POTUS 2016

njligernj · November 16, 2015

chrismpw said:
urthermore, it is ultimately arrogant to assume that the current generation has things right, whereas the massed tradition of billions of previous human brains must have had it wrong. True, there are improvements, but not to spelling!

I'm not sure the majority who type "gr8" believe that should be the official spelling. That seems like a bit of a straw-man.

The idea there aren't improvements to spelling is intellectually indefensible. All languages have changes to the way they spell some words over time.

chrismpw said:
In a previous post, I was told that I must take an interest in the next President of the United States, because the outcome will affect me. If this is the case, then I demand a vote. If that nation is unwilling to hand us votes, then I would like to request that they keep themselves to themselves, and not presume to impose their culture.

Fairly sure Indians, half of Africa etc. didn't get a vote either. While Britain didn't invent imposing their culture on other countries they certainly kicked the process into high gear. The US is just following the blueprint laid out centuries or so ago from the UK. Granted the blueprints are soaked in blood and have warnings scribbled all over saying "DO NOT USE THESE BLUEPRINTS!"

chrismpw said:
Suplhur has been spelled with a 'ph' since the Greeks and the Romans ... and only since 1990 has IUPAC been conned into spelling it with an 'f' by a solitary nation who have a reputation in the English speaking world for poor spelling who, it seems from your post, take spelling cues from its children!

A fascinating and detailed account of the history of the name of element 16 can be found elsewhere, but the bottom line is that sulfur is not a Greek loan word and so there is no 'phi' that needs to be replaced with 'ph'.

The Greeks called element 16 'theion', which is similar to the prefix 'thio' that we commonly encounter when describing sulfur-containing compounds today.

The word 'sulfur' can be traced to Latin, where the oldest form seems to be sulpur, which, over time, became sulphur and then finally sulfur — the first example of the latter spelling is thought to date back the third century. Only in English did the 'ph' remain for the 'f' sound — in other European languages the 'f' won through: azufre (Spanish), schwefel (German), soufre (French), zolfo (Italian). Interestingly, why the change from 'sulphur' to 'sulfur' occurred in the United States during the early part of the twentieth century remains something of a mystery, as other 'ph' words have persevered in American English.

Language is our servant, not our master and it evolves to meet our needs. And in the case of sulfur, there seems to be no good reason to continue using the 'ph' form other than perhaps a mistaken sense of spelling jingoism.

-http://www.nature.com/nchem/journal/v1/n5/full/nchem.301.html

USA! USA! USA!

Sorry for OT (forgot what the thread was about) ... vote Bernie!

njligernj · November 16, 2015

ItsOKImAPilot said:
We are falling behind in every category and these jokes of presidential candidates are direct reflections of where we are heading. Idiocracy.

Idiocracy was essentially based around the concept that politicians wouldn't listen to experts in their respective fields.

I'm not sure why so many people suggest we are "heading to Idiocracy" when we are clearly already there.

The military won't listen to their middle east experts on policy (very few of whom suggest "continue bombing it's going to start working any day now!"); politicians won't listen to the majority of economists on tax/spend issues; they don't listen to environmental scientists on the environment etc and so on and so on.

And yeah, yeah I know *sometimes* an expert might exaggerate (via nefarious means or just an honest "can't see the forest for the trees" investment in their particular field).

I am aware of that and that, to me, is the job of the politician. Sort through what all the experts are saying and allocate funds and resources based on priorities of that administration outlined in campaigns and voted on by the public. Coming up with their own plans based on the scant knowledge they have of a particular area is a disastrously bad idea which has a best case scenario of "competence and average performance." That's literally the best the current system could ever produce.

We currently ask experts to produce the best they can ... but with the following restrictions: x, y, z, a, b, c etc.

So for instance Obamacare. Literally no expert on earth would ever draw up Obamacare like the current implementation. It can only exist "thanks" to politics forcing smart people to include a bunch of items that under their own auspices they would never even conceive of as an option to summarily dismiss. Aside from a super "insider" political viewpoint nobody on the left is proud of Obamacare. They are happy he got it through but it's a Frankenstein's monster nobody could ever love.

We aren't heading anywhere. We are there. It's not as obvious as using Mountain Dew on crops but you could google enough examples that are in the ballpark.

Bernie.

chrismpw · November 16, 2015

Nice bit of copy and paste there. Seen that text many times having the same arguments over the years, although the website you quote seem to have lifted it themselves from elsewhere. Still, if it's on the interweb it MUST be right

Don't get me started on the wrongs of British history! We're not any models to uphold as virtue. The entire nation itself has been told on many occasions to be proud of itself and have swallowed the story whole (by the Normans, mainly, who came 1000 years ago and grabbed the land and STILL hold most of it ... but have quietly become parts of the British Institution - having said that, the fella he beat - Harold - is looked to as the last English king - but he was of Danish descent.)

[QUOTE="njligernj,
Language is our servant, not our master and it evolves to meet our needs. And in the case of sulfur, there seems to be no good reason to continue using the 'ph' form other than perhaps a mistaken sense of spelling jingoism.
[/QUOTE]

And this is the stock reply I get from my American friends when I wind them up .... sorry discuss the matter, to which I say:

Spell element 15 for me would you?

Interestingly, IUPAC DO allow alternative spellings for elements 27* and 55, in order to facilitate and placate our American bretheren. So quite why the favour was not returned with element 16 rather rankles.

(*The spelling of an entire nation affected by one businessman who didn't have his sign made correctly .... is that a true story? Part of the impetus behind my comment about the powers of advertising over substance).

Back to the topic: whoever you get I hope they get to grip with the gun laws, and start treating others with respect, as a bunch of humans that share a planet, rather than a bunch of people that big business can sell to. Our lads over here have started shooting and knifing one another for no apparent reason other than it's what they're told is cool because of your rap music. I've really had quite enough.

peteblue · November 16, 2015

deipnosophist said:
..there's SCOTUS as well (Supreme Court of the US)

Is there a SCROTUM as well.....

wm02 · November 16, 2015

This thread is turning badly Martin O'Malley

deipnosophist · November 16, 2015

peteblue said:
Is there a SCROTUM as well.....

...in recent decades, that's been the POTUS

deipnosophist · November 16, 2015

wm02 said:
Nah, her unfavorability numbers are really high.

That's good to hear. I like this Sanders bloke...any chance of him winning?

Garrick · November 16, 2015

wm02 said:
This thread is turning badly Martin O'Malley

chrismpw · November 16, 2015

I thought Carcetti was old technology. People have moved onto MP3 now.

DanEFC92 · November 16, 2015

See a lot of republican governors are voting to stop Syrian refugees from entering their respective states. Like true Christians.

SerenityNigh · November 16, 2015

njligernj said:
A fascinating and detailed account of the history of the name of element 16 can be found elsewhere, but the bottom line is that sulfur is not a Greek loan word and so there is no 'phi' that needs to be replaced with 'ph'.

The Greeks called element 16 'theion', which is similar to the prefix 'thio' that we commonly encounter when describing sulfur-containing compounds today.

The word 'sulfur' can be traced to Latin, where the oldest form seems to be sulpur, which, over time, became sulphur and then finally sulfur — the first example of the latter spelling is thought to date back the third century. Only in English did the 'ph' remain for the 'f' sound — in other European languages the 'f' won through: azufre (Spanish), schwefel (German), soufre (French), zolfo (Italian). Interestingly, why the change from 'sulphur' to 'sulfur' occurred in the United States during the early part of the twentieth century remains something of a mystery, as other 'ph' words have persevered in American English.

Language is our servant, not our master and it evolves to meet our needs. And in the case of sulfur, there seems to be no good reason to continue using the 'ph' form other than perhaps a mistaken sense of spelling jingoism.

-http://www.nature.com/nchem/journal/v1/n5/full/nchem.301.html

USA! USA! USA!

HOLD THE FONE!!!

SerenityNigh · November 16, 2015

chrismpw said:
Nice bit of copy and paste there. Seen that text many times having the same arguments over the years, although the website you quote seem to have lifted it themselves from elsewhere. Still, if it's on the interweb it MUST be right

Don't get me started on the wrongs of British history! We're not any models to uphold as virtue. The entire nation itself has been told on many occasions to be proud of itself and have swallowed the story whole (by the Normans, mainly, who came 1000 years ago and grabbed the land and STILL hold most of it ... but have quietly become parts of the British Institution - having said that, the fella he beat - Harold - is looked to as the last English king - but he was of Danish descent.)

And this is the stock reply I get from my American friends when I wind them up .... sorry discuss the matter, to which I say:

Spell element 15 for me would you?

Interestingly, IUPAC DO allow alternative spellings for elements 27* and 55, in order to facilitate and placate our American bretheren. So quite why the favour was not returned with element 16 rather rankles.

(*The spelling of an entire nation affected by one businessman who didn't have his sign made correctly .... is that a true story? Part of the impetus behind my comment about the powers of advertising over substance).

Back to the topic: whoever you get I hope they get to grip with the gun laws, and start treating others with respect, as a bunch of humans that share a planet, rather than a bunch of people that big business can sell to. Our lads over here have started shooting and knifing one another for no apparent reason other than it's what they're told is cool because of your rap music. I've really had quite enough.