2018/19 Morgan Schneiderlin

[LouReedwalkonthewildside]

I'd like to know his reasoning for getting himself sent off against Lyon.


Couldn't care less about the arsing around him and Mirallas did on the training ground.

Because he's a bad coward mate.

 

[efcjames]

When he does try he can be a very good player, so let’s just hope he sticks to his words

 

[Blue Roo]

Don't agree sorry. The statistical comparison sees Schneiderlin having the better game as well as most people's perceptions. He fared better than Davies on interceptions, clearances, aerial duels won, free kicks won, number of passes made, passing accuracy, number of times dispossessed and number of long passes completed. He was equal on bad touches, tackles made and key passes.

Schneiderlin is not, and never has been, a world beater. What he is, is a relatively good player who keeps the ball moving, is comfortable in possession and makes a few tackles. His performances this season are pretty much what you will get from him, he's been by no means bad, but you'd like to think he'll be replaced as a starter sooner rather than later if we're serious about improving.

Damn lies and statistics!
First consider his revelation as a 28yr old professional footballer that the 2nd phase might be something he should be working on. Mindboggling.
It seems likely then that he has yet to cotton on to the fact that if you pressure the man with the ball you might actually provide an interception, turnover, handy tackle for one of your mates.
And this is the basis for the fraud - he wins the stats over Davies, but its the effort of Gueye, Davies and others that prop up his stats.
Where's the stats on the % of his interceptions, clearances etc that were created/made possible by others; and what was his alone.
And the stats for when he has created/made possible intercepts, clearances for others.
The point is he doesn't really get stuck in for the team.
If he did, dare it be said Davies (and others) would look better, well at least their stats.
But to do so, you've got to think, would just show him up for what he's not.
Cause you think if he's got it he would have laid it on by now.
What would piss me off is, if when the side starts playing better, he continues his squatter existence, and gets the plaudits along with the rest.
Aerial duels - he's taller
Free kicks one - he's better at falling over
Number of passes made/accuracy - he takes less risks
Damn lies and statistics!

 

[Blue Roo]

I agree on Davies but to be fair to Schneiderlin I think he's just one of those players who looks like that.

It happens in all sports. In cricket you get bowlers who look like they're just loosening up but then can't bowl any faster no matter how hard they're trying, you get boxers who seem to be toying with an opponent but ultimately just don't have the power to hurt them, and I've backed plenty of horses that have cantered to the front looking like they'll win by a distance only to find there's nothing in the tank when the jockey says time to go.

Schneiderlin sort of cruises round and looks composed on the ball so you think he's got plenty more to offer but in reality what he's doing is pretty much what he's capable of.

This.

 

[bluelord49]

Words, words, words, we have heard it all before .
2-3 seasons and its taken him so long to Gob off...
Sorry lads this fella will never warrant a place in a team that i would want to play for Everton Football Club.

 

[Lanolin]

Damn lies and statistics!
First consider his revelation as a 28yr old professional footballer that the 2nd phase might be something he should be working on. Mindboggling.
It seems likely then that he has yet to cotton on to the fact that if you pressure the man with the ball you might actually provide an interception, turnover, handy tackle for one of your mates.
And this is the basis for the fraud - he wins the stats over Davies, but its the effort of Gueye, Davies and others that prop up his stats.
Where's the stats on the % of his interceptions, clearances etc that were created/made possible by others; and what was his alone.
And the stats for when he has created/made possible intercepts, clearances for others.
The point is he doesn't really get stuck in for the team.
If he did, dare it be said Davies (and others) would look better, well at least their stats.
But to do so, you've got to think, would just show him up for what he's not.
Cause you think if he's got it he would have laid it on by now.
What would piss me off is, if when the side starts playing better, he continues his squatter existence, and gets the plaudits along with the rest.
Aerial duels - he's taller
Free kicks one - he's better at falling over
Number of passes made/accuracy - he takes less risks
Damn lies and statistics!

Yes but as I’ve already said, the vast majority of people at the game would have told you Schneiderlin was better on Saturday. The use of stats was just in response to someone saying that he didn’t believe that was the case. So the stats in this case aren’t misleading at all, they’re just a way of quantifying what most people perceived themselves, that Schneiderlin was more effective than Davies in that game.

Whether Davies is a better player overall is a different argument and may take a few years to answer, but in my opinion Schneiderlin has comfortably outperformed him this season, without exactly setting the world alight himself.

 

[Lanolin]

I'd like to know his reasoning for getting himself sent off against Lyon.


Couldn't care less about the arsing around him and Mirallas did on the training ground.

He pretty much tells us that in the interview? He was frustrated at having played poorly/been part of a poor team performance in a game he particularly wanted to do well in to get back in the France reckoning and so did something stupid.

It’s basically what people would call a winners mentality if we were good, but have to bend the narrative on because we’re not.

 

[Raino85]

Don't agree sorry. The statistical comparison sees Schneiderlin having the better game as well as most people's perceptions. He fared better than Davies on interceptions, clearances, aerial duels won, free kicks won, number of passes made, passing accuracy, number of times dispossessed and number of long passes completed. He was equal on bad touches, tackles made and key passes.

Schneiderlin is not, and never has been, a world beater. What he is, is a relatively good player who keeps the ball moving, is comfortable in possession and makes a few tackles. His performances this season are pretty much what you will get from him, he's been by no means bad, but you'd like to think he'll be replaced as a starter sooner rather than later if we're serious about improving.

I think you have over egged the keeping the ball moving thing a little mate, it moves, very slow, and usually sideways to the most obvious pass. But instead of shouting down anyone with a different opinion to me like most do on this forum, i will give you credit that you did your homework (i haven't bothered to check if you are right or not), but i tend to not go OTT on these sort of stats as i think Davies and Schneiderlin take completely different positions on the pitch.

I will agree im hoping Schneiderlin is replaced sooner rather than later though

 

[BigMick]

Damn lies and statistics!
First consider his revelation as a 28yr old professional footballer that the 2nd phase might be something he should be working on. Mindboggling.
It seems likely then that he has yet to cotton on to the fact that if you pressure the man with the ball you might actually provide an interception, turnover, handy tackle for one of your mates.
And this is the basis for the fraud - he wins the stats over Davies, but its the effort of Gueye, Davies and others that prop up his stats.
Where's the stats on the % of his interceptions, clearances etc that were created/made possible by others; and what was his alone.
And the stats for when he has created/made possible intercepts, clearances for others.
The point is he doesn't really get stuck in for the team.
If he did, dare it be said Davies (and others) would look better, well at least their stats.
But to do so, you've got to think, would just show him up for what he's not.
Cause you think if he's got it he would have laid it on by now.
What would piss me off is, if when the side starts playing better, he continues his squatter existence, and gets the plaudits along with the rest.
Aerial duels - he's taller
Free kicks one - he's better at falling over
Number of passes made/accuracy - he takes less risks
Damn lies and statistics!

This is so true.

 

[Lanolin]

I think you have over egged the keeping the ball moving thing a little mate, it moves, very slow, and usually sideways to the most obvious pass. But instead of shouting down anyone with a different opinion to me like most do on this forum, i will give you credit that you did your homework (i haven't bothered to check if you are right or not), but i tend to not go OTT on these sort of stats as i think Davies and Schneiderlin take completely different positions on the pitch.

I will agree im hoping Schneiderlin is replaced sooner rather than later though

The stats cover both attacking and defensive contributions though, so their role in the team shouldn’t affect them at all. Put simply, none of the people I sat near at the game, the people I went to the pub with afterwards, or the newspapers the day after, believed Davies had a better game than Schneiderlin. The stats are not the argument, they just support it.

Again, I’m no Schneiderlin fanboy and I was calling him out last season a long time before many others jumped on the bandwagon, but some of the continued stick he’s getting is unfair, and some of it is disproved by the very same stats that people would happily use to beat him with if they said what they wanted them to.

 

[Shipped]

I think I was one of his biggest fans in his first 6 months.
I thought we had a deep midfielder as good as Dembele at Spurs. A proper top 4 quality centre mid, as capable as Gareth Barry at dictating play from deep and picking forward passes but more mobile and capable of joining Gana in the press if necessary.

Now the new manager clearly wants to work with him, at least for a year, so that's a clean slate in my book and he'll receive no pelters from me.

Having said that this interview, seemingly made to clear the air with fans, does nothing of the sort for me.
He takes no responsibility at all for his performance levels last season. He could have held his hands up and said sorry, my head wasn't right but I'm in a better place now. Instead he talks about proving the fans wrong. He talks about how hurtful he finds being labelled not arsed: well if jogging back at half speed as we concede, as happened many times last season, isn't indicative of this then it's a damn fine impression.

I just don't think he gets it. He's a ridiculously talented footballer, probably top 5 in our squad for natural ability in my opinion, but that's not always enough. Sometimes you'll be under the kosh in games, the opposition will be on top and you'll be under pressure. This is where you have to work harder than the other team, even the odds with your determination, fight and desire. Whenever we needed that from Everton last year they came up short but none shorter than Schniederlin.

Like I said I'll support him this year as I will anyone in the Royal Blue. But if he's ever going to win back affection from the crowd he'll have to play as well this year as he was crap last year. He'll have to play out of his skin. The decent, just about par performances we've seen from him so far, while a welcome improvement, need to be just the start if he wants to win back Goodison's love.

 

[Raino85]

The stats cover both attacking and defensive contributions though, so their role in the team shouldn’t affect them at all. Put simply, none of the people I sat near at the game, the people I went to the pub with afterwards, or the newspapers the day after, believed Davies had a better game than Schneiderlin. The stats are not the argument, they just support it.

Again, I’m no Schneiderlin fanboy and I was calling him out last season a long time before many others jumped on the bandwagon, but some of the continued stick he’s getting is unfair, and some of it is disproved by the very same stats that people would happily use to beat him with if they said what they wanted them to.

i dont think its unfair, a few "ok" performances, does not change what happened last year!
Are his performances that much improved?
He was good against wolves, ok in 25 minutes v southampton and below par against huddersfield when he was needed and one of the senior members of a young team.
The fact Sigurdsson only made 15 passes tells you that he didnt get the ball forward to the right person enough

 

[Lanolin]

i dont think its unfair, a few "ok" performances, does not change what happened last year!
Are his performances that much improved?
He was good against wolves, ok in 25 minutes v southampton and below par against huddersfield when he was needed and one of the senior members of a young team.
The fact Sigurdsson only made 15 passes tells you that he didnt get the ball forward to the right person enough

It tells me that Sigurdsson doesn't do enough to get himself on the ball, as has been pointed out by many on here many times.

What I mean by unfair is the type of thing you've done there. Suddenly the goalposts have moved, at first we were talking about him not playing as well as Davies, then when that gets debunked we say the stats don't tell the story, I refute that and so now he's in a young team - not really like, I reckon there were about 300 senior caps in our starting XI, which probably had a similar age profile to our opponents and a lot more top level experience - and he's not getting the ball forward to the right people. We can't risk saying he didn't pass it forward enough because that can be refuted with facts, so we have to put the completely unquantifiable 'right people' bit in just to make sure that the argument holds up. It's unfair because some people are just unwilling to say 'he did alright to be fair'.

Have his performances been great? No, I've said that loads of times. Have they been bad? Absolutely not, no. He's been fine this season, a functioning member of the team who has played reasonably well. He won't suddenly start spraying defence splitting balls all over the gaff or dribbling past people because he hasn't got it in his locker. What he can do, and has been doing, is offer a relatively stable presence in the middle of the pitch, moving the ball around and being a shield.

We've got people saying Tosun can't be criticised at all because he's got two assists playing up front, but Schneiderlin's fair game despite having one assist from defensive midfield, in a game and a half less. Neither of them have been, or ever will be, brilliant in my opinion, but they've both played at about the same level I reckon.

 

[Raino85]

It tells me that Sigurdsson doesn't do enough to get himself on the ball, as has been pointed out by many on here many times.

What I mean by unfair is the type of thing you've done there. Suddenly the goalposts have moved, at first we were talking about him not playing as well as Davies, then when that gets debunked we say the stats don't tell the story, I refute that and so now he's in a young team - not really like, I reckon there were about 300 senior caps in our starting XI, which probably had a similar age profile to our opponents and a lot more top level experience - and he's not getting the ball forward to the right people. We can't risk saying he didn't pass it forward enough because that can be refuted with facts, so we have to put the completely unquantifiable 'right people' bit in just to make sure that the argument holds up. It's unfair because some people are just unwilling to say 'he did alright to be fair'.

Have his performances been great? No, I've said that loads of times. Have they been bad? Absolutely not, no. He's been fine this season, a functioning member of the team who has played reasonably well. He won't suddenly start spraying defence splitting balls all over the gaff or dribbling past people because he hasn't got it in his locker. What he can do, and has been doing, is offer a relatively stable presence in the middle of the pitch, moving the ball around and being a shield.

We've got people saying Tosun can't be criticised at all because he's got two assists playing up front, but Schneiderlin's fair game despite having one assist from defensive midfield, in a game and a half less. Neither of them have been, or ever will be, brilliant in my opinion, but they've both played at about the same level I reckon.

Only 4 starting xi's so far this season have had a younger average age in the premier league

 

[Raino85]

It tells me that Sigurdsson doesn't do enough to get himself on the ball, as has been pointed out by many on here many times.

What I mean by unfair is the type of thing you've done there. Suddenly the goalposts have moved, at first we were talking about him not playing as well as Davies, then when that gets debunked we say the stats don't tell the story, I refute that and so now he's in a young team - not really like, I reckon there were about 300 senior caps in our starting XI, which probably had a similar age profile to our opponents and a lot more top level experience - and he's not getting the ball forward to the right people. We can't risk saying he didn't pass it forward enough because that can be refuted with facts, so we have to put the completely unquantifiable 'right people' bit in just to make sure that the argument holds up. It's unfair because some people are just unwilling to say 'he did alright to be fair'.

Have his performances been great? No, I've said that loads of times. Have they been bad? Absolutely not, no. He's been fine this season, a functioning member of the team who has played reasonably well. He won't suddenly start spraying defence splitting balls all over the gaff or dribbling past people because he hasn't got it in his locker. What he can do, and has been doing, is offer a relatively stable presence in the middle of the pitch, moving the ball around and being a shield.

We've got people saying Tosun can't be criticised at all because he's got two assists playing up front, but Schneiderlin's fair game despite having one assist from defensive midfield, in a game and a half less. Neither of them have been, or ever will be, brilliant in my opinion, but they've both played at about the same level I reckon.

I think you concentrate a little to much on stats it instead of just watching.

Let me introduce you to Jordan Henderson, his stats are phenominal, better than any defensive midfielder in the league, including N'Golo Kante