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January 2019 Transfer Window

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EverBlue92 said:
No way should Gana be sold.

Schnerderlin, Besic and McCarthy out and Gomes + Ndombele or Decoure in.

We will likely get Europa League football next season and we need strength in depth to rotate.

Gomes, Ndombele with Gana and Davies as squad players would be great depth.
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Who is paying the money for Ndombele + Gomes?

Thats potentially up to £100mil.

Brisan123 said:
I know that , you know that but Zat wants him sold because he is old
I was replying to someone who asked why Zat wanted Gana sold
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Thats not what i wrote.

CairnsToffee said:
I believe you may be disappointed!....
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Probably, but i wasnt in the summer :)

Also i dont think Gomes + a top starter is a stretch?

Jamalio Danubio DiCanio said:
What do the clubs of any of these players have to gain by selling in january?

Porto are top of the Portuguese league and in the L16 of the Champions League.

Palace are likely to be in a relegation battle

Lyon are going to be changing CL in Ligue1 and either in CL L16 or the Europa League after January

PSV are going for the Eredivisie title

RBL are going for Top 4 in the Bundesliga.

All the clubs will literally have no reason to sell. All the players are playing regularly in them teams and will probably won't to see out the season.

There's virtually no chance in us signing any of those players in January. Unless we pay 10-20M over the odds and offer the player incredible wages. We might as well wait until next summer. Finishing 6th, 7th or 8th doesn't really matter that much. Plus we could still get 6th with the current players.

This is a couple of season transition that is going very well at the moment. There's no need to go over the top in January. If a bargain comes available then great. None of the above will be anywhere close to a bargain in January.
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You can make cases for/against teams selling players...perhaps in the case of PSV they need the cash, or palace may want one or two of our forwards?

Theres two benefits for us, we get to bed the players in so theyre in peak level for the following season or theyre signed and loaned back till summer.

I think we will be in for one or two south americans as their seasons will be over.
 
Neiler said:
I did simplify it, it does get more complicated when you add wages to the tipping point of balancing value and loss, but its an accurate reflection of how football business and the market works not just in Europe (not sure what you mean there) but Universally including in the UK. Simply put adding up how much we can make and who we can buy on net spend of transfer fees in and out in a year is totally useless and inaccurate, its just wasting time really with all due respect.

Yep absolutely, we could make a profit on the book price of our better players, like Richarlson, Gylfi, Keane, Pickford, Coleman, Idrissa etc, we obviously cant sell Gomes or Mina. The range of profit is different as well, for example you could sell Gylfi for 50 mill and Seamus for 25 mill, but because Gylfi would have a book price of about 37 mill, we would make far more of a more profit on Coleman despite the fee being smaller.

Problem generally is these arent usually the players that you want to sell and generally cost more to replace. I give you Lukaku as an example.
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The typical system for many years in European leagues e.g Italy was to spread the fee over the course of a players contract. That has then been adopted widely in England.

Lost me about why Mina cant be sold...he could in theory and practice be sold in january.

Lost me again on the Lukaku example, sold for £90mil but could have been replaced for far less with superior DOF knowledge and ability...Brands opposed to Walsh.
 
Zatara said:
The typical system for many years in European leagues e.g Italy was to spread the fee over the course of a players contract. That has then been adopted widely in England.

Lost me about why Mina cant be sold...he could in theory and practice be sold in january.

Lost me again on the Lukaku example, sold for £90mil but could have been replaced for far less with superior DOF knowledge and ability...Brands opposed to Walsh.
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Its been the typical system in England always mate, you would look hard to find fees paid upfront, its not something that has been adopted in England recently. For example we have borrowed on the strength of advanced payments for Stones and Lukaku this summer already, their fees are paid to us over many years annually, Utd didnt just transfer 90 million to us.

Barca have an option to buy Mina back in the summer of 2020, how can we honor that contract if he playing for another club?

Lukaku is an example of selling your best players at a high price, means you have to replace them with similar quality and a lower value really, not really that easy as we found over two directors of football including Brands. So the point is if we sell one of our better players to bring in revenue, it has to be congruent with the needs of the footballing Dept, else wise there is a secondary loss due to footballing regression i.e. no European football, lower league place, lower attendances, lack of commercial attractiveness etc.
 
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Neiler said:
Its been the typical system in England always mate, you would look hard to find fees paid upfront, its not something that has been adopted in England recently. For example we have borrowed on the strength of advanced payments for Stones and Lukaku this summer already, their fees are paid to us over many years annually, Utd didnt just transfer 90 million to us.

Barca have an option to buy Mina back in the summer of 2020, how can we honor that contract if he playing for another club?

Lukaku is an example of selling your best players at a high price, means you have to replace them with similar quality and a lower value really, not really that easy as we found over two directors of football including Brands. So the point is if we sell one of our better players to bring in revenue, it has to be congruent with the needs of the footballing Dept, else wise there is a secondary loss due to footballing regression i.e. no European football, lower league place, lower attendances, lack of commercial attractiveness etc.
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At the start of the premier league there was a sizeable payment up front as the norm and then all kinds of various payments. Blackburn first blew that out of the water then leeds then united etc...meanwhile in Italy almost every deal was staggered over a contract which led to anomalys when doing business in england.

Whatever Barca have agreed for 2020 it doesnt stop everton from selling the player before that date, there may well be a clause there...who knows but on the face of it we could sell him for £100mil in Jan.

I think Brands replaced players on the cheap tbh.
 
Neiler said:
Barca have an option to buy Mina back in the summer of 2020, how can we honor that contract if he playing for another club?

Lukaku is an example of selling your best players at a high price, means you have to replace them with similar quality and a lower value really, not really that easy as we found over two directors of football including Brands. So the point is if we sell one of our better players to bring in revenue, it has to be congruent with the needs of the footballing Dept, else wise there is a secondary loss due to footballing regression i.e. no European football, lower league place, lower attendances, lack of commercial attractiveness etc.
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Generally on the Barca front what would happen in these situations is they have the option to match the deal and sign them back. It would be very difficult to remove the ability to sell a player before that. I can't see why we would or he would want to leave though.

I saw a fascinating interview with Monchi re Alisson and he basically said they had pre-planned his departure, knew they couldn't replace him like for like, but knew a price point comes when they are being paid too much to resist. Brands will have to be cuter with sales, but there's no reason why you can't continue to improve if you recruit well. In fact I would probably say the liquidity generated by moving some big players on every so often will give Brands the flexibility he requires to operate in the transfer market.

People understandably hate it, but if Richarlinson was sold for say £100 million (and I may be being cautious as his value is going one way) and we can add Lozano, Gomes (who I can't see costing the astronomical figures quoted) and Ndombele/Barbosa to me it's good business.
 

Neiler said:
Its been the typical system in England always mate, you would look hard to find fees paid upfront, its not something that has been adopted in England recently. For example we have borrowed on the strength of advanced payments for Stones and Lukaku this summer already, their fees are paid to us over many years annually, Utd didnt just transfer 90 million to us.

Barca have an option to buy Mina back in the summer of 2020, how can we honor that contract if he playing for another club?

Lukaku is an example of selling your best players at a high price, means you have to replace them with similar quality and a lower value really, not really that easy as we found over two directors of football including Brands. So the point is if we sell one of our better players to bring in revenue, it has to be congruent with the needs of the footballing Dept, else wise there is a secondary loss due to footballing regression i.e. no European football, lower league place, lower attendances, lack of commercial attractiveness etc.
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Not really set Old Trafford alight as he?
 
catcherintherye said:
Generally on the Barca front what would happen in these situations is they have the option to match the deal and sign them back. It would be very difficult to remove the ability to sell a player before that. I can't see why we would or he would want to leave though.

I saw a fascinating interview with Monchi re Alisson and he basically said they had pre-planned his departure, knew they couldn't replace him like for like, but knew a price point comes when they are being paid too much to resist. Brands will have to be cuter with sales, but there's no reason why you can't continue to improve if you recruit well. In fact I would probably say the liquidity generated by moving some big players on every so often will give Brands the flexibility he requires to operate in the transfer market.

People understandably hate it, but if Richarlinson was sold for say £100 million (and I may be being cautious as his value is going one way) and we can add Lozano, Gomes (who I can't see costing the astronomical figures quoted) and Ndombele/Barbosa to me it's good business.
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I don’t disagree in principal Catcher, it is however very delicate and subjective and not easily done, the only club you could say that did it was Spurs perhaps with the Bale money and they took a couple of runs at it, perhaps Wenger with Anelka.
 
Zatara said:
At the start of the premier league there was a sizeable payment up front as the norm and then all kinds of various payments. Blackburn first blew that out of the water then leeds then united etc...meanwhile in Italy almost every deal was staggered over a contract which led to anomalys when doing business in england.

Whatever Barca have agreed for 2020 it doesnt stop everton from selling the player before that date, there may well be a clause there...who knows but on the face of it we could sell him for £100mil in Jan.

I think Brands replaced players on the cheap tbh.
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Not sure that it right mate, but i am open to correction, do you have a source to back up?

I’m not sure on your second point either, I suspect you are incorrect, do you also have a source?

On the third point we will see, he will have the opportunity to sign a striker, I was surprised he didn’t tbh.
 

catcherintherye said:
Clubs on the continent build a whole strategy around it though mate.
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But to what end mate, trophies? We are at the top of the food chain, being in the PL that has advantages primarily financially but we operate in the most competitive market in world football. It’s a tricky one.

It takes true greatness and the right conditions structurally , to elevate our position to trophies in my opinion, to my mind only Ferguson and Wenger have done it consistently without artificial support while building a club.

It takes stragic building, talented management and the right choice of player sales in my opinion, it’s very difficult though.
 
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Neiler said:
But to what end mate, trophies? We are at the top of the food chain, being in the PL that has advantages primarily financially but we operate in the most competitive market in world football. It’s a tricky one.

It takes through greatness and the right conditions structurally , to elevate our position to trophies in my opinion, to my mind only Ferguson and Wenger have done it without artificial support while building a club.

It takes stragic building, talented management and the right choice of player sales in my opinion, it’s very difficult though.
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PSV won the League year after year, despite selling their best players.

Marcel totes got ALL diss.
 
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