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Manchester United

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catcherintherye said:
I don't think theres any disagreement that it's wrong at all mate. We can both agree that sports and politics (or at least, reactionary, despotic politics) shouldn't mix. I just think there are hard lines to draw.

I know I keep saying it, but the lines are blurred. Fine Abramovich and Usmanov have not as yet started trying to wield influence in an explicit way, but have they done so in an implicit way? Would they be prepared to moving forward? Maybe?

Likewise, why do you think say Standard Chartered, who are up for illegal money laundering charges (and essentially facilitating very crooked people and occurences allegedly) sponsor Liverpool? Or Nike who have a reputation for allegedly using child labour in sweatshops pay for these high profile sponsorships? Or Vodaphone with United, who were avoiding taxation and mining parts for phones in dubious ways (allegedly)?

I think it's a very hard line to draw, to say some of the above is acceptable, and others is unnaceptable.

I'll tell you a story, a couple of years ago I went travelling around Eastern Europe. Stayed with a couple of fellas and we spoke about the Old Soviet Union. And I said about the horror stories, the totalitarianism, the spying etc. They said they were brought up with the brutality of the west, the factories we ran where children had their arms pulled off in dodgy machinery. The police attacking and killing working people protesting for the rght to a vote. The cramped, inhumane conditions we lived in. It kind of hit me, that these things around morality are quite complex, and we are quite conditioned to view wrongdoing as something other people do, while we are taught to essentially ignore wrongdoing in our society (or at least give it a different label).

If Sheikh Monsour was seen smiling and giving sports jerseys to a tyrant of a leader who tried to over throw democracy, I don't think we would be defending this on the basis of what one of his newspapers may or may not have said. I'm not saying you're wrong, but we are all part of this conditioning.

As for Mansour, I am not sure anybody with that level of wealth is merely there just because of being a talented businessman. Connections, cronyism, nepotism etc are all at play. I'm sure they are for him. It's also true of this country and America too though. Rich people, meet other rich people and find ways to help each other screw everyone over. I don't think it's just a Middle East issue, thats all.

So I'm in favour of calling it out, but to me it should all be called out. Whether it is leading businesses who have close ties to the government here (or the government itself) or the governments in the middle east. It's all very murky.
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That's what private education is for
 
stony said:
People seem to forget that until football clubs went public, every single club in this country was run the same way. The so called sugar daddy model. Making a profit was the last thing on peoples minds. It was all about the trophies. That wasn't that long ago. These days certain clubs have managed to convince the fans to celebrate balance sheets and profits and pour scorn on those clubs who think trophies and winning are more important than paying out dividends to shareholders.
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Ego trips by local business men, it's just there's more Noughts on the cheques now
 
The way they treated their players who survived Munich was unforgivable. As a result I find it hard to enjoy any documentary/movie about their history, especially a tragedy.
 

Poor today no cutting edge , think all the baskets now in the Europa League , some good build up play but no end product , James today very poor again
 
A crazy game tonight , roma were very poor but so were we in some patches but a good comeback surely we can make the final now , if we get there in Gdansk im not sure who i would prefer in the final , pogba played really well tonight
 

The gulf in quality between this and the Champions League just simply shown itself this week. Man United were always going to win this as soon as Leipzig dumped them out of the one that matters. The cost to construct that team is like three times more, or maybe an awful lot more than anyone else in the competition.

This competition is their comfort zone, none of the teams they played to get to the final are nowhere good enough to make the top half of the Premier League, even AC Milan by the time United played them were going through a huge slump which currently sees them in 5th. They were top of Serie A for ages and unbeaten at one point.

A few seasons ago, a Russian team who only won one match all season in their league, got to the quarter finals of the Europa. This simply sums up how weak the competition is.

United are lucky Sevilla stayed in the Champions League and made it through their group instead of finishing third.
 
Winning a cup that you only entered as you failed to progress from the group stages of the UCL, is not great success for a club like United.

If you finish third or fourth in your group, you’re out of Europe altogether. That’s how it should be.
 

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