Relegation 2022/23

[davek]

Brilliant post.

No one in their right minds thought we had a chance of getting out of the bottom 3 with just 6 games to go last season. Not with Burnley in the ascendency and the likes of Chelsea and Leicester and Arsenal still to play.

There's a lot of talk of RS fans having a huge relegation party outside BMD on the final day of the season. We are really playing into their hands with this absurd talk of already being down. If we were 10 points adrift I would get it, but as things stand we are just one point away from safety. And a few weeks ago we beat the league leaders.

Anything is possible as long as we get behind the players and the manager in the same way that we did towards the end of last season.

There's a lot of that on here. It's deplorable too. There's a reasonable case to be made that we are in better shape to get out of the relegation zone this season than last when we had just half the games we have now to go to get out of the bottom three.

Also, on the subject of Richarlison as the difference, he scored 10 goals, yes - but only in 4 of the games did we get points from those 10 scored (where they the difference ie got us a draw or won all three points). He also scored 3 pens dont forget, so effectively 7 outfield goals was his contribution. Apart from Gordon and Branthwaite's 5 goal contribution, the rest of the goals we scored last season (28) were scored by players we have in our squad right now.

 

[Wat Tyler]

Neither Brentford nor Fulham have what the media like to describe as star players. But they both have lots of very good players who are playing well within systems that suit them best and for two excellent managers. I regret now belonging to the group of Everton fans maybe the majority who wanted Silva sacked. Too late now I know.

Silva was terrible for us, he had a MUCH better Everton side in the bottom 3. This revisionism about him is tiresome, people forget how bad he was here.

His time at Fulham so far: he joined the big promotion favourites and took them up, good achievement but nothing extraordinary at all, particularly when he had a striker too good for the level score a ridiculous amount of goals (Mitrovic got about 45 league goals).

This season they have done really well, no question. But let’s see where they are next season. Loads and loads of teams have came up and had a top half first season, off the top of my head Reading, Wigan, Ipswich, and not too long ago Sheff Utd.

Second season is always sticky, let’s see where they are this time next season.

 

[LucBesson]

There's a lot of that on here. It's deplorable too. There's a reasonable case to be made that we are in better shape to get out of the relegation zone this season than last when we had just half the games we have now to go to get out of the bottom three.

Also, on the subject of Richarlison as the difference, he scored 10 goals, yes - but only in 4 of the games did we get points from those 10 scored (where they the difference ie got us a draw or won all three points). He also scored 3 pens dont forget, so effectively 7 outfield goals was his contribution. Apart from Gordon and Branthwaite's 5 goal contribution, the rest of the goals we scored last season (28) were scored by players we have in our squad right now.

Contributions also means assists and Richarlison got 5 of them. Whatever way you spin it, taking out 15 goal contributions from THIS Everton side was/is absolutely catastrophic.

 

[Wat Tyler]

I’m not enamoured with our run in but Leeds’ last four games:

City a
Newcastle h
West Ham a
Spurs h

I wouldn’t want to be going into that needing points.

 

[Saint Domingo]

Brilliant post.

No one in their right minds thought we had a chance of getting out of the bottom 3 with just 6 games to go last season. Not with Burnley in the ascendency and the likes of Chelsea and Leicester and Arsenal still to play.

There's a lot of talk of RS fans having a huge relegation party outside BMD on the final day of the season. We are really playing into their hands with this absurd talk of already being down. If we were 10 points adrift I would get it, but as things stand we are just one point away from safety. And a few weeks ago we beat the league leaders.

Anything is possible as long as we get behind the players and the manager in the same way that we did towards the end of last season.

Tbh if Everton have games at Goodison and a chance of staying up I always think they can do it even when it looks difficult. I think the only moment I thought we’d go down last season is when Allan got sent off against Newcastle. I still thought before games against United and Chelsea that we had a chance of winning. Don’t know why looking back as there was no logic to it

 

[davek]

Contributions also means assists and Richarlison got 5 of them. Whatever way you spin it, taking out 15 goal contributions from THIS Everton side was/is absolutely catastrophic.

Yes, I'm not denying Richarlison's contribution, I'm looking at just how decisive it was.

I could just as easily say - and reasonably say - that we'll concede 15 less goals this season than we did last season, and that will be the difference. I could also say that the set up of the team last season was one where the attacking was left to the front four and the goals were expected from them whereas now the demand is for everyone bar Pickford to get a goal if possible, so we might expect goals to come at a better rate than at least under Lampard and that could be decisive too.

The overarching point is that there is no justification whatsoever for the attitude of "we're defo down lad". It's pathetic and juvenile and speaks more about the people using that defeatist talk than situation we actually find ourselves in.

 

[LucBesson]

Yes, I'm not denying Richarlison's contribution, I'm looking at just how decisive it was.

I could just as easily say - and reasonably say - that we'll concede 15 less goals this season than we did last season, and that will be the difference. I could also say that the set up of the team last season was one where the attacking was left to the front four and the goals were expected from them whereas now the demand is for everyone bar Pickford to get a goal if possible, so we might expect goals to come at a better rate than at least under Lampard and that could be decisive too.

The overarching point is that there is no justification whatsoever for the attitude that "we're defo down lad". It's pathetic and juvenile and speaks more about the people using that defeatist talk than situation we actually find ourselves in.

Agree with all that, and despite my post I am reasonably optimistic about our survival chances. The only really poor result we've had under Dyche has been the Villa 0-2 and I thought we were the better side for an hour.

On the flipside, our lack of goals from open play scares the crap out of me. The only one we've had under Dyche was a 1 in 100 goal of the month winner from Coleman. Are we really going to be able to survive from set-pieces alone? Not for me.

 

[davek]

I’m not enamoured with our run in but Leeds’ last four games:

City a
Newcastle h
West Ham a
Spurs h

I wouldn’t want to be going into that needing points.

United away and Chelsea away are the only games I'd write off getting points from.

I look at the other 10 games and I see points to be had. If we get more wins than draws we're safe. I think 4 wins plus 2 draws gets the job done. The amount of relegation 6 pointers in the run in suggests that talk about 39/40 points being required is a bit fanciful.

If we beat Brentford on Saturday to get to 25 points, that 36 point total starts to look very doable.

 

[Neiler]

United away and Chelsea away are the only games I'd write off getting points from.

I look at the other 10 games and I see points to be had. If we get more wins than draws we're safe. I think 4 wins plus 2 draws gets the job done. The amount of relegation 6 pointers in the run in suggests that talk about 39/40 points being required is a bit fanciful.

If we beat Brentford on Saturday to get to 25 points, that 36 point total starts to look very doable.

Would fancy getting something at Chelsea to be honest, think we're capable of a point at Utd to - not give me's and you wouldn't be surprised to be beaten but id be hopeful of lets call them bonus points.

 

[davek]

Agree with all that, and despite my post I am reasonably optimistic about our survival chances. The only really poor result we've had under Dyche has been the Villa 0-2 and I thought we were the better side for an hour.

On the flipside, our lack of goals from open play scares the crap out of me. The only one we've had under Dyche was a 1 in 100 goal of the month winner from Coleman. Are we really going to be able to survive from set-pieces alone? Not for me.

I wouldn't call Doucoure's goal a set piece situation. Pickford takes th free kick but it has to be fashioned from there.

 

[Goodisongang]

There's a lot of that on here. It's deplorable too. There's a reasonable case to be made that we are in better shape to get out of the relegation zone this season than last when we had just half the games we have now to go to get out of the bottom three.

Also, on the subject of Richarlison as the difference, he scored 10 goals, yes - but only in 4 of the games did we get points from those 10 scored (where they the difference ie got us a draw or won all three points). He also scored 3 pens dont forget, so effectively 7 outfield goals was his contribution. Apart from Gordon and Branthwaite's 5 goal contribution, the rest of the goals we scored last season (28) were scored by players we have in our squad right now.

5 games mate, but more importantly it's the impact of those goals

Southampton 3-1 goal and assist
Arsenal 2-1
Leicester 1-1 ( last minute equaliser )
Chelsea 1-0
Palace 3-2

Take them goals out and we "drop" 9 points, it's not just he scored 10 goals, he scored massive goals in massive games.

He really was irreplaceable for us, but to replace someone like Richy with someone like McNeil ( who's been ok under dyche ) who has a track record of being a very poor scorer is just one of many reasons we are were we are.

 

[davek]

Would fancy getting something at Chelsea to be honest, think we're capable of a point at Utd to - not give me's and you wouldn't be surprised to be beaten but id be hopeful of lets call them bonus points.

Anything's possible after getting a draw at City, I suppose. We got a draw at Stamford Bridge last season, of course.

 

[davek]

5 games mate, but more importantly it's the impact of those goals

Southampton 3-1 goal and assist
Arsenal 2-1
Leicester 1-1 ( last minute equaliser )
Chelsea 1-0
Palace 3-2

Take them goals out and we "drop" 9 points, it's not just he scored 10 goals, he scored massive goals in massive games.

He really was irreplaceable for us, but to replace someone like Richy with someone like McNeil ( who's been ok under dyche ) who has a track record of being a very poor scorer is just one of many reasons we are were we are.

On assists: Iwobi has stepped up with 5 this season.

On decisive Richarlson goals last season, you're possibly counting his goal in the 3-1 win against S'ton so, of course, that wasn't decisive.

 

[Goodisongang]

On assists: Iwobi has stepped up with 5 this season.

On decisive Richarlson goals last season, you're possibly counting his goal in the 3-1 win against S'ton so, of course, that wasn't decisive.

I'd say it was decisive myself.

Scoring the last goal in a 4/5-0 win isn't, but scoring the equaliser or to make it 2-1 to us is deffo a decisive goal ( think he may have made it 2-1) seems so long ago can't remember

 

[HalfTimeSayers]

After all the assists, goals and contributions by whoever, we were a weird scuffed finish, a Keane moment of delicate magic, and one of the better headed goals ever to be scored at Goodison from going down. If Richy had missed the last 2 months it’s impossible to know if someone else would have stepped up.

That said, i’d rather be going into the last 12 games with this current squad and this manager playing simplified football than with last years squad making 500 passes in our own box before daring to cross halfway. We can still get some big wins, but we are better equipped to grind out some bonus points if we can just curb the howlers.