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Roberto Martinez Discussion - Including Live Poll (Poll Reset 1st May)

Martinez in or out?

  • In

  • Out

  • Getting splinters eating cheese on toast on the fence

Results are only viewable after voting.
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One manager had to not get relegated, with a team that sat bottom half every year and had 2 last minute escapes in recent years, got relatively no funding, and got us into the CL spots whilst saying "first aim is staying up, then we will see what we can do from there.".

The other said he could get us CL with a squad of decent players and record funding, and instead took us backwards to bottom half again.

Actions>words imo

One would be a failure at 7th, the other a success at 7th, go figure.

Personally I think Moyes built us a block tower nice and high, then Martinez came and knocked it down to rebuild it better and increase the height. Only he seems to just keep putting the blocks on top of each other to one side.. the same side.. and wondering why it keeps falling over.

He's got all the shiny toys, Lukau, Deulofeu, Stones, Barkley, Coleman, Baines, Jags, Mirallas and so on.. but they suck in terms of points, and I don't care how many backheels Barkley does in centre circle, I want points on the board. Showboating is great when your winning.

BUT...

Last few games have shown strong signs of improvement.. he's started moving the blocks to the middle and got a little balance sorted.. I'm bailing on that analogy as it is not very good lol. But if its not just flash in the pan, and we can actually defend as well as attack, then we will find that perfect mix and he will do really well imo.. Really well.

I can still see the prospect of a top 4.. but can just as easily see the prospect of bottom half finishes for several years. Its a strange time, but I think this run we are on now, playing a little more balanced, could give a little more insight into what we building.. or failing to build under Martinez.
 
Ihaters said:
I can still see the prospect of a top 4.. but can just as easily see the prospect of bottom half finishes for several years. Its a strange time, but I think this run we are on now, playing a little more balanced, could give a little more insight into what we building.. or failing to build under Martinez.
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But not this season and that's the problem.... can he convince the 'shiny toys'... in particular I'm talking Lukaku, to stay for yet another year? If he can't then its another step back.... this year was the best opportunity we've ever had to do serious damage.
 
banno said:
You can try and twist what I say as much as you like if it makes you feel better. What I am saying is what I said....do you disagree that the league was not as competitive then as it is now
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Yes it is more competitive now, as all prem clubs have more money now, so technically should be able to compete a bit better for the top 4, if they can buy some real quality. 10 years ago it was much tougher to break into that elite as the domination of the top sides was so strong and we were all left fighting for the scraps. so basically you are just strengthening the argument for Moyes getting top 4 then as being even more remarkable!
 
meagher94 said:
But not this season and that's the problem.... can he convince the 'shiny toys'... in particular I'm talking Lukaku, to stay for yet another year? If he can't then its another step back.... this year was the best opportunity we've ever had to do serious damage.
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Can't argue with that, we had the squad, and everyone fell over everyone else.. except us.. we seemed to just fall over.
But its a rebuild, if we can keep the players and he can show that we are actually building I am in.. If what's he has done is just broke us down and then lost the instructions on how to rebuild us then I will be furious.. But I think we have enough on show to demonstrate to our current players what can be.

Any player knows if we keep scoring we have a good chance of winning, a striker that keeps getting goals will be happy, even outside of CL for a while, Deu will stay I am sure, Stones will be the hardest to keep imo.
 
By god I'm blue said:
Yes it is more competitive now, as all prem clubs have more money now, so technically should be able to compete a bit better for the top 4, if they can buy some real quality. 10 years ago it was much tougher to break into that elite as the domination of the top sides was so strong and we were all left fighting for the scraps. so basically you are just strengthening the argument for Moyes getting top 4 then as being even more remarkable!
Click to expand...
Spot on mate.
Its much easier now just look at leicester
 

By god I'm blue said:
Yes it is more competitive now, as all prem clubs have more money now, so technically should be able to compete a bit better for the top 4, if they can buy some real quality. 10 years ago it was much tougher to break into that elite as the domination of the top sides was so strong and we were all left fighting for the scraps. so basically you are just strengthening the argument for Moyes getting top 4 then as being even more remarkable!
Click to expand...


We still have to get past the money teams that are Man City, Arsenal, Man Utd, Tottenham, Chelsea, Liverpool and that is 6 teams that clearly out do us in the cash sense plus half of the rest of the league has as much money as us so no it won't be easier to challenge for top 4. We did well to get 4th with our 1-0 's but we all knew it wasn't sustainable because we were not that good. That is why I argue for RMs football being the progressive way rather than just getting lucky backs to the wall wins which is not progressive at all. Position wise does not always mean we are progressing long term it is the shaping of a team that wants to win and trying to find a way of winning (not really happening at the mo) that is more likely to succeed than a team that battles not to lose. I see progressive football that is unfortunately not reaping the rewards it deserves but it has more chance of cracking the top 4 if it comes right.

I am loving the footy but not the results whereas I used to put up with what was on offer and the results where not that much better.
 
davek said:
But 17th was Moyes' own handiwork - he didn't inherit that, he put Everton there himself. Yes, a fourth place finish after that was very good going. Martinez taking Everton from the 63 points accumulated in Moyes' (final) second best season and adding another 9 points on top was staggering though. I still dont think that effort has been fully digested or comprehended.

Have we gone backward from that? In terms of points and PL position, yes. But in terms of building an overall depth to this squad and the type of football they are even now capable of playing, absolutely not. We're a better football team now than in Martinez's record breaking first season here...and we have a much better bench. The one area that isn't true about is the GK position. Howard was much better when Martinez arrived - he was still an above average PL GK in fact. Now he is turd and Robles isn't at that Howard 2013/14 level to compensate.
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Spot on this - this is a much better squad than 2 years ago but we all agree results have to be better.
 
davek said:
We play on the break more often than not. He then spearheads a front three - two out wide give him very good service (well Deulofeu does) and he has Barkley hurtling forward just behind to join in with attacks.



If it's a meaningless stat then so is looking at the table and deciding that 11th and 7th are qualitatively different...which suits me, btw, because that is what I think. Others though see a position top half an equate it to progress. Let's just say Moyes gave us one season near the summit and Martinez has so far and call the rest for what it is: mediocrity.





Exactly. The fact you can point to a handful of examples underlines that those performances were the exceptions to the rule.

I'd take watching even the poorest of our performances under Martinez over any average display from a Moyes team. As far as I'm concerned there was only one manager attempting to coach football and show it on the pitch, the other was a drill seargent.
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Im thinking you need to be put through your paces by Moyes until he beats you into submission you hater ! (n)
I understand that a lot of people consider moyes to be the more 'defensive' and rightly so, he built from the back but Martinez prefers to have a potent attack, one part of your reply sort of highlights what im saying in terms of bobby's poor subs and such - you said Delboy provides the ammunition for Lukaku to fire but very rarely there is two wingers on the pitch at the same time, again see West Brom for example, given I started watching everton properly during our dark days, im grateful for moyes and his European adventures and FA cup run in 2009. To be fair Roberto did have me dreaming a little until the Kiev away day....
 

Pre Bournemouth situation :-


Martinez in or out?

In 474 votes 38.9%
Out 746 votes 61.1%


Will today's result make anyone change their mind ?
 

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