Patience for a 2.5 season strategy?

[Theoneandonly]

I see he's talking about selling players in the media now. The only players we can sell for profit are the players he says we can't cope without. Yet more incoherent ramblings from a manager who is becoming increasingly desperate.

No he's saying that in the past we have spent big, but haven't spent smart. He's saying that previous managers didn't sell players when their stock was high and that is why we are in a bad place financially.

He also said Moshiri is prepared to spend money despite of FFP, but it also means that some big players will have to leave to finance it.

 

[ToffeeTim]

No he's saying that in the past we have spent big, but haven't spent smart. He's saying that previous managers didn't sell players when their stock was high and that is why we are in a bad place financially.

He also said Moshiri is prepared to spend money despite of FFP, but it also means that some big players will have to leave to finance it.

Of course we haven't spent smart. No one is saying we have.

He has consistently said that we can't compete without the injured players and attempted to lower expectations to rock bottom. "Wait for the second half of the season etc." Yet now he says we need to sell players for profit. That's all well and good, but the only players who we could possibly make a profit on are the players he said we couldn't cope without.

How do you square that circle? If we can't compete (as he has consistently argued), then why does he want to sell them? It's an incoherent, illogical argument and his interview last night on Amazon was total desperation.

You still didn't answer my question whether you are an Evertonian btw

 

[Zatara]

Whilst I no longer want Benitez here, I don't understand the narrative of allowing an unproven young manager to have 2 years in charge before we judge him rather than a serial winner in Benitez.

There's no way this fanbase would tolerate two season of finishing 15th and 12th under Potter either, you're absolutely kidding yourselves. Where was Marco Silva's 2.5 season strategy patience? First sign of the going getting tough we booted him.

The vote in this thread suggests otherwise.

If the club actually told the fans that there was a plan in place and went into some detail then most wouldnt be impatient.

Fair enough, appreciate the clarification.

I suppose my question, then, is how much we can be trusted under the current setup to reinvest the funds wisely as we get them. Let’s say we get rid of a waning Digne, for example, for £20m; do we adequately replace him for the same or less?

If your strategy is based on us finally getting our transfers right then of course I’d be up for it. The reality is, unfortunately, that we’ll just replace the crap with more crap and the decent players with crap.

Of course, under the current leadership with Brands having no control or it being mixed between him/manager/moshiri it woudnt work.

Who has Lampard brought through?

Tammy Abraham who Rafael had been chasing for 2 years at Newcastle. Who had a very successful loan at Villa.

Mason Mount who had 2 very successful loans at top level.

Reece James.

Big deal.

The guy has failed several interviews with different clubs now.

No one cares.

I see he's talking about selling players in the media now. The only players we can sell for profit are the players he says we can't cope without. Yet more incoherent ramblings from a manager who is becoming increasingly desperate.

That would be ok if we reinvested it well into u23 players who can play from day 1 and have high potential.

 

[Zatara]

The question marks suggest you don't think we need cover for DCL - how's it going this year? Doucore and Allan get injured or suspended - who's coming in there with 3 or 4 additions?

We'd need way more than 3 or 4 players. This season shows the shortcomings of having a half decent mid-table first 11 with nothing behind it. Bringing in 3 or 4 players means you're relying on that first 11 to not pick up injuries. All the outfield players you've listed need replacing with better quality to provide cover and also legitimate competition for the first team.

Then as part of that we'd be counting on those 4 U23 players hitting the ground running and not having ups and downs in their form or getting injured as you've previously stated a continual year on year improvement in league placings being part of the plan. Getting a 75-100% success rate on young player transfers to immediately come into and successfully contribute to a senior first 11 in the PL would be fairytale stuff - it doesn't happen.

I'll reiterate - I like the idea of a long term strategy which involves developing young players whether they're bought or developed from the academy. But it requires a hell of a lot more patience and bumpy times than the 2.5 years of gradual improvement you suggest. And if it requires such financial constraints then it also involves flirting with relegation.

Hence why i stated that I was only looking at Richarlison/Mina leaving along with the out of contract players.

For £100mil + £500k a week wages OR £126mil and £400k a week wages then alot of options open.

For example, the right backs linked cost £5-12mil each. The left back at Anderlecht wouldnt be much either...theres alot of room to bring players in.

Thats before looking at others to move on.

I dont think the targets are unreasonable, we wouldnt be in danger of relegation with the right recruitment.

If you note, i also stated 2.5 years to finish just outside top 6...then FFP/ Profit and sustaibability would be back to square one so we could sign the players to take the club up a level.

No he's saying that in the past we have spent big, but haven't spent smart. He's saying that previous managers didn't sell players when their stock was high and that is why we are in a bad place financially.

He also said Moshiri is prepared to spend money despite of FFP, but it also means that some big players will have to leave to finance it.

You have no idea what he meant.

 

[Misa]

The question marks suggest you don't think we need cover for DCL - how's it going this year? Doucore and Allan get injured or suspended - who's coming in there with 3 or 4 additions?

We'd need way more than 3 or 4 players. This season shows the shortcomings of having a half decent mid-table first 11 with nothing behind it. Bringing in 3 or 4 players means you're relying on that first 11 to not pick up injuries. All the outfield players you've listed need replacing with better quality to provide cover and also legitimate competition for the first team.

Then as part of that we'd be counting on those 4 U23 players hitting the ground running and not having ups and downs in their form or getting injured as you've previously stated a continual year on year improvement in league placings being part of the plan. Getting a 75-100% success rate on young player transfers to immediately come into and successfully contribute to a senior first 11 in the PL would be fairytale stuff - it doesn't happen.

I'll reiterate - I like the idea of a long term strategy which involves developing young players whether they're bought or developed from the academy. But it requires a hell of a lot more patience and bumpy times than the 2.5 years of gradual improvement you suggest. And if it requires such financial constraints then it also involves flirting with relegation.

Don't complicate it by bringing things such as reality in. Nobody wants to listen to that.

Sack everyone, hire the next great young manager, sell the current players for a high fee, replace with cheap wonderkids, win every game 10-0, get rich and prepare for multiple open top bus parades. Where do I sign up?

 

[Sharpies volley]

I would accept that strategy and stick with Benitez if we could guarantee finishing Mid table. Then top half, then challenging for Europe. Tha problem is though we're in free fall at the moment and if we don't improve soon it could end in tears. So I don't know the answer. But there's a lot of people getting payed obscene amounts of money who've got to find it.

 

[ClausThomsen]

Hence why i stated that I was only looking at Richarlison/Mina leaving along with the out of contract players.

For £100mil + £500k a week wages OR £126mil and £400k a week wages then alot of options open.

For example, the right backs linked cost £5-12mil each. The left back at Anderlecht wouldnt be much either...theres alot of room to bring players in.

Thats before looking at others to move on.

I dont think the targets are unreasonable, we wouldnt be in danger of relegation with the right recruitment.

If you note, i also stated 2.5 years to finish just outside top 6...then FFP/ Profit and sustaibability would be back to square one so we could sign the players to take the club up a level.

Only looking at Richarlison and Mina leaving and out of contract players? Quite aside that it's a big assumption to decide how much money would come into the club on the back of that it still doesn't answer the question of who covers for the likes of DCL, Allen and others.

2.5 years to finish jut outside the Top 6 would require continual improvement in amongst clubs with bigger budgets, a willingness to plug gaps with ready-made players AND to spend on developing players.

Is the Anderlecht LB Sergio Gomez? Former Barca product who went to Dortmund and then Anderlecht. Could be a very good player but is also linked with a plethora of European clubs playing in CL & Europa football. How simple would it be for a club like Everton to swoop in for such a player? What gives us the advantage in hoovering up young talent over other competing clubs? It's not the offer of silverware or European competition and it's certainly not offering more money under your plan so what is it? And how certain are you that this young player will make the grade and won't require a period of adjustment given his struggles at previous higher level leagues?

And that's one of these players. How do we replicate that advantage for several players?

I don't know who the rightbacks linked are but are you basing these values on information you are actually in possession of or hot take internet speculation articles written by people with no links to the clubs, players and agents they're writing about? A cut and paste clickbait article based on another football gossip column is not journalism.

You seem to be portraying it as a straight-forward route to quick success when it's never actually been done before in the manner that you describe it. Things go wrong, sometimes horribly wrong. You seem to be ignoring that and claiming that we simply need the "right recruitment". The most diligently scouted and detailed transfers sometimes flop....it's humans you're dealing with so you can't simply say just get it right and all will be fine. Anything with such a large number of variables cannot be predicted with anywhere near 100% accuracy.

Any manager who has a reputation for unearthing and developing young talent will have a list as long as your arm of failures in that market. Wenger unearthed some gems but for every Anelka there were 5 Christopher Wreh's. Even Alex Ferguson dropped a considerable chunk of change on flops...both unfulfilled prospects and established senior players.

 

[Joey66]

2.5 million ask yourself why have we wasted 1/2 a billion wasted on so-called star player a load of hasbeens ?.....

 

[Scally1878]

I could see the right manager being given the time to put things in place, the problem is identifying that.

Realistically we are now a rebuild project, from top to bottom. We need someone who can come in and do that build us back up and then put us on a playing field with the top 6 ready for the new stadium.

My problem is we don't have a structure in place to allow this... we are just going to go from has been to up and coming, different style to different style, until we grow a set of balls and stop doing the same thing over and over.

I would happily take a year of being mid table so the right manager could put a plan in place, problem is, Benitez isn't that man.

How do you know he's not that man? If we had another manager would you be saying that he is definetly the man if we were going through a period such as this?