2023/24 Kevin Thelwell

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lint said:
I'm going to be honest. I think the situation is dire.

We have a central midfield that is utterly reliant on a 34 year old Idrissa Gueye, with no one signed to replace Onana in the engine room, as a defensive or central midfielder.
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Can see where you're come from - but I think dire is a bit extreme, even regardless of the fact that we don't have cash to burn. I think the club knows that midfield needs a refresh, but it is hard to do that in one window. Ireogbunam has been brought in to have a season to bed in, and likewise Garner is a useful squad player. Doucoure will be dropped back to replace Onana, which frankly will suit him better - Doucoure behind the striker was always a needs must situation.

Likewise I think Gueye makes our midfield better, but I wouldn't say utterly reliant - no doubt we'll be looking to sign his replacement within the next year, but is that a priority this summer with 2 in 2 out?

lint said:
Our starting right back is either an oft injured 22 year old wingback who is defensively suspect and not favoured by our manager, or a 35 year and 39 year old, both of whom have relentlessly been the focus of (often successful) opposition attacking forays last season. I don't consider Mason Holgate an option.

We have one(!) starting quality left back, who is coming back from serious injury. Our only back up to speak of is again 39, and again an obvious weakspot for opposition sides to exploit. I don't consider Mason Holgate an option.
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I agree that our fullbacks are bad - Patterson badly needs a loan out and we need cover on loan or on the cheap/free. Seems like it will happen though in the next few weeks.

lint said:
We have a starting striker who is oft injured, rarely scores, and doesn't want to renew his soon to expire contract. We also can't seem to win without him.
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We do need to move DCL on, but it is harsh to blame the club for trying to get as much money as they can for DCL given how important he is to us - as you put it, we can't seem to win without him. He'll go late in the window a la Iwobi when it becomes apparent he won't sign a deal, and the club will have a deal lined up given its been clear he won't resign since May. Difficult to buy a striker when we have Beto and Chermiti on the books too, both of whom need minutes in the Prem to improve.

lint said:
I would have thought any funds spent would be in our obvious above positions of need, as opposed to what look to be predominantly luxury purchases to date. To not deal with these obvious midfield/defensive holes first, to me reeks of utter carelessness and irresponsibility.

There's not much point signing wingers and attacking midfielders galore if we can't win the ball in midfield, can't defend on the wings, and can't attack with width because our fullbacks are closing in on 40 and can't run or cross.
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Without points deductions, we'd have finished 12th, 2 points from a top half finish. That suggests to me that all the issues you mention in bold aren't as bad as made out.

I don't think any of the signings so far have been luxury purchases. We needed to add youth to the aging midfield as part of a gradual rebuild - we signed Ireogbunam. We were one bad CB injury last year from Keane starting every week - we've signed O'Brien. We needed to replace Onana in the midfield - we've done it with Doucoure. We needed to improve on Doucoure behind the striker this year - we've signed N'Diaye. We needed to replace Harrison - we've signed Harrison. (:D) And we desperately need attacking depth so we aren't playing the likes of Dobbin - we've signed Lindstrom on a cheap loan. All of these were obvious positions of need!
 
I know our finances are extremely limited but if you look at the top teams in other leagues like bundle they are abblr to bring in a glut of quality players for 5-20million we need to make some shrewd cheap signings and take a risk
 
Tilling said:
Can see where you're come from - but I think dire is a bit extreme, even regardless of the fact that we don't have cash to burn. I think the club knows that midfield needs a refresh, but it is hard to do that in one window. Ireogbunam has been brought in to have a season to bed in, and likewise Garner is a useful squad player. Doucoure will be dropped back to replace Onana, which frankly will suit him better - Doucoure behind the striker was always a needs must situation.

Likewise I think Gueye makes our midfield better, but I wouldn't say utterly reliant - no doubt we'll be looking to sign his replacement within the next year, but is that a priority this summer with 2 in 2 out?



I agree that our fullbacks are bad - Patterson badly needs a loan out and we need cover on loan or on the cheap/free. Seems like it will happen though in the next few weeks.



We do need to move DCL on, but it is harsh to blame the club for trying to get as much money as they can for DCL given how important he is to us - as you put it, we can't seem to win without him. He'll go late in the window a la Iwobi when it becomes apparent he won't sign a deal, and the club will have a deal lined up given its been clear he won't resign since May. Difficult to buy a striker when we have Beto and Chermiti on the books too, both of whom need minutes in the Prem to improve.



Without points deductions, we'd have finished 12th, 2 points from a top half finish. That suggests to me that all the issues you mention in bold aren't as bad as made out.

I don't think any of the signings so far have been luxury purchases. We needed to add youth to the aging midfield as part of a gradual rebuild - we signed Ireogbunam. We were one bad CB injury last year from Keane starting every week - we've signed O'Brien. We needed to replace Onana in the midfield - we've done it with Doucoure. We needed to improve on Doucoure behind the striker this year - we've signed N'Diaye. We needed to replace Harrison - we've signed Harrison. :)D) And we desperately need attacking depth so we aren't playing the likes of Dobbin - we've signed Lindstrom on a cheap loan. All of these were obvious positions of need!
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Doucoure is a Holgate accident waiting to happen he should be no where near centre of midfield
 
nevsonlymate said:
Doucoure is a Holgate accident waiting to happen he should be no where near centre of midfield
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He was signed for the club off of the back of him playing midfield where he did well for Watford over a good period. I don't love a Doucoure - Gueye partnership in midfield but comparing Doucoure to Holgate is wild. I'd like us to bring in another midfielder - but I can see why the club have prioritised the deals that they have.
 
Tilling said:
He was signed for the club off of the back of him playing midfield where he did well for Watford over a good period. I don't love a Doucoure - Gueye partnership in midfield but comparing Doucoure to Holgate is wild. I'd like us to bring in another midfielder - but I can see why the club have prioritised the deals that they have.
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He cant trap a bag of sand and his passing is woeful he needs to stay as far away of the centre of midfield as possible , he would be like Holgate you are just expecting a switch off resulting in a goal, let him run around further up the pitch and agreed we need another centre of midfield player as Gueye wont last the full season without injury
 

Blue Smoke said:
He was never going to address all the issues we have because there are so many problem areas to fill.
We either had to buy lots of bargains to fill all slots, which would have underwhelmed most people, or sell branthwaite as well as onana to buy half decent players for all those positions. Branthwaite's rightful price tag was not met, and tbh it gives me comfort knowing that we keep the core strength at the back with him in it.
We cant have it all ways guys. Just have to accept it
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ToffeeScot said:
Boyland in his article this morning states that the club feels confident with the full back positions because we have Coleman, Patto, Myko, Young and then Garner/McNeil who can cover if need be. Quite depressing if so because there may be quantity but a severe lack of quality and reliability.
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I think its clear that Thelwell hws gone for what he has seen as bargains in key areas that needed improvement.

If it was me, I'd have focused on getting Gnonto & Asprilla over the line. That way, at least those two positions are covered long term. Even if just one of them and a top young right back at least two positions ticked off.

I also agree with the Iroegbunam & O'Brien signings. I think if we could have signed those 4 id be very excited and optimistic for the new season...

But, Harrison is poor, Ndiaye and Lindstrom are totally unproven. Theres no guarantees they wont be Beto level.

Really would have been nice to have gotten Gnonto and Asprilla.

Tilling said:
Just figured I'd flag - the main reason for this is that Lyon's finances in a bad way; Goldman Sachs were involved in refinancing their debt about 6 months-ish when John Textor (a name I'm sure is now familiar to Blues) took over.

They also didn't have what we have, ie;- many high value assets that could be sold on - so much so that they've sold their very successful womens team. O'Brien is one of those, hence why they've let him go for less than he could be worth
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Toffe3m4n said:
Noticed prior to the sale that a lot of Lyon fans expected him to go for well in excess of £20m. £17m really surprised them.
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The media were touting him at £25mil. £17mil surprised me.
 
Zatara said:
I think its clear that Thelwell hws gone for what he has seen as bargains in key areas that needed improvement.

If it was me, I'd have focused on getting Gnonto & Asprilla over the line. That way, at least those two positions are covered long term. Even if just one of them and a top young right back at least two positions ticked off.

I also agree with the Iroegbunam & O'Brien signings. I think if we could have signed those 4 id be very excited and optimistic for the new season...

But, Harrison is poor, Ndiaye and Lindstrom are totally unproven. Theres no guarantees they wont be Beto level.

Really would have been nice to have gotten Gnonto and Asprilla.
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I don't think Gnonto and Asprilla was ever going to be realistic - Gnonto we want to play hard ball with, Asprilla has a whole raft of suitors to choose from. I think N'Diaye is the better player currently, was cheaper, is the better fit stylistically - I think it was the right call but only time will tell. I think N'Diaye is equally as unproven as Gnonto & Asprilla.

Harrison is fine. Lindstrom will probably be okay but again is a better fit stylistically than Danjuma ever was, which was very much a "he's available for this early because we've already done the groundwork" deal. I'm pretty happy all things considered - if the Friedkin hadn't collapsed, we'd be further along with other targets no doubt.

My biggest fear by far is that we get forced into a corner on a really cheap deal on deadline day for DCL, and then don't adequately replace him. Hard to say if its a successful window without knowing the outcome on that one!
 


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