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Idrissa Gana Gueye

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Efcjake said:
I'm amazed he never had more back injuries since he carried all of Schneiderlin, Davies, Rooney, Klassen, Sigurdsson, Cleverley, McCarthy and more while he was here.

He wasnt amazing but he was far more useful in the midfield than every other one of those players I've named above who he had the pleasure of playing next to while he was here.

Better than them but not better or more useful than an Allan or Doucoure because he was a far more limited footballer than those two are.
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I agree with everything except the Doucoure part.
 
TheBigIguana said:
I wonder who the last player we had for as long as he was here for who this wasn't true for?
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I see his point and he's not wrong. I see Gana as the relative best of a bad bunch. That period was a dark time. Korean, Allardyce, and Silva don't have a winning record between them so no player here during that will have neither.

Gana was one of 11 when he played under those useless frauds, an on average, was typically one of the better players. It made him a small ray of sunshine in a dark time and so he's looked upon as probably being better than he was as the lone flower surrounded by muck.
 
Efcjake said:
I see his point and he's not wrong. I see Gana as the relative best of a bad bunch. That period was a dark time. Korean, Allardyce, and Silva don't have a winning record between them so no player here during that will have neither.

Gana was one of 11 when he played under those useless frauds, an on average, was typically one of the better players. It made him a small ray of sunshine in a dark time and so he's looked upon as probably being better than he was as the lone flower surrounded by muck.
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He was also really good when we were good too. It's kind of like Digne. Yes he was the best player on a bad team last year but also the best player on solid teams this year and in 18/19.
 

Efcjake said:
I see his point and he's not wrong. I see Gana as the relative best of a bad bunch. That period was a dark time. Korean, Allardyce, and Silva don't have a winning record between them so no player here during that will have neither.

Gana was one of 11 when he played under those useless frauds, an on average, was typically one of the better players. It made him a small ray of sunshine in a dark time and so he's looked upon as probably being better than he was as the lone flower surrounded by muck.
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wow!
 
TheBigIguana said:
I just think it's funny that people think he was bad on the ball but rate Gomes up alongside Pirlo
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Horses for courses, Gomes is far better on the ball and Gana is good for hunting the ball down. Likewise if Gomes attempts to play that role he would look terrible, same as if Gana tried to pass to a team mate.
 

Walken said:
probably because Gomes is good with ball and gana wasn't, seems fairly reasonable but people find humour in the strangest things
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Gomes is approaching Bernard levels of myth territory I'm afraid. Anyway wrong discussion.

My take on Gueye is this: he played in a bad passing team in a position where his role was primarily defensive and he was still decent with the ball. When he played internationally he was given more of a distributor job and he was perfectly fine with it. At PSG he moved into more of a box to box spot and his passing improved to match what he was asked to do. He was and remains a really good player.

And as far as him vs Allan, they're remarkable similar to me. Both high level defensive midfielders with the ability to both keep it simple in possession as Allan has done this far in the PL and Gana did while here or to be a bit more direct and progressive when asked as Allan did at Napoli and yesterday and as Gana has done in France. My reason for Gueye not being better here comes down to tactics and his colleagues.

We could drop Gueye in for Doucoure and play him with Allan and it would be great or for Allan with Doucoure and he'd still be great. This revisionist history regarding his ability is about the most embarrassing I've seen.
 
Ollie d said:
Horses for courses, Gomes is far better on the ball and Gana is good for hunting the ball down. Likewise if Gomes attempts to play that role he would look terrible, same as if Gana tried to pass to a team mate.
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Gomes is better at dribbling the ball. It's one part of playing in possession. Other things matter. A good way to see this is to go examine all the people who think Holgate is better with the ball than Keane for the same reason. Too many people too easily wooed by occasional flash instead of consistent ability.
 
TheBigIguana said:
Gomes is approaching Bernard levels of myth territory I'm afraid. Anyway wrong discussion.

My take on Gueye is this: he played in a bad passing team in a position where his role was primarily defensive and he was still decent with the ball. When he played internationally he was given more of a distributor job and he was perfectly fine with it. At PSG he moved into more of a box to box spot and his passing improved to match what he was asked to do. He was and remains a really good player.

And as far as him vs Allan, they're remarkable similar to me. Both high level defensive midfielders with the ability to both keep it simple in possession as Allan has done this far in the PL and Gana did while here or to be a bit more direct and progressive when asked as Allan did at Napoli and yesterday and as Gana has done in France. My reason for Gueye not being better here comes down to tactics and his colleagues.

We could drop Gueye in for Doucoure and play him with Allan and it would be great or for Allan with Doucoure and he'd still be great. This revisionist history regarding his ability is about the most embarrassing I've seen.
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Whatever Gomes weaknesses he is good on the ball and clearly has good technique, gana doesn't, he's like a kitten chasing a ball of wool and all of his attributes are without the ball. That's fine to an extent but was also the reason he had plenty of poor games for us as well. He is a good few levels below allan who is better on the ball and has far better awareness. He is not capable of doing doucoures role as he is so poor in the final third.

I thought all this when he was here so nothing revisionist about it for me, never enjoyed watching him play.
 
TheBigIguana said:
Gomes is better at dribbling the ball. It's one part of playing in possession. Other things matter. A good way to see this is to go examine all the people who think Holgate is better with the ball than Keane for the same reason. Too many people too easily wooed by occasional flash instead of consistent ability.
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His vision is better, he is better at beating a man and has a far far better range of passing. If you want to make a case for gana then you have to take a different route
 

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