who changed the ethos of the club, given little enough credit amongst the media, fergie changed the ethos of utd, wenger arsenal, kendall everton, pep reminds me of alexander the great, hugely renowned and lauded for his exploits, but it was Phillip who did all the foundation work, arguably the tougher task

 

[stony]

Utd were in a position to take advantage of those situations because sir alex had genuinely built something, like wenger did, maybe times have changed and such jobs aren't possible now, but people take exception to pep because he stands on someone elses shoulders and people call him 12ft tall

You might want to read Tony Adams book if you think Wenger built that side with money the club had generated itself.

 

[Cellardweller]

Not really. Fergie took them from an occasional cup winning side into a/the dominant club in England, and at times, in Europe. Sure, he spent cash, but cash generated by the success he built. Unlike you.



And for all your shiny community stuff, let me know when a local lad gets a game.

Bollocks. United started spending bigger than everyone else in the late 80s. Between 1968 and this moment they won 3 FA cups in that 20 year period. You’re talking [Poor language removed].

 

[havrey0123]

Guardiola doesn't seem to spend too long at clubs.

 

[Walken]

You might want to read Tony Adams book if you think Wenger built that side with money the club had generated itself.

Missing the point entirely

 

[Prevenger17]

pep reminds me of alexander the great, hugely renowned and lauded for his exploits, but it was Phillip who did all the foundation work

Alexander the Great was overrated? Is there no cow too sacred Walken????

 

[Prevenger17]

But yes, United's success is far purer than City's. No arguing there

 

[stony]

Missing the point entirely

I'm not, I just think you're talking from a position of bitterness and jealousy. Pep has blown this league away, breaking record after record. He's done it with a style of football that is amazing to watch. Yet there's always someone sniping from the sidelines, spewing out nonsense and trying to undermine his achievements. It's pathetic.
If Kenright had been upfront and straight and allowed ADUG to do their due diligence and examine Everton' s books like they wanted to. It might have been you lot in our position now. No doubt you would be singing fron a different hymn sheet.
I wonder what Bill had to hide.