Roberto Martinez Discussion - Including Live Poll (Poll Reset 1st May)

[AndyC]

Maybe so. But it's right: one game, one successful shot at Wembley = for most, the storm clouds disappear. You know it and I know t.

Dave, what I've said is I love his attacking philosophy and his desire to see us dominate possession... It's his apparent lack of tactical nouse for the defensive side of the game, failure to learn from previous errors on how to close a game out and barking mad substitutions that have driven me to think he just can't get us to where we want to be and to where this squad should be.
I'll agree with you that have been and are times that certain players need and have needed to take both individual and collective responsibility, but the managers job surely has to be to address all concerns during the week so that the vital 90 minutes on game day don't have us reaching the current levels of concern.

 

[flibbyflob]

I cant wait until next week when we're looking at a Wembley semi final.

A semi final place isn't good enough, unless we win it he HAS to go.

 

[nsno-chris]

All hail the semi final

What a season if we get to 2 in one year

Pffft do one

 

[quasi modo]

A semi final place isn't good enough, unless we win it he HAS to go.

That's how low expectations have become, semi final and top half finish is seen as some kind of success by some.

 

[LocalNative]

I cant wait until next week when we're looking at a Wembley semi final.

This place will witness an exodus of those posters who only ever come out after a defeat to push hard for a manager's dismissal that isn't even remotely on the cards.

I don't think there's ever been a time on here when the finger has been less on the pulse of the real world of Everton FC than it is right now. These views are miles off and running in a parallel universe to the power dynamics inside the club. Maybe some will think that the board will hate the fact that we're seen as an entertaining team and scoring 51 PL goals so far and performing well in all competitions and sack the manager?

I promise you this: if I ever had any feeling that the balance of power had tipped away from this manager I'd old my hands up and reluctantly acknowledge it. But it is isn't anywhere in sight. In the echo chamber of a forum it might seem like there's something afoot. But it's wayward to think anything other than that manager/players and chairman and new major share owner are completely in synch. Those in power will be viewing this season as a developmental one, and that quality and value has been added not only to our play overall but also to the balance sheet. If you think they're going twist instead of stick you are most definitely barking up the wrong tree. Home PL form aside, they are going to view the season in it's entirety and be happy with the job RM is doing.

That's the big picture. It's always been the big picture. And it's the reason why people predicting the fall of Martinez have been wrong in the past just like they are now.

Why do we have to go through this melodrama after every defeat? It's baffling to me. It's a lot of wasted energy on wishful thinking rather than seeing the situation for what it is.

Your arrogance is admirable.

Are we seen as an entertaining team though? Or are we seen as bottlejobs who no team fears playing? Perhaps both.

We lose the semi-final, does the balance of power tip to Martinez out?

 

[TheHumbleEgg]

How far do you push on 'developmental seasons'....4....5? Where does it stop...

 

[nsno-chris]

How far do you push on 'developmental seasons'....4....5? Where does it stop...

10 I think, 10 is fair amount of years for this wankpuffin to take us to new lows

 

[neil999]

How far do you push on 'developmental seasons'....4....5? Where does it stop...

when the players aren't playing for the manager

when the manager buys consistently poorly

when there is no progression in any part of the team

 

[bluestevon]

I cant wait until next week when we're looking at a Wembley semi final.

This place will witness an exodus of those posters who only ever come out after a defeat to push hard for a manager's dismissal that isn't even remotely on the cards.

I don't think there's ever been a time on here when the finger has been less on the pulse of the real world of Everton FC than it is right now. These views are miles off and running in a parallel universe to the power dynamics inside the club. Maybe some will think that the board will hate the fact that we're seen as an entertaining team and scoring 51 PL goals so far and performing well in all competitions and sack the manager?

I promise you this: if I ever had any feeling that the balance of power had tipped away from this manager I'd old my hands up and reluctantly acknowledge it. But it is isn't anywhere in sight. In the echo chamber of a forum it might seem like there's something afoot. But it's wayward to think anything other than that manager/players and chairman and new major share owner are completely in synch. Those in power will be viewing this season as a developmental one, and that quality and value has been added not only to our play overall but also to the balance sheet. If you think they're going twist instead of stick you are most definitely barking up the wrong tree. Home PL form aside, they are going to view the season in it's entirety and be happy with the job RM is doing.

That's the big picture. It's always been the big picture. And it's the reason why people predicting the fall of Martinez have been wrong in the past just like they are now.

Why do we have to go through this melodrama after every defeat? It's baffling to me. It's a lot of wasted energy on wishful thinking rather than seeing the situation for what it is.

Dave you don't half talk some utter rubbish for an intelligent bloke at times, yeah we get it you nailed your colours to the Martinez mast, but seriously it's tiring reading every week a different slant on the same thing, only with constantly lowered expectations as the season nears its end.

Do the board hate the fact that we are entertaining, no mate i am sure that the boards entire interest is how entertaining we are for the neutrals to watch or for fans of other clubs who enjoy the fact our games contain loads of goals. Howerver i would hope also that the board realise that when the 'entertainment' comes in the form of results like west ham scoring 3 in 15 minutes to overcome a 2-0 deficit, or stoke coming from 3-2 behind to win 4-3, or chelsea coming from 2-0 down to draw 3-3, or borunmouth coming from 2-0 down to draw then really that entertainment starts becoming secondary to the actual rsults.

Keegan's Newcastle had the same reputation as the entertainers - only they actually performed far far better than we did in terms of results, but when their brand of entertaining meant they lost a league to united they became a laughing stock as did the manager.

we currently sit 6 points behind a Liverpool team who this seaosn you have mocked repeatedly for havign a crap manager and a crap set of players - not counting the fact we have to go to anfield still so likely we will sit 9 points or more behind them at the end of the season, how do you justify taking the piss out of klopp when with a inferior team and under more pressure than Martinez he has out performed him in the league?

11 points bejhind west ham mate, 5 points behind stoke, 6 points behind the rs, 2 points ahead of west brom, 3 ahead of the mighty bournmouth

The worst home defence in any of the top leagues in europe, 4 home wins all seaosn

So the new owner will look at the season in its entirety and be happy will they? what they will be happy that home fans are starting to boo at the preformances and results, that massive ammounts don't want this manager anymore, they will be happy that the maner made changes that entirely spun the league cup semi final from a commanding position to a total collapse will they? they will also be happy that we are a long way behind our loveable neighbours in the league as well ofc?

Why do we have to go through this melodrama after every defeat? Maybe the answer can be found in the amount of defeats at home, the style and cause of those defeats, the fact those defeats have happend against some utter rubbish teams and the fact that the manager currently resembles nero - fiddling whilst everything burns down around him, but what a beautiful entertaining song we play is what you'd say...

developmental season is it, wasnt least season one of those too? so far two of our young stars are way back on development btw over 3 months ago, del cant get on the pitch, stones has become a bit part player, as for galloway - not to be seen, but if you think that not winning any cup, and a 12th-14th place finish which is what you'd have to say looks likely is a good job then your a [Poor language removed] mentalist mate

 

[davek]

A/ "performing well in all competitions" - your delusion knows no bounds. Our performance in the league is a disgrace.

B/ "balance of power had tipped away from this manager" - would never have happened under Kenwright but you know zero about what Moshiri is thinking.

C/ "It's a lot of wasted energy" - noone has wasted more energy then you, trying to justify Martinez

A/ SFs and QFs are sniffed at by you are they? That'll be because we've won all those trophies in the past 20 years I expect.

B/ Martinez and The Mush were settling spending for the summer just over a week ago mate. I'm going to hazard a guess that he's on board with the chairman and manager.

C/ I argue my case as forcefully and as fairly and without insult as I can. Why not try it?

 

[Mozza1987]

I cant wait until next week when we're looking at a Wembley semi final.

This place will witness an exodus of those posters who only ever come out after a defeat to push hard for a manager's dismissal that isn't even remotely on the cards.

I don't think there's ever been a time on here when the finger has been less on the pulse of the real world of Everton FC than it is right now. These views are miles off and running in a parallel universe to the power dynamics inside the club. Maybe some will think that the board will hate the fact that we're seen as an entertaining team and scoring 51 PL goals so far and performing well in all competitions and sack the manager?

I promise you this: if I ever had any feeling that the balance of power had tipped away from this manager I'd old my hands up and reluctantly acknowledge it. But it is isn't anywhere in sight. In the echo chamber of a forum it might seem like there's something afoot. But it's wayward to think anything other than that manager/players and chairman and new major share owner are completely in synch. Those in power will be viewing this season as a developmental one, and that quality and value has been added not only to our play overall but also to the balance sheet. If you think they're going twist instead of stick you are most definitely barking up the wrong tree. Home PL form aside, they are going to view the season in it's entirety and be happy with the job RM is doing.

That's the big picture. It's always been the big picture. And it's the reason why people predicting the fall of Martinez have been wrong in the past just like they are now.

Why do we have to go through this melodrama after every defeat? It's baffling to me. It's a lot of wasted energy on wishful thinking rather than seeing the situation for what it is.

Are you happy with how we are doing in the prem this season after how we did last year as well? Genuine question. Just look at the table with Leicester top and West Ham up there. This squad should be easily challenging these spots so why are we in the bottom half struggling to win a game again like last season.

Like I said earlier Moyes had us nearly always challenging for Europe with a worse team, less money and the top teams always on form unlike this season which made it even harder. Not saying I want Moyes back but Martinez should be doing miles better with the best group of players we have had in many many years.

 

[Mickey]

Dave you don't half talk some utter rubbish for an intelligent bloke at times, yeah we get it you nailed your colours to the Martinez mast, but seriously it's tiring reading every week a different slant on the same thing, only with constantly lowered expectations as the season nears its end.

Do the board hate the fact that we are entertaining, no mate i am sure that the boards entire interest is how entertaining we are for the neutrals to watch or for fans of other clubs who enjoy the fact our games contain loads of goals. Howerver i would hope also that the board realise that when the 'entertainment' comes in the form of results like west ham scoring 3 in 15 minutes to overcome a 2-0 deficit, or stoke coming from 3-2 behind to win 4-3, or chelsea coming from 2-0 down to draw 3-3, or borunmouth coming from 2-0 down to draw then really that entertainment starts becoming secondary to the actual rsults.

Keegan's Newcastle had the same reputation as the entertainers - only they actually performed far far better than we did in terms of results, but when their brand of entertaining meant they lost a league to united they became a laughing stock as did the manager.

we currently sit 6 points behind a Liverpool team who this seaosn you have mocked repeatedly for havign a crap manager and a crap set of players - not counting the fact we have to go to anfield still so likely we will sit 9 points or more behind them at the end of the season, how do you justify taking the piss out of klopp when with a inferior team and under more pressure than Martinez he has out performed him in the league?

11 points bejhind west ham mate, 5 points behind stoke, 6 points behind the rs, 2 points ahead of west brom, 3 ahead of the mighty bournmouth

The worst home defence in any of the top leagues in europe, 4 home wins all seaosn

So the new owner will look at the season in its entirety and be happy will they? what they will be happy that home fans are starting to boo at the preformances and results, that massive ammounts don't want this manager anymore, they will be happy that the maner made changes that entirely spun the league cup semi final from a commanding position to a total collapse will they? they will also be happy that we are a long way behind our loveable neighbours in the league as well ofc?

Why do we have to go through this melodrama after every defeat? Maybe the answer can be found in the amount of defeats at home, the style and cause of those defeats, the fact those defeats have happend against some utter rubbish teams and the fact that the manager currently resembles nero - fiddling whilst everything burns down around him, but what a beautiful entertaining song we play is what you'd say...

developmental season is it, wasnt least season one of those too? so far two of our young stars are way back on development btw over 3 months ago, del cant get on the pitch, stones has become a bit part player, as for galloway - not to be seen, but if you think that not winning any cup, and a 12th-14th place finish which is what you'd have to say looks likely is a good job then your a [Poor language removed] mentalist mate

It's cause you deal in reality mate not what the fairies down the cabbage patch tell you. "Gonna win the league cup as that's the priority, gonna mug off Swansea and show everyone, give those Leicester frauds a good shoeing etc etc. If you deal in the here and now it's ludicrous to consider RM as a success so just create a fantasy where he is, or more accurately will be.

 

[davek]

Dave you don't half talk some utter rubbish for an intelligent bloke at times, yeah we get it you nailed your colours to the Martinez mast, but seriously it's tiring reading every week a different slant on the same thing, only with constantly lowered expectations as the season nears its end.

Do the board hate the fact that we are entertaining, no mate i am sure that the boards entire interest is how entertaining we are for the neutrals to watch or for fans of other clubs who enjoy the fact our games contain loads of goals. Howerver i would hope also that the board realise that when the 'entertainment' comes in the form of results like west ham scoring 3 in 15 minutes to overcome a 2-0 deficit, or stoke coming from 3-2 behind to win 4-3, or chelsea coming from 2-0 down to draw 3-3, or borunmouth coming from 2-0 down to draw then really that entertainment starts becoming secondary to the actual rsults.

Keegan's Newcastle had the same reputation as the entertainers - only they actually performed far far better than we did in terms of results, but when their brand of entertaining meant they lost a league to united they became a laughing stock as did the manager.

we currently sit 6 points behind a Liverpool team who this seaosn you have mocked repeatedly for havign a crap manager and a crap set of players - not counting the fact we have to go to anfield still so likely we will sit 9 points or more behind them at the end of the season, how do you justify taking the piss out of klopp when with a inferior team and under more pressure than Martinez he has out performed him in the league?

11 points bejhind west ham mate, 5 points behind stoke, 6 points behind the rs, 2 points ahead of west brom, 3 ahead of the mighty bournmouth

The worst home defence in any of the top leagues in europe, 4 home wins all seaosn

So the new owner will look at the season in its entirety and be happy will they? what they will be happy that home fans are starting to boo at the preformances and results, that massive ammounts don't want this manager anymore, they will be happy that the maner made changes that entirely spun the league cup semi final from a commanding position to a total collapse will they? they will also be happy that we are a long way behind our loveable neighbours in the league as well ofc?

Why do we have to go through this melodrama after every defeat? Maybe the answer can be found in the amount of defeats at home, the style and cause of those defeats, the fact those defeats have happend against some utter rubbish teams and the fact that the manager currently resembles nero - fiddling whilst everything burns down around him, but what a beautiful entertaining song we play is what you'd say...

developmental season is it, wasnt least season one of those too? so far two of our young stars are way back on development btw over 3 months ago, del cant get on the pitch, stones has become a bit part player, as for galloway - not to be seen, but if you think that not winning any cup, and a 12th-14th place finish which is what you'd have to say looks likely is a good job then your a [Poor language removed] mentalist mate

The season isn't over mate: we have a chance to move up the table as well as down it, a decent chance of the former given a game in hand. As for questioning the development of the team's youngsters: you're having a laugh there. If there's one stick not advisable to use to beat Martinez with it's that one.

As a whole how can the season be described as anything other than a good/solid one when we competed well in all competitions? The two cups we've performed well enough and it could get better; the PL away from is more than respectable - it's very good in fact. The home PL form is woeful, no question. But that's about as easy a thing to remedy as anything can be to turn your home ground into a weapon rather than a hindrance to your ambitions.

I've said it before: people cant see the wood for the trees. Others outside the club see us in a very different light. And you know what the industry specialists who the new feller will be listening to will tell him: "they're not far off. Put a few quid in there and he'll buy well and you have a shot at doing something".

I'm here every so often talking people down off the ledge after a reversal of that nature. It's a periodic convulsion that goes nowhere and debilitates the fan base. It's a sad refection really on us, because we don't have the right to be demanding PL football with the peanuts spent out. Martinez has raised expectations with the type of players he's brought in and how he can have them playing and scoring from open play. That's what's happened here: raised expectations dashed on the rocks of home performances.

And that is just about the strength of it for anyone reasonable enough to bother to argue the facts rather than some emotive kneejerk bollocks.

 

[flibbyflob]

We lose the semi-final, does the balance of power tip to Martinez out?

He will never tip to getting rid no matter what.

As for the rest of us the balance of power is the other way and has been for a while. Only winning the cup will turn it round.

 

[TheHumbleEgg]

The season isn't over mate: we have a chance to move up the table as well as down it, a decent chance of the former given a game in hand. As for questioning the development of the team's youngsters: you're having a laugh there. If there's one stick not advisable to use to beat Martinez with it's that one.

As a whole how can the season be described as anything other than a good/solid one when we competed well in all competitions? The two cups we've performed well enough and it could get better; the PL away from is more than respectable - it's very good in fact. The home PL form is woeful, no question. But that's about as easy a thing to remedy as anything can be to turn your home ground into a weapon rather than a hindrance to your ambitions.

I've said it before: people cant see the wood for the trees. Others outside the club see us in a very different light. And you know what the industry specialists who the new feller will be listening to will tell him: "they're not far off. Put a few quid in there and he'll buy well and you have a shot at doing something".

I'm here every so often talking people down off the ledge after a reversal of that nature. It's a periodic convulsion that goes nowhere and debilitates the fan base. It's a sad refection really on us, because we don't have the right to be demanding PL football with the peanuts spent out. Martinez has raised expectations with the type of players he's brought in and how he can have them playing and scoring from open play. That's what's happened here: raised expectations dashed on the rocks of home performances.

And that is just about the strength of it for anyone reasonable enough to bother to argue the facts rather than some emotive kneejerk bollocks.

So why hasn't he mate?