2020/21 Marcel Brands

[Kev The Rat]

is this clown out the door in June or is he going to leech off King Carlo's achievements and bag himself a new deal?

 

[Zatara]

Jug Head doesn't do January's.

Fortunately Carlo does, so we should be ok.

Who has Ancelotti signed in Januarys dave?

 

[mill]

Its absolutely beyond me how posters cant see that when on form Mina is a far better player than Keane. Its not even a contest.

Mina does tend to pick up more injuries and seems ungainly so perhaps thats why?

Also, Ancelottis first choice was initially Mina + Holgate until the injuries and then Keane and Branthwaite came in...

...Keane has done very well but hes never going to be anything more than what he is, a reactionary defender in a deep defence. Very much an Italian defender though...without any snide lol

The extension he signed was something bizarre to me and i hope its so we get a good fee for him.

If Tarkowski at Burnley was subject of a £31mil offer from West Ham then I think we would get at least that for Keane or Mina...

I actually think that if we get favourable draws in the FA Cup (or he has a successful loan) then Branthwaite will push out Keane sometime next season.

With Mina's injuries id even look to move both of them on and sign a truly top class centre back in the summer. Unless Mina can keep this form going over the rest of the season and steer clear of injuries.

mina has shown nothing to suggest hes better than Keane. He’s marginally faster and a bit taller. But his distribution isn’t as good and he’s not as good at heading.

 

[Zatara]

mina has shown nothing to suggest hes better than Keane. He’s marginally faster and a bit taller. But his distribution isn’t as good and he’s not as good at heading.

Havent checked recently but just before this run he was statistically way higher than Keane on headers won.

His ungainly frame masks his abilities but also his snide. Hes a winner who puts his body on the line...

Keane to me is a reactive defender with limited ability.

Has done well this season though in his favoured deep defence.

 

[mill]

Havent checked recently but just before this run he was statistically way higher than Keane on headers won.

His ungainly frame masks his abilities but also his snide. Hes a winner who puts his body on the line...

Keane to me is a reactive defender with limited ability.

Has done well this season though in his favoured deep defence.

Mina leads on tackles and blocks. Also on pass completion but has made 100 fewer forward passes so that’s not really a fair comparison.

everything else is Keane. Interceptions, clearances, headers, aerial battles

keane has played 2 more games though.

 

[catcherintherye]

mina has shown nothing to suggest hes better than Keane. He’s marginally faster and a bit taller. But his distribution isn’t as good and he’s not as good at heading.

I think you are both partially right,

For me Mina is better than Keane if they are both at their best, but it's not unquestionably so. I think Mina is a bit quicker, a bit stronger and probably slightly better in the air. Keane reads the game better, and though Mina is a bit underrated on the ball Keane is superior in that area.

The big difference thus far has been Keane has been a lot more consistent. He is injured less and has less bad games now.

On the positive though, they look to have formed a very strong partnership over the last 6 games or so. I think it's 3 goals in 6 games in that time. 2long range efforts and a penalty. It's 1 goal in the last 4 games 88 minutes as well (the penalty). They have played a varierty of strikers in that time; power and height (Wood), pace (Nketiah), Power (Giroud),, movement (Vardy) and last night a mixture of Brewster/Mcgoldrick/Mcburnie. None of them have had any change out of Mina/Keane.

So it's a real positive for me and it's putting to bed the idea they can't play together. We've probably lacked an effective partnership at the back for some time, so if we can get one to be developed, that would be fantastic.

 

[mill]

I think you are both partially right,

For me Mina is better than Keane if they are both at their best, but it's not unquestionably so. I think Mina is a bit quicker, a bit stronger and probably slightly better in the air. Keane reads the game better, and though Mina is a bit underrated on the ball Keane is superior in that area.

The big difference thus far has been Keane has been a lot more consistent. He is injured less and has less bad games now.

On the positive though, they look to have formed a very strong partnership over the last 6 games or so. I think it's 3 goals in 6 games in that time. 2long range efforts and a penalty. It's 1 goal in the last 4 games 88 minutes as well (the penalty). They have played a varierty of strikers in that time; power and height (Wood), pace (Nketiah), Power (Giroud),, movement (Vardy) and last night a mixture of Brewster/Mcgoldrick/Mcburnie. None of them have had any change out of Mina/Keane.

So it's a real positive for me and it's putting to bed the idea they can't play together. We've probably lacked an effective partnership at the back for some time, so if we can get one to be developed, that would be fantastic.

Completely agree. And with the likes of holgate and Godfrey, it kinda feels like we are looking good in that area. they all complement each other quite well.

 

[catcherintherye]

Completely agree. And with the likes of holgate and Godfrey, it kinda feels like we are looking good in that area. they all complement each other quite well.

To be honest we are really well set in that area, especially when you throw in Brainthwaite behind.

Godfrey and particularly Holgate are very different types of CB and I thought Holgate was excellent when he moved infield yesterday. Godfrey I'd say has world class potential. But right now just keep the 4 of them going as much as possible, we look as solid as we've been for years.

 

[Zatara]

Mina leads on tackles and blocks. Also on pass completion but has made 100 fewer forward passes so that’s not really a fair comparison.

everything else is Keane. Interceptions, clearances, headers, aerial battles

keane has played 2 more games though.

For the areas Keane is superior in, which nunbers are they based upon? Success % or the amount?

No getting away from Mina being out of form (coming back from injury) earlier in the season. Though that may slant the stats.

My point was about the superior player "on form" and on form Mina has pretty much everything you want from a centre back as an all rounder.

I doubt either of them would be in any 'teams of the season'. Weve seen alot more of Keane than Mina (signed later + injuries) and i think we all know what we have with Keane.

With Mina, if he keeps this level for the rest of the season then he'll be taking alot of praise...whether he can, thats another story.

If West Ham offered Burnley £31mil for Tarkowski then id happily take £62mil for both Mina + Keane and go and sign a star centre back to play alongside Godfrey, Holgate or Branthwaite.

If were aiming to become a top 4 side then we need to be going after the best, like Skriniar, Romagnoli, Marquinhos or the up and coming with world class potential like Upamecano, Konate, Bastoni and a little younger, Badiashile.

Im a big fan of Mina but neither him nor Keane are comparable to Bastoni for example...

Weve seen how the RS bought VVD and went up a level and we should be looking to do the same.

 

[Goat]

For the areas Keane is superior in, which nunbers are they based upon? Success % or the amount?

No getting away from Mina being out of form (coming back from injury) earlier in the season. Though that may slant the stats.

My point was about the superior player "on form" and on form Mina has pretty much everything you want from a centre back as an all rounder.

I doubt either of them would be in any 'teams of the season'. Weve seen alot more of Keane than Mina (signed later + injuries) and i think we all know what we have with Keane.

With Mina, if he keeps this level for the rest of the season then he'll be taking alot of praise...whether he can, thats another story.

If West Ham offered Burnley £31mil for Tarkowski then id happily take £62mil for both Mina + Keane and go and sign a star centre back to play alongside Godfrey, Holgate or Branthwaite.

If were aiming to become a top 4 side then we need to be going after the best, like Skriniar, Romagnoli, Marquinhos or the up and coming with world class potential like Upamecano, Konate, Bastoni and a little younger, Badiashile.

Im a big fan of Mina but neither him nor Keane are comparable to Bastoni for example...

Weve seen how the RS bought VVD and went up a level and we should be looking to do the same.

We have 4 very good CBs.

Why do we need any of the Garbo you just named?

 

[Zatara]

I think you are both partially right,

For me Mina is better than Keane if they are both at their best, but it's not unquestionably so. I think Mina is a bit quicker, a bit stronger and probably slightly better in the air. Keane reads the game better, and though Mina is a bit underrated on the ball Keane is superior in that area.

The big difference thus far has been Keane has been a lot more consistent. He is injured less and has less bad games now.

On the positive though, they look to have formed a very strong partnership over the last 6 games or so. I think it's 3 goals in 6 games in that time. 2long range efforts and a penalty. It's 1 goal in the last 4 games 88 minutes as well (the penalty). They have played a varierty of strikers in that time; power and height (Wood), pace (Nketiah), Power (Giroud),, movement (Vardy) and last night a mixture of Brewster/Mcgoldrick/Mcburnie. None of them have had any change out of Mina/Keane.

So it's a real positive for me and it's putting to bed the idea they can't play together. We've probably lacked an effective partnership at the back for some time, so if we can get one to be developed, that would be fantastic.

Completely agree. And with the likes of holgate and Godfrey, it kinda feels like we are looking good in that area. they all complement each other quite well.

Cant argue with Catcher here.

The thing is, of the centre backs Godfrey and Branthwaite were signed by Brands under Ancelottis management. Mina by Brands under Silva (different style of play) Keane by Walsh/Koeman and Holgate as a youngster.

Its probably too soon for us to know exactly what type of CB and CB partnership Ancelotti prefers.

One thing though, its great to mention this season and the run of games with Keane and Mina together...and the start of the season. But lets not discount two things...

1: We were recently conceding 2 goals a game and looked a defensive shambles.

2: Weve gone deep where both Mina and Keane have had protection from Godfrey and Holgate.

Theres no doubt we are masking their weaknesses in this setup. If this is the way Ancelotti wants to continue to play over the forthcoming seasons then thats fine...

...if we want to be more expansive and on the front foot then we should be looking at upgrading with one player for the money from both being sold.

To be honest we are really well set in that area, especially when you throw in Brainthwaite behind.

Godfrey and particularly Holgate are very different types of CB and I thought Holgate was excellent when he moved infield yesterday. Godfrey I'd say has world class potential. But right now just keep the 4 of them going as much as possible, we look as solid as we've been for years.

I mentioned about Godfrey a couple of weeks ago...world class potential.

Im excited to see how he does at centre back.

Unlike some (maybe most) posters, i dont mind playing like the old italian 90s teams and building a really strong defence (and defensive midfield) before adding some flair...

Godfrey definitely has the attributes needed to get to the top and its amazing how Brands has picked him out for us really...

Funny weve not had him at CB in a back 4 and im raving about him lol

 

[Zatara]

We have 4 very good CBs.

Why do we need any of the Garbo you just named?

If we went back to 2 real full backs, would you say that a combination of Keane, Mina, Godfrey and Holgate is going to be able to be the foundation to consistently be in the top 4?

Then if we got top 4 would they be able to carry us into the latter rounds of the champions league?

Because thats where Ancelotti is at home.

 

[Goat]

If we went back to 2 real full backs, would you say that a combination of Keane, Mina, Godfrey and Holgate is going to be able to be the foundation to consistently be in the top 4?

Then if we got top 4 would they be able to carry us into the latter rounds of the champions league?

Because thats where Ancelotti is at home.

We are in the top 4 Zat, do they not have League Tables over there?

Leave the CBs alone, we are fine there, not saying we have 4 World Class Cbs, but we have 4 very good 1s.

Focus our money in areas that need improvement.

 

[Zatara]

We are in the top 4 Zat, do they not have League Tables over there?

Leave the CBs alone, we are fine there, not saying we have 4 World Class Cbs, but we have 4 very good 1s.

Focus our money in areas that need improvement.

Well you either want to be aiming for the best or you dont.

Without the full back protection then were going to have problems unless a super DM comes in.

By the end of the season im positive that Godfrey will have cemented himself as first choice CB....i believe you would pair him with Keane?

One of Godfreys main attributes is pace and athleticism...he would be ideal playing a high line. However, thats Keanes undoing as hes a massive liability unless in a deep defence.

As for the thread were in, I imagine Brands will be speaking with Ancelotti and looking for the following:


Right back
Defensive midfielder
Right forward

Then depending on Kean, a centre forward.

I certainly wouldnt discount us moving one of Mina or Keane on though in the summer...both at a profit.

 

[Goat]

Well you either want to be aiming for the best or you dont.

Without the full back protection then were going to have problems unless a super DM comes in.

By the end of the season im positive that Godfrey will have cemented himself as first choice CB....i believe you would pair him with Keane?

One of Godfreys main attributes is pace and athleticism...he would be ideal playing a high line. However, thats Keanes undoing as hes a massive liability unless in a deep defence.

As for the thread were in, I imagine Brands will be speaking with Ancelotti and looking for the following:


Right back
Defensive midfielder
Right forward

Then depending on Kean, a centre forward.

I certainly wouldnt discount us moving one of Mina or Keane on though in the summer...both at a profit.

Doubt Keane is going anywhere, Carlo loves him and is without question his first choice.

As for outgoings for players that we would want to keep, like Mina, it will depend on where we finish really.

No European football and a few might be looking for an escape.