2019/20 Marcel Brands

[canuckblue]

He's had no impact. He's done what he's supposed to do in the summer - now we wait and see if it has impact. If the players do well, he;s had impact; if they aren't all that = less than no impact.

The manager is top dog at any club. The industry might change but that is an unalterable truth.

If the industry changes, then it's no longer an unalterable truth. And I believe it is changing. It's becoming more like North American pro sports, where there's a general manager (or DoF) who oversees all of the day-to-day business of running a team, including player transactions, farm system (or the youth sides in football) and -- usually -- the hiring/firing of coaches (there are rare occasions when the GMgets fired or both get sacked at the same time). The coach (or manager in footy) simply coaches the team. And FWIW, I have a feeling the owner is the top dog at any club
But as far as Brands is concerned, I think he's done well in dispelling any chance the media had of putting their own spin on our operations while at the same time selling the club to potential signings in the future. He's said what he has had to say and now I think you'll see him step back -- he's already hinted as such with his statement that he'll be turning his attention to the youth sides.

 

[SerenityNigh]

Just to confirm, if things go wrong are we absolving Brands of all blame because he’s just a pen pusher doing a menial office job and placing it on Silva because he’s the big boss?

Yes

 

[canuckblue]

Have to agree, the manager is the most important person at the club and should be the public face. In essence he is taking all the risks and is the low hanging fruit. If it turns sour by Xmas he will be ultimately held responsible.

It’s important to question there things, let’s be honest there was similar euphoria and similar anointing of Walsh at this time last year. A year on we are all wiser. Ultimately if Brands signings proves poor he will be as demonized as he is people treating him like a Demigod at the moment. Those defending him here will as quickly and vocally turn on him.

I don’t understand why it has to be all or nothing here, you can like what Brands did in the market and still think giving this interview was crass and self serving. No body is perfect.

Given our expierence thus far with the DOF model, it’s healthy to be questioning and suspicious of any DOF.

Pretty small sample size, there, Neiler. And even you have to admit the quality of signings Brands has brought in -- even if only on paper at the moment -- are considerably more reason for optimism that what Walsh managed.

 

[davek]

Have to agree, the manager is the most important person at the club and should be the public face. In essence he is taking all the risks and is the low hanging fruit. If it turns sour by Xmas he will be ultimately held responsible. It’s important to question there things, let’s be honest there was similar euphoria and similar anointing of Walsh at this time last year. A year on we are all wiser. Ultimately if Brands signings prove poor he will be as demonsised as he is people treating him like a Demigod at the moment. Those defending him here will as quickly and vocally turn on him.
I don’t understand why it has to be all or nothing here, you can like what he Brands did in the market and still think giving this interview was crass, self serving. No body is perfect.

Given our expierence thus farsighted the DOF model, it’s healthy to be questioning and suspicious of any DOF.

It's misguided hero-worship. Some people need a figure they can identify with and to place all their hopes on. Why they've settled on Brands I have no idea. It's usually a manager placed in that position. A DoF is a facilitator. They dont create the magic on the pitch. They're there to lend a hand in that process by providing raw material.

I just see it as strange.

The big issue for me is that we have a new manager who is yet to carve out his own identity as the leader of the club...which is what he is. It doesn't help that he's seeing the feller there to help him out trying to create their own identity in the full glare of the media. That's just confusing for players and fans alike.

Step aside Mr Brands. You have what should be the unseen and unglamorous task of sorting out the financial mess left by Koeman as it affects present squad staffing to do. Please do it and vacate the stage.

 

[davek]

You are wrong

At no football club in the world is that "wrong".

 

[Neiler]

Pretty small sample size, there, Neiler. And even you have to admit the quality of signings Brands has brought in -- even if only on paper at the moment -- are considerably more reason for optimism that what Walsh managed.

True but a lot of blood letting too that effected the welfare of the club within the model, it’s important to question the role given the impact and damage it’s had.

On paper certainly I’ve no complaints, I don’t like the buyback clause in the Mina deal personally as I’ve said. That said on paper last year we were in the same place with the same hope, excitement and expectation. It’s important to reserve judgement and assessment based on the lessons we learned from last summer in what at the time looked good on paper.

I actually think the jury is out on Walsh to an extent, I think there could be a couple of canny signing he made for the club that might prove more then worthwhile. Now don’t get me wrong our business last year was poor governance and basket case administration. But I think Walsh did some decent work with outgoing and brininging s couple of decent young players that will help us get out of the hole we are in. But his overall performence was weak.

 

[davek]

If the industry changes, then it's no longer an unalterable truth. And I believe it is changing. It's becoming more like North American pro sports, where there's a general manager (or DoF) who oversees all of the day-to-day business of running a team, including player transactions, farm system (or the youth sides in football) and -- usually -- the hiring/firing of coaches (there are rare occasions when the GMgets fired or both get sacked at the same time). The coach (or manager in footy) simply coaches the team. And FWIW, I have a feeling the owner is the top dog at any club
But as far as Brands is concerned, I think he's done well in dispelling any chance the media had of putting their own spin on our operations while at the same time selling the club to potential signings in the future. He's said what he has had to say and now I think you'll see him step back -- he's already hinted as such with his statement that he'll be turning his attention to the youth sides.

Who's more important at the New England Patriots: Bill Belichik or the Patriots' GM?

 

[Brisan123]

At no football club in the world is that "wrong".

Managers in the sense you are talking about are no more
Coaches run the first team and other people look after all other aspects of the team
Even Jose said as much in the last couple of days.
Too much money involved to let one man run the show

 

[canuckblue]

I think this needs a poll -- those who have no problem with Brands talking and those who do.

It's misguided hero-worship. Some people need a figure they can identify with and to place all their hopes on. Why they've settled on Brands I have no idea. It's usually a manager placed in that position. A DoF is a facilitator. They dont create the magic on the pitch. They're there to lend a hand in that process by providing raw material.

I just see it as strange.

The big issue for me is that we have a new manager who is yet to carve out his own identity as the leader of the club...which is what he is. It doesn't help that he's seeing the feller there to help him out trying to create their own identity in the full glare of the media. That's just confusing for players and fans alike.

Step aside Mr Brands. You have what should be the unseen and unglamorous task of sorting out the financial mess left by Koeman as it affects present squad staffing to do. Please do it and vacate the stage.

1. Maybe it's the fact he was the architect of the deals this window and we want to give him the credit he's due (for the moment, anyway).
2. Pretty sure Brands already had created his own identity through his work with PSV -- otherwise, how would we have thought to get him here? And maybe he's indirectly giving Silva some shelter from the microscope and allowing him to focus on his main task -- managing the team.
3. I'm not confused and I daresay the players and a majority of the fans aren't, either.

 

[canuckblue]

Who's more important at the New England Patriots: Bill Belichik or the Patriots' GM?

Robert Kraft. Incidentally, there is no GM with the Patriots as Belichick has almost total control of the team's football operations. So that kind of makes your example specious.

 

[davek]

Managers in the sense you are talking about are no more
Coaches run the first team and other people look after all other aspects of the team
Even Jose said as much in the last couple of days.
Too much money involved to let one man run the show

...and while playing football with a first team remains the most important function of a football club that makes the manager THE most important man in the place.

The hero worship of a suit is ridiculous. We'll be hearing that Fred the Doorman runs the club next.

Still, I can see why you'd think the DoF is as important if not more important here at Everton now, because we've seen the self promotion of Brands since he arrived here.

 

[canuckblue]

True but a lot of blood letting too that effected the welfare of the club within the model, it’s important to question the role given the impact and damage it’s had.

On paper certainly I’ve no complaints, I don’t like the buyback clause in the Mina deal personally as I’ve said. That said on paper last year we were in the same place with the same hope, excitement and expectation. It’s important to reserve judgement and assessment based on the lessons we learned from last summer in what at the time looked good on paper.

I actually think the jury is out on Walsh to an extent, I think there could be a couple of canny signing he made for the club that might prove more then worthwhile. Now don’t get me wrong our business last year was poor governance and basket case administration. But I think Walsh did some decent work with outgoing and brininging s couple of decent young players that will help us get out of the over all we are in. But his overall performence was weak.

Once bitten, twice shy. I can appreciate that.

 

[Neiler]

It's misguided hero-worship. Some people need a figure they can identify with and to place all their hopes on. Why they've settled on Brands I have no idea. It's usually a manager placed in that position. A DoF is a facilitator. They dont create the magic on the pitch. They're there to lend a hand in that process by providing raw material.

I just see it as strange.

The big issue for me is that we have a new manager who is yet to carve out his own identity as the leader of the club...which is what he is. It doesn't help that he's seeing the feller there to help him out trying to create their own identity in the full glare of the media. That's just confusing for players and fans alike.

Step aside Mr Brands. You have what should be the unseen and unglamorous task of sorting out the financial mess left by Koeman as it affects present squad staffing to do. Please do it and vacate the stage.

I have to agree. I’m more excited by Silva and his development then Brands. It does seem a bit cultish. I’ve no arguement with anything he has done so far with recruitment or turnover in the first team. Don’t get me wrong i want him to be what others are currently advocating he is but it would be fool hearty at this point to say he’s been brilliant. We’ve got a 2.2 draw at Wolves thus far. The players mightened work out etc. it seems we’ve learned zero from being in the exact same spot last year with the same hopes and expectations. It’s a wait and see.

I agree, I question why he is front of the shop here. Why does he have to have a media profile? Doesn’t make sense to me, but maybe I’m tradititional. Either way I didn’t like his I’m the hero approach and name dropping Utd and Barca in I would assume are ethical negotiations, that won’t be appreciated by either club and I would assume be taken note of by the wider footballing community.

One thing I did notice in the windo was 0 recruitment at underage, which is a departure for us.

 

[davek]

I think this needs a poll -- those who have no problem with Brands talking and those who do.


1. Maybe it's the fact he was the architect of the deals this window and we want to give him the credit he's due (for the moment, anyway).
2. Pretty sure Brands already had created his own identity through his work with PSV -- otherwise, how would we have thought to get him here? And maybe he's indirectly giving Silva some shelter from the microscope and allowing him to focus on his main task -- managing the team.
3. I'm not confused and I daresay the players and a majority of the fans aren't, either.

Well it'll need to settle down then. Maybe he was allowed to walk all over Cocu and he feels like he can do that here? There is a vastly different culture in this country regarding that sort of thing though. The manager is sovereign. End of story.

 

[canuckblue]

Well it'll need to settle down then. Maybe he was allowed to walk all over Cocu and he feels like he can do that here? There is a vastly different culture in this country regarding that sort of thing though. The manager is sovereign. End of story.

In your opinion.