Hilary Benn Sacked From The Shadow Cabinet - wider political debate

[LouReedwalkonthewildside]

I was aware of what you meant - and I still disagree. The terms ought to have been thrashed out and/or more provisos and choices inserted in the referendum before it was put to the poll. Instead, the MP's settled on a straight in or out choice.

The electorate knew it was a simple choice, and they voted accordingly. In or out. Nothing else matters now.

You can't order a plain cheese pizza then complain there's no other toppings or it's the wrong type of cheese. Nor can you send it back after taking a vote on what cheese/toppings you want. The pizza was ordered with the consent and consensus that the electorate was happy with the choices at the start.

And even if there were to be any vote then the electorate should be asked again - not the self-serving politicians who now whine because they didn't get their preferred result because they were far too complacent of the plebs.

Think this was more down to Cameron thinking the remain vote would piss it.

 

[Whistlin' Dixie]

I agree with this, he was completely ineffective as a supposed Remain campaigner, probably because he's always been a euro sceptic and had no enthusiasm for the cause he was supposed to be championing.

So what? Had labour been elected in the GE there wouldn't have even been a referendum.

But who do you blame for that? Corbyn? He was a back-bencher then. Don't remember the remain campaigners complaining about his supposed lack of effort prior to the referendum - they probly didn't want him anywhere's near it anyway, the self-serving rats.

Just shows what them elitists are about. Snakes, the lot of 'em. Don't want their gravy train derailed. Well, bollox to the lot of them. Hard bun.

 

[Whistlin' Dixie]

Think this was more down to Cameron thinking the remain vote would piss it.

Exactly! they were the only party prepared to put a referendum in their manifesto - I wonder how many more votes that garnered for them at the last GE?

 

[Tubey]

That would be the Gisela Stuart who had 90 less appearances and who appeared in 1.6% of stories about the referendum? Do you really want to do this to yourself?

What part of "appearances aren't speeches" don't you quite get?

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Working on his reshuffle, and he probably has more sense than to get involved in this daft campaign by Miliband. In any case, John McDonnell set out what the Labour position was yesterday:

I could only count three things mentioned there, what are the other two? (I appreciate I'm being lazy)

 

[LouReedwalkonthewildside]

Exactly! they were the only party prepared to put a referendum in their manifesto - I wonder how many more votes that garnered for them at the last GE?

Probably played a big part in giving them a small majority at the GE, considering all the polls were predicting it differently.

 

[Foot Long Hot Dog]

So what? Had labour been elected in the GE there wouldn't have even been a referendum.

But who do you blame for that? Corbyn? He was a back-bencher then. Don't remember the remain campaigners complaining about his supposed lack of effort prior to the referendum - they probly didn't want him anywhere's near it anyway, the self-serving rats.

Just shows what them elitists are about. Snakes, the lot of 'em. Don't want their gravy train derailed. Well, bollox to the lot of them. Hard bun.

Nice rant mate.

So Remainers = elitists?

 

[Mountfield1985]

That's not an achievement. He was leader of the opposition and put in nearly one fifth of the effort of the PM, and the poor performance of any Labour member to campaign correctly is a reflection on how poor his party was in that referendum overall.

To say Corbyn was enthusiastic in any way in his campaign is just an outright lie. I saw a few of his appearances - they were as blatant a tick box exercise as humanly possible - nobody believed he meant a single word coming out of his mouth.

100%.

Listen to him on any issue he is passionate about and it's "We believe this is right... We feel... Our aim is to..."

All the way through the EU referendum, it was "The Labour party believes... The party's position is..."

The lack of conviction was there for all to see. Of course it doesn't make this whole mess JC's fault, far from it. Whether it would have changed the outcome is very debatable. But it does highlight the tunnel vision of some JC supporters who refuse to accept he can ever do any wrong.

 

[Whistlin' Dixie]

Probably played a big part in giving them a small majority at the GE, considering all the polls were predicting it differently.

Yes - and it was made clear then that it'd be a straight choice.

Nice rant mate.

So Remainers = elitists?

If you mean the (Especially political) whoppers that are crying because real democracy didn't work for them so they call the plebescite people racist and thick - then yes.

 

[Pienaar's gloves]

Yes - and it was made clear then that it'd be a straight choice.



If you mean the (Especially political) whoppers that are crying because real democracy didn't work for them so they call the plebescite people racist and thick - then yes.

Thing is, whether linked to the referendum or not, huge numbers of people in this country ARE racist and/or thick.

Like, massive numbers.

Sadly it's political suicide to say so.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

100%.

Listen to him on any issue he is passionate about and it's "We believe this is right... We feel... Our aim is to..."

All the way through the EU referendum, it was "The Labour party believes... The party's position is..."

The lack of conviction was there for all to see. Of course it doesn't make this whole mess JC's fault, far from it. Whether it would have changed the outcome is very debatable. But it does highlight the tunnel vision of some JC supporters who refuse to accept he can ever do any wrong.

No, when I mentioned it previously it was more the lack of any apparent opposition to what the Tories are doing rather than pinning the blame on Labour in particular.

 

[Whistlin' Dixie]

Thing is, whether linked to the referendum or not, huge numbers of people in this country ARE racist and/or thick.

Like, massive numbers.

Sadly it's political suicide to say so.

Yes. To the extent that those what voted tory merely because they were giving the referendum, while being fully aware it was a straight in or out choice and now whining because the result didnt go in favour of remain.

And the likes of that stupid cow what started crying in BBCQT that she voted tory and now they were taking away her tax credits....That Corbyn voted against....But a lot of the PLP abstained on...The same ones that wanted to remain in the EU, no doubt.

No wonder more & more people are getting mightily pissed off with the political/westminster classes. They're overwhelmingly the same.

 

[Foot Long Hot Dog]

If you mean the (Especially political) whoppers that are crying because real democracy didn't work for them so they call the plebescite people racist and thick - then yes.

Plenty are racist and thick.

However, real democracy? Pfffttt, 2 sides spinning yarns in order to win votes and one side telling blatant lies that simply disappeared from the internet ether never to be seen again the day after the vote? Who can win over the plebs with the biggest crock of crap - democracy at it's finest.

 

[Toffeelover]

Plenty are racist and thick.

However, real democracy? Pfffttt, 2 sides spinning yarns in order to win votes and one side telling blatant lies that simply disappeared from the internet ether never to be seen again the day after the vote? Who can win over the plebs with the biggest crock of crap - democracy at it's finest.

Actually Footy, it was. never mind the rhetoric the population of the country were given a free vote on an issue. That is democracy. A freedom not given in many countries of the world.

 

[ToffeeDoug]

Actually Footy, it was. never mind the rhetoric the population of the country were given a free vote on an issue. That is democracy. A freedom not given in many countries of the world.

...and with a turnout far in excess of what would, sadly, now be seen at a General Election. And with a binding outcome.