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John Stones

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bluestevon said:
His position is cb mate, you [Poor language removed] his positioning off all the time, yet then reckon he's like Carrick, a player whose biggest strength is being great positionally.

As for guardiola, great offensive manager, but when you manage bayern and barca with the quality they have going forward, you can get away with bravo and cbs like mascherano. Mascherano playing cb in this league would be all over the shop.
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Carrick would be appalling at CB too. That's why he isn't played there. Stones's communication is the key as to why he's so ridiculously poor for a CB at such a high profile club. There's nothing wrong with that, it's his co-ordination with team mates. That can and does prove costly in the final third.

Push him further forward as a sweeper in front of the defence and with cover behind him and that's his position. The lad is aggressive enough for CM and he has the passing to make a big impact. But he should never be left with space between himself and the goal. NEVER.
 
bluestevon said:
Guardiola is the manager who rates keepers primarily on their distribution rather than ability to save, claim balls etc mate, as a coach he isn't someone I'd say has any particular rep for creating exceptional defenders more that his teams are that overpowering going forward that no one has the ball enough to test them.

Stones from 19-20 under a top class manager who knows how to mould defenders would have been a cracking player. He's regressed every season on his defending.
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Including this season.

And there is no more higher class manager than the one he is under now.

IMO Stones was ill advised leaving here thus summer because I think we can both agree Ronald Koeman would be the perfect mentor for an aspiring top class centre back.
 
The Cowboy said:
That's all well and good, but pretty much every criticism stems from fundamental mistakes and errors purely of his own volition.

4th goal v Everton: dawdles, inviting pressure upon himself. Had he cleared that ball straight away, there'd have been no goal.

1st goal last night: inexplicably steps out of defence, then changes his mind too late, leaving Falcao was in front of the other defender. Correctly positioned, he'd easily have cut out that cross.

3rd goal last night: self-explanatory. Totally muscled off the ball, then lunged in instead of staying on his feet and trying to force Falcao into a speculative shot.

So even the greatest defender in the world alongside him would've have prevented any of them goals.
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Omg. 4th goal against Everton he doesn't dawdle, he takes a step back to get a bigger swing at the ball. He should've clearedit better but the way it fell was just bad luck.

And im not letting the 1st goal being his fault thing go unchallenged lest it become accepted as fact just by repetition. He steps up but steps back before the cross is made. By the time the ball comes in he's exactly where he should be. Sagna, who was about two inches from Falcao, couldn't cut out the cross. lol lol

He wasn't marking the winger nor the guy who scored but he's to blame for the goal because he was momentarily slightly out of position!I swear this site has its moments!

3rd goal last night wouldn't have been scored against Ferdinand but even defenders like Terry, Vidic, Jagielka struggled in those sorts of 1 on 1 scenarios. He was massively let down by his teammates for that goal.
 

Steve0 said:
Omg. 4th goal against Everton he doesn't dawdle, he takes a step back to get a bigger swing at the ball. He should've clearedit better but the way it fell was just bad luck.

And im not letting the 1st goal being his fault thing go unchallenged lest it become accepted as fact just by repetition. He steps up but steps back before the cross is made. By the time the ball comes in he's exactly where he should be. Sagna, who was about two inches from Falcao, couldn't cut out the cross. lol lol

He wasn't marking the winger nor the guy who scored but he's to blame for the goal because he was momentarily slightly out of position!I swear this site has its moments!

3rd goal last night wouldn't have been scored against Ferdinand but even defenders like Terry, Vidic, Jagielka struggled in those sorts of 1 on 1 scenarios. He was massively let down by his teammates for that goal.
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Alright John's dad.
 
davek said:
Carrick would be appalling at CB too. That's why he isn't played there. Stones's communication is the key as to why he's so ridiculously poor for a CB at such a high profile club. There's nothing wrong with that, it's his co-ordination with team mates. That can and does prove costly in the final third.

Push him further forward as a sweeper in front of the defence and with cover behind him and that's his position. The lad is aggressive enough for CM and he has the passing to make a big impact. But he should never be left with space between himself and the goal. NEVER.
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Give pep a ring mate, sure he'd appreciate your observations and take your advice.

Alternatively though, why buy a player who was regarded as possibly the best ball playing centre half since ferdinand that England's produced and turn him into a so so midfielder?

As a centre back he's very good on the ball and a very good passer, as a centre mid he'd just be ok, nothing special, because there are lots and lots of good passers around in midfield mate.
 
Khalekan said:
Including this season.

And there is no more higher class manager than the one he is under now.

IMO Stones was ill advised leaving here thus summer because I think we can both agree Ronald Koeman would be the perfect mentor for an aspiring top class centre back.
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Koe man would have been perfect for him, or conte for that matter, he chose the absolute worse move and manager for his development.

Oh well, we got the money and they got a player who hasn't improved them, win win really.
 
bluestevon said:
Give pep a ring mate, sure he'd appreciate your observations and take your advice.
Alternatively though, why buy a player who was regarded as possibly the best ball playing centre half since ferdinand that England's produced and turn him into a so so midfielder?
As a centre back he's very good on the ball and a very good passer, as a centre mid he'd just be ok, nothing special, because there are lots and lots of good passers around in midfield mate.
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Is this you saying that he's not the Nesta class defender you believed him to be?

Surely you cant STILL be arguing that lad is a world class defender? Incredible if so.
 
davek said:
Is this you saying that he's not the Nesta class defender you believed him to be?

Surely you cant STILL be arguing that lad is a world class defender? Incredible if so.
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No mate, looks like old Bobby wrecked him with blowing smoke up his backside and his constant praise .

Then again mate, none of the young players improved one bit the weaker parts of there game under him did they?

Lukaku s control and hold up play
Barkleys defensive ability and workrate
Deulofeus play acting and fitness of an asthmatic any.
Stones fannying around and defensive concentration.

Not a bit of improvement to any under Mr 72 points

Thankfully we actually have a manager now who realises how to improve and when to cut them loose rather than pander because he hasn't got the balls to make tough decisions.
 

2nd in the Prem, last 16 of CL, QF of FA cup(possibly). Wish we had a player as bad as him in our back four. Two of the best managers in Europe were after him so he cant be that bad. Ive said it before, Rio Ferdinand was making mistakes at the age of 22, players like Stones dont come into their prime until 26/27 when they have learnt abit about the game.
 
bluestevon said:
No mate, looks like old Bobby wrecked him with blowing smoke up his backside and his constant praise .

Then again mate, none of the young players improved one bit the weaker parts of there game under him did they?

Lukaku s control and hold up play
Barkleys defensive ability and workrate
Deulofeus play acting and fitness of an asthmatic any.
Stones fannying around and defensive concentration.

Not a bit of improvement to any under Mr 72 points

Thankfully we actually have a manager now who realises how to improve and when to cut them loose rather than pander because he hasn't got the balls to make tough decisions.
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Deflect all you want mate. The bottom line is that you believed Stones to be a world class defender, not me, and now you wont hold your hand up to it.
 
Mikey_Fitzgerald said:
They were already ruined by the previous regime (well, Jags was, Funes Mori is just pish)
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Ruined, but not before registering a 39 goals conceded season - and after the defence was completely restructured when Moyes left.

It'll be interesting to see how many goals we concede this season. 27 now, so if we keep it below another 12 that would be an achievement. I camt see it like.
 

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