My fear going forward - what about the youth?

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jinkyali

Player Valuation: £40m
So, nearly twelve months in to the Moshiri regime and I think its fair to say, there have been some positives but also negatives.

Whilst the supposed stadium progress, to the removal of the previous management regime can be looked favourably upon, the dreadful summer transfer business and lack of credible PR from the club is leaving a lot to be desired.

Team results are also neither here nor there.

There is however a major issue I feel isn't being addressed and doesn't seem to be generating much discussion within the fan base.

The youth.

Our under 23's are top of the league; our under 18's are progressing well yet I dont see a direct route into the first team for them right now. We had a supposed golden generation, both Martinez/Unsworth and Osman's words yet not one of them is near the starting eleven and when they have been, they have been displaced immediately (Holgate).

Dowell/Davies/Walsh/Holgate/Galloway - are they really worse than Oviedo/McCarthy/Gibson/Kone/Valencia/Cleverley etc...?

These lads have formed great teams at various age levels and always impressed when either given a chance in the first team or at another league club.

Koeman is here for the short term, we all know that. His reluctance to bring in the youth shows me this; as does his career history and length of contract. The context of his arrival (i.e. promise of significant funds) also stands up to this train of thought.

Have we just abandoned the route into the first team and the values which the club, so brilliantly, produce young players and recruit young players from around the North West and further?

Has the appointment of Koeman effectively kissed good bye to the chances of these guys getting the opportunity to become first team material? What if we do suddenly spend the riches we supposedly have on players?

We have the basis of an excellent core of young players who are both successful at there league level but also when on loan; they form key parts of national set ups yet we dont even hear about them from either Walsh nor Koeman. I am led to believe that RK doesnt even attend there matches.

How can this be? How can we have forgotten one of the principles which makes the club what it is and has been so significant to our recent history?

Where is the blue print for the lads to progress to the team? Its all well and good having the academy route and the tools in place but if our head honcho isnt prepared to play them then what does this tell us about the strategy at the higher levels of the club? Equally, can we afford to waste the 'Koeman Years' to Liverpool who are transforming there route into the first team under Klopp?

Our new Head of Academy; what do we hear from him? Silence.

I fear our youth will be forgotten about and the supposed golden generation wasted whilst we spend big money on players rather than look at what we have inside.

One of the fundamental values we have as a club is being silenced and as a club we simply cant let that happen.
 
So, nearly twelve months in to the Moshiri regime and I think its fair to say, there have been some positives but also negatives.

Whilst the supposed stadium progress, to the removal of the previous management regime can be looked favourably upon, the dreadful summer transfer business and lack of credible PR from the club is leaving a lot to be desired.

Team results are also neither here nor there.

There is however a major issue I feel isn't being addressed and doesn't seem to be generating much discussion within the fan base.

The youth.

Our under 23's are top of the league; our under 18's are progressing well yet I dont see a direct route into the first team for them right now. We had a supposed golden generation, both Martinez/Unsworth and Osman's words yet not one of them is near the starting eleven and when they have been, they have been displaced immediately (Holgate).

Dowell/Davies/Walsh/Holgate/Galloway - are they really worse than Oviedo/McCarthy/Gibson/Kone/Valencia/Cleverley etc...?

These lads have formed great teams at various age levels and always impressed when either given a chance in the first team or at another league club.

Koeman is here for the short term, we all know that. His reluctance to bring in the youth shows me this; as does his career history and length of contract. The context of his arrival (i.e. promise of significant funds) also stands up to this train of thought.

Have we just abandoned the route into the first team and the values which the club, so brilliantly, produce young players and recruit young players from around the North West and further?

Has the appointment of Koeman effectively kissed good bye to the chances of these guys getting the opportunity to become first team material? What if we do suddenly spend the riches we supposedly have on players?

We have the basis of an excellent core of young players who are both successful at there league level but also when on loan; they form key parts of national set ups yet we dont even hear about them from either Walsh nor Koeman. I am led to believe that RK doesnt even attend there matches.

How can this be? How can we have forgotten one of the principles which makes the club what it is and has been so significant to our recent history?

Where is the blue print for the lads to progress to the team? Its all well and good having the academy route and the tools in place but if our head honcho isnt prepared to play them then what does this tell us about the strategy at the higher levels of the club? Equally, can we afford to waste the 'Koeman Years' to Liverpool who are transforming there route into the first team under Klopp?

Our new Head of Academy; what do we hear from him? Silence.

I fear our youth will be forgotten about and the supposed golden generation wasted whilst we spend big money on players rather than look at what we have inside.

One of the fundamental values we have as a club is being silenced and as a club we simply cant let that happen.
Good post. But if they are a 'Golden generation' surely they'll play.
 
Good post. But if they are a 'Golden generation' surely they'll play.

My worry is that in the short term Koeman and Walsh will focus on squad overhaul consisting mainly of acquisitions of players who are experienced and ready for the here and now.

Is Cleverly or Lennon really a better option than Dowell ?
 
Kidman was talking about Davies less than a week ago in an interview unless I'm mistaken, also his ommision from Saturday's squad was likely down to him playing three games during the international break with the England squad.

Kenny also came out with an interview this week sanctioned by the club, so not exactly true there not getting mentioned at all.

Would you rather we have not bought gueye and have played Davies this season? Same for bolasie and Dowell? And presumably you would hope we don't bring in any more midfielders or defenders for the foreseeable future in order to give the young lads more opportunities?
Do I have concerns, ofc I do, but it's twelve games into the new manager so way too early to form any clear opinion on how he will use any academy lads.
 

Btw who exactly are all these brilliant young players the club has produced over the past twenty years? Only one has made it at the very top level - rooney, and one has a chance in Ross. The rest of them where busted flushes by the age of 23-24, rodwell, cadamateri, Jeffers, ball, Vaughan, anichebe, or just bog standard average players like osman and hibbert.

The myth of our academy being so good etc has lived off producing Rooney 15 years ago ever since.
 
Some valid points Jinks but what I'm hoping for is we add another 4 quality signings this January, ship 2-3 of the utter dross robbing a living and then 3 youth players.get promoted. Same again for the summer until we've finally got shut of about 8 under performing excuses for footballers and brought in real quality along with some youth players hungry to make an impression.

I'm not saying it will happen but I'm hoping that is what is going to happen.
 
Btw who exactly are all these brilliant young players the club has produced over the past twenty years? Only one has made it at the very top level - rooney, and one has a chance in Ross. The rest of them where busted flushes by the age of 23-24, rodwell, cadamateri, Jeffers, ball, Vaughan, anichebe, or just bog standard average players like osman and hibbert.

The myth of our academy being so good etc has lived off producing Rooney 15 years ago ever since.
Yep. It'll, through no fault of the OP, just turn into another Koeman bashing thread because he hasn't already made regular internationals out of them.

:hayee:
 
Btw who exactly are all these brilliant young players the club has produced over the past twenty years? Only one has made it at the very top level - rooney, and one has a chance in Ross. The rest of them where busted flushes by the age of 23-24, rodwell, cadamateri, Jeffers, ball, Vaughan, anichebe, or just bog standard average players like osman and hibbert.

The myth of our academy being so good etc has lived off producing Rooney 15 years ago ever since.

To be fair you have failed to recognise a point I made; our academy provides a gateway into the first team .

Ball, Jeffers, Rooney, Osman, Hibbert , Rodwell , Barkley all got the opportunity and all made superb careers for themselves or for the club significant funds.

Right now the opportunities and route into the first eleven appears remote for the reasons I listed above .
 

Yep. It'll, through no fault of the OP, just turn into another Koeman bashing thread because he hasn't already made regular internationals out of them.

:hayee:

It's more about the opportunities available . This appears as small as it has for many a year.
 
It's more about the opportunities available . This appears as small as it has for many a year.
But the point is, if they're good enough they'll play, if they're good enough and don't play there will be some red faces in a few short years, that was the point I was making about time telling.
 
But the point is, if they're good enough they'll play, if they're good enough and don't play there will be some red faces in a few short years, that was the point I was making about time telling.
Was thinking exactly the same while watching the progress of Adam Forshaw . I see the very same with Tom Davies , not quite ready for a regular berth in the 1st team but obviously talented.
Canundrum is are we prepared to give him time as he develops ? ...Tough one.
 
Was thinking exactly the same while watching the progress of Adam Forshaw . I see the very same with Tom Davies , not quite ready for a regular berth in the 1st team but obviously talented.
Canundrum is are we prepared to give him time as he develops ? ...Tough one.

As a club we have always given youth the opportunity and we have seen Davies in glimpses . Every time he has played he has excelled. Including against Koemans Southampton last season.

Yet he can't get in ahead of Gibson, McCarthy etc?
 

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