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Transfer Rumour Harry Winks

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Zatara said:
The way to look at this positively I think is this:

1: Lampard will know all about Winks.

2: When he played under Pochettino he really was very good. Pochettino leaving has wrecked Winks' career. People rave about the new City player Phillips. Winks was looking at least as good as him for Spurs and England a couple of years ago -- and im someone who rates Phillips.

3: If we want to play a deep lying playmaker and cant take a big risk with us being close to relegation next season then theres not many more names past Winks and Gilmour who can offer that.

4: Lampard seems to thrive on motivating players. Tarkowski was rumoured to have signed as hes convinced he can get back into the England squad...theres no reason Winks cant also if he gets back to his previous form...looks like lost confidence as hes said.

5: If the fee was £40-60mil to a ball playing team when he was under Pochettino there wouldnt be too many surprises. Id hope its a loan with an option, £20mil could be a masterstroke but I dont think that will be the deal.


My view is that Pickford, Tarkowski, Winks, Dele and DCL under Lampard could all surprise alot of people this season.

I have the opinion that English players will really perform for him.
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….would you see Winks as an Osman type of player? By that, I mean a player comfortable and composed receiving the ball in deep positions and transitioning defence into attack.

Not a tackler or interceptor, I call them Transition players. The Portuguese lad we’re linked with looks similar but has more scope. Osman made the difficult look easy and had terrific quality that also allowed him to score goals, Winks isn’t as good..
 
witchdoc187 said:
Serious question, how do you know he thinks he's better than he is? What does that actually mean?
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What I mean by that, is one of those players who hits long passes everywhere, but they are floaty ones that you or I could do. They only really reach the man if he is in absolute acres, they are not the kind of passes that require vision. If you are always going to hit long passes successfully, you need excellent technique - someone like Beckham was excellent at it.

It's like the difference between someone hitting powderpuff shots at goal (yes they are on target, but they aren't effective) versus well executed, accurate shots.

So, for me (and if we sign him I hope he proves me wrong) Winks tries to play the style of players far better than him, a style that is beyond his abilities. That is thinking you are better than you are for me. If he is more limited, don't always look for big switches, hit at slow floaty speeds, keep it on the deck.

On top of this, he also passes behind the stride of full backs and wide forwards.

I don't know if anyone has bothered to make a Harry Winks compilation video (would be funny if they had ?), but I bet if you watched it, you would see evidence of what I am talking about.
 

Eagle Eye said:
Shkodran Mustafi wasn't good enough for us but then got a 35 million pound transfer to Arsenal and has a World Cup winners medal. What's your point? Its about how players perform for us and apply themselves. Not previous club performance or reputation....
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And Arsenal regretted every pound of that transfer fee. What a waste of money that was.

My point is Gray failed at Leicester and has done very, very little in his time at Everton to justify any notion that he is good enough for a team that isn't fighting relegation. In summary, his previous form elsewhere hasn't been good enough and his form playing for us hasn't been good enough. Nil satis, eh?
 
Drico said:
And Arsenal regretted every pound of that transfer fee. What a waste of money that was.

My point is Gray failed at Leicester and has done very, very little in his time at Everton to justify any notion that he is good enough for a team that isn't fighting relegation. In summary, his previous form elsewhere hasn't been good enough and his form playing for us hasn't been good enough. Nil satis, eh?
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Couldn't disagree more. We would be in the Championship now without him in the team this season. You obviously cannot remember his contribution prior to his injury.

And don't give me the Nil satis rubbish. We haven't been shopping for the best since the 80s. What Nils Satis Nisi Optimum means to me is that if you pull on that Royal Blue shirt, you give everything you have as a minimum. Gray did that when he played this season - one of few who could say they same.
 
Eggs said:
….would you see Winks as an Osman type of player? By that, I mean a player comfortable and composed receiving the ball in deep positions and transitioning defence into attack.

Not a tackler or interceptor, I call them Transition players. The Portuguese lad we’re linked with looks similar but has more scope. Osman made the difficult look easy and had terrific quality that also allowed him to score goals, Winks isn’t as good..
Click to expand...

I think Winks under Pochettino and Winks today are two different players.

Winks before was taking the ball, breaking the lines, moving forward with it, keeping it simple and also playing deep passes...but he wasnt afraid to act "the crab" when needs be and didnt force things...a very 'Spurs' type player as we'd think of over the years.

I dont remember Osman sitting as a 6 for many games? Not sure how to compare Osman who rarely was the best player on the pitch to Winks who was playing against top sides and consistently moving the ball and receiving in deep positions...keeping the team in control like we've seen from the continental teams in european games over the decades....rare to find an English one. Under appreciated or overrated position.

For me, Gilmour, Winks and Carrick (its 130am here so memory isnt great) are the names that stand out of recent-ish players sat at the 6 role in control...before them of course Veron went to United and Chelsea.

For me, I like the idea of having that approach at our club...it would mean we would have to have far more movement and mobility in the team for it to be effective and i think players like Gordon and Dele would benefit as well as the full backs. Could be nice to watch and may work well under Lampard and win the team more games and fans if effective.

Is Winks the player I'd bring in? Is Gilmour...or Nunes (who i said last summer probably needed another season in Portugal) ?

No idea...for both Gilmour and Winks its 100% reliant on Lampard getting their top performance levels back.

Hypothetically, I'd say if we brought in Winks and Gallagher to play behind Dele then if all three were on form then theres not going to be too many better in the division.

Im not sure what the right approach is for the team.

What I would probably have done is gone down the path of having two 'evil' central midfielders acting as tacklers/interceptors/destroyers but who could also play. Players with the 'old school' mentality and clear will to win at all costs.

I think to level the playing field against the top 4 and also to overpower the majority of teams in the league you need to have two players in midfield that can dominate in their battles...and equal the playing field against more talented opposition players.

Thats what Id have gone for in our current squad condition.
 

Zatara said:
I think Winks under Pochettino and Winks today are two different players.

Winks before was taking the ball, breaking the lines, moving forward with it, keeping it simple and also playing deep passes...but he wasnt afraid to act "the crab" when needs be and didnt force things...a very 'Spurs' type player as we'd think of over the years.

I dont remember Osman sitting as a 6 for many games? Not sure how to compare Osman who rarely was the best player on the pitch to Winks who was playing against top sides and consistently moving the ball and receiving in deep positions...keeping the team in control like we've seen from the continental teams in european games over the decades....rare to find an English one. Under appreciated or overrated position.

For me, Gilmour, Winks and Carrick (its 130am here so memory isnt great) are the names that stand out of recent-ish players sat at the 6 role in control...before them of course Veron went to United and Chelsea.

For me, I like the idea of having that approach at our club...it would mean we would have to have far more movement and mobility in the team for it to be effective and i think players like Gordon and Dele would benefit as well as the full backs. Could be nice to watch and may work well under Lampard and win the team more games and fans if effective.

Is Winks the player I'd bring in? Is Gilmour...or Nunes (who i said last summer probably needed another season in Portugal) ?

No idea...for both Gilmour and Winks its 100% reliant on Lampard getting their top performance levels back.

Hypothetically, I'd say if we brought in Winks and Gallagher to play behind Dele then if all three were on form then theres not going to be too many better in the division.

Im not sure what the right approach is for the team.

What I would probably have done is gone down the path of having two 'evil' central midfielders acting as tacklers/interceptors/destroyers but who could also play. Players with the 'old school' mentality and clear will to win at all costs.

I think to level the playing field against the top 4 and also to overpower the majority of teams in the league you need to have two players in midfield that can dominate in their battles...and equal the playing field against more talented opposition players.

Thats what Id have gone for in our current squad condition.
Click to expand...

I don’t care if he is 6 or 8 or 69. I just want someone who is more mobile, pacy, physically strong, able to tackle, dribble, run with the ball, always looking for a forward pass, good vision and good recovery skill set.

We might not sign someone who fits all the above, but honestly ask yourself, does winks posses any of the above skill set. If not, how can he improve us significantly.
 
@Eggs When you have a minute take a look at Danilo (Palmeiras) and Edson Alvarez (Ajax).

If we were able to attract those types then I think they'd be 'Everton' type players.

We like a good battle in the centre of the park with some ball playing and drive added in.
 
Axlswhk said:
I don’t care if he is 6 or 8 or 69. I just want someone who is more mobile, pacy, physically strong, able to tackle, dribble, run with the ball, always looking for a forward pass, good vision and good recovery skill set.

We might not sign someone who fits all the above, but honestly ask yourself, does winks posses any of the above skill set. If not, how can he improve us significantly.
Click to expand...

Weve not had a player like that since Olivier Dacourt.
 

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