Roberto Martinez Discussion - Including Live Poll (Poll Reset 1st May)

[oldblue]

Lots of what I've learnt is called anticipatory anxiety being thrown into the mix here. I'm really sure we shouldn't be getting depressed about games we haven't lost yet.
Try to imagine we win every game till the end of the season. You can even build in a Martinez sacking into the equation if you want.
Plenty of time to discuss why we have lost games when they've happened.

 

[chazzle_dazzle]

I know its from TeamTalk, but...

Smooth-talking Martinez fooling no one

Everton were so bad against Arsenal that even Roberto Martinez admitted it.

“We had doubt and we were pedestrian… It looked like a fearful performance.”

Such a cutting appraisal is rare from Martinez, who consistently shields his players from criticism. Even on Saturday, there was mitigation.

“It was a one-off,” said the Spaniard. Only, it wasn’t. This could turn out to be Everton’s worst ever season for form at Goodison Park.

This weekend brought the Merseysiders’ eighth defeat in front of their own supporters this season. As the Liverpool Echo have noted, that number is only one more defeat away from equalling the 1993/94 season, when the Toffees needed a second-half fightback on the final day of the season to swerve relegation. They must avoid defeat during visits from Southampton, Bournemouth and Norwich to avoid matching that wretched season 22 years ago, or the 1950/51 campaign – which were both 42-game seasons.

There is now a sizeable chunk of Evertonians who have grown tired of Martinez’s relentless positivity when it doesn’t tally with what they see from his team. Only their FA Cup run is saving him from even greater scrutiny, but that will surely come if Toffees fail to lift their first trophy in over two decades at Wembley in May.

Across Stanley Park, the previous Liverpool manager was often ridiculed for his ‘Brendanisms’. Martinez is lucky not to get similar treatment.

“My philosophy and my way of working is not to keep clean sheets, my philosophy is to win games,” said Martinez in January, seemingly failing to recognise that the two often go hand in hand. It was obvious again on Saturday that the Toffees don’t spend much time in training working on defensive shape. No wonder they have conceded more goals at home than anyone else in the league – three more than even Aston Villa.

How can that be, with “the best footballing centre-half” in John Stones and, ahead of him, Gareth Barry, “one of the best English players ever”, according to Martinez.

If the problem is not a lack of quality in the playing squad, then the manager must shoulder the responsibility for this season’s woeful underachievement following a bottom-half finish last year. He insisted last week that he is the right man to lead Everton into a new era with billionaire investor Farhad Moshiri, neglecting to mention that he failed in two out of three of his own critieria: “Whatever you’re fighting for: the FA Cup, fighting relegation, trying to get into the top four; I have that experience.”

Everton simply would not sack an FA Cup-winning manager and Martinez desperately needs that protection this summer.

 

[chazzle_dazzle]

As I posted earlier mate, I genuinely believe R Martinez has 'lost the players'...they no longer believe in him. The cabin crew no longer care about the cockpit...there is precedence for this you know. A much, much better manager than R Martinez recently suffered similar experience at Chelsea...

I heard an interesting thing on Saturday - that some of the more senior players have had more then just a few words with Martinez and are very unhappy with thats going on. One senior player has apparently made a call to Bill about the situation.

Now am not even sure i believe what i have been told but when you read some of the sound bites coming out, and the lack of fight in some of the players you have to think there is no smoke without fire.

Some managers have a knack of getting players to run through brick walls through them and never know defeat - Roberto is not the manager. So while the players are by no means faultless in this situation, i think its evident that there isn't much fight for the manager.

 

[Zatara]

LCB -- Mori / Galloway
DM -- Barry / McCarthy
CM -- Besic
LM - Cleverley
RW -- Deulofeu / Lennon
CF -- Lukaku

Also developing:
CB -- Stones
ACM -- Barkley

Interesting that Martinez has brought in an entire team there other than:

GK -- Possibly Robles but hes a 2nd choice
LB -- No one brought in
CB -- Jags 34 by season start
RB -- No competition for coleman

So thats the defence then....interesting that the modfield and attack do so well but not the defence (players martinez didnt sign).

I hope he punts some of them this summer and makes changes....lets see some hard decisions made.

 

[chazzle_dazzle]

LCB -- Mori / Galloway
DM -- Barry / McCarthy
CM -- Besic
LM - Cleverley
RW -- Deulofeu / Lennon
CF -- Lukaku

Also developing:
CB -- Stones
ACM -- Barkley

Interesting that Martinez has brought in an entire team there other than:

GK -- Possibly Robles but hes a 2nd choice
LB -- No one brought in
CB -- Jags 34 by season start
RB -- No competition for coleman

So thats the defence then....interesting that the modfield and attack do so well but not the defence (players martinez didnt sign).

I hope he punts some of them this summer and makes changes....lets see some hard decisions made.

All international defenders that don't become [Poor language removed] over night - bet no-one was saying they where rubbish the other year when we had one of the best defensive records... they are by no means faultless in this situation - but the fact that martinez in his own words; “My philosophy and my way of working is not to keep clean sheets, my philosophy is to win games,” and what near enough everyone knows is that he doesn't concentrate on defending in training, especially set pieces.

The problem with that Philosophy is.... he isn't winning. so his philosophy is flawed.

 

[Zatara]

I heard an interesting thing on Saturday - that some of the more senior players have had more then just a few words with Martinez and are very unhappy with thats going on. One senior player has apparently made a call to Bill about the situation.

Now am not even sure i believe what i have been told but when you read some of the sound bites coming out, and the lack of fight in some of the players you have to think there is no smoke without fire.

Some managers have a knack of getting players to run through brick walls through them and never know defeat - Roberto is not the manager. So while the players are by no means faultless in this situation, i think its evident that there isn't much fight for the manager.

Senior players who are probably dismayed their mates havent had their contracts extended OR senior players who are nervous as they may be sold in the summer?

 

[chazzle_dazzle]

Senior players who are probably dismayed their mates havent had their contracts extended OR senior players who are nervous as they may be sold in the summer?

No senior players who won't be sold. Footballers know "mates" move on they aren't that tied to the fact that happens....

 

[Zatara]

All international defenders... they are by no means faultless in this situation - but the fact that martinez in his own words; “My philosophy and my way of working is not to keep clean sheets, my philosophy is to win games,” and what near enough everyone knows is that he doesn't concentrate on defending in training, especially set pieces.

The problem with that Philosophy is.... he isn't winning. so his philosophy is flawed.

Put into context he actually was saying he wants to win games and if its 6-5 or 1-0 he wasnt bothered about conceding goals as long as we won....not sure why thats an issue.

Also its been stated that we do practice set pieces so not sure if youre getting that from that RAT osmans autobiography.....2 years old isnt it after we finished 5th anyway....or written then.

 

[Zatara]

No senior players who won't be sold. Footballers know "mates" move on they aren't that tied to the fact that happens....

So not:

Baines
Jagielka

 

[chazzle_dazzle]

Put into context he actually was saying he wants to win games and if its 6-5 or 1-0 he wasnt bothered about conceding goals as long as we won....not sure why thats an issue.

Also its been stated that we do practice set pieces so not sure if youre getting that from that RAT osmans autobiography.....2 years old isnt it after we finished 5th anyway....or written then.

That Rat Osman? whats that about not really sure why your calling him a rat - good servant to the club.

 

[MACCA75]

Put into context he actually was saying he wants to win games and if its 6-5 or 1-0 he wasnt bothered about conceding goals as long as we won....not sure why thats an issue.

Also its been stated that we do practice set pieces so not sure if youre getting that from that RAT osmans autobiography.....2 years old isnt it after we finished 5th anyway....or written then.

Rat, Osman? Christ the guy has given nothing but his best for Everton his whole career.

 

[Toast]

I heard an interesting thing on Saturday - that some of the more senior players have had more then just a few words with Martinez and are very unhappy with thats going on. One senior player has apparently made a call to Bill about the situation.

Deffo Osman that, the little snake.

 

[Igrok]

Who is to blame the fans,the ref,the players never the managers fault.

You forgot the calendar mate...all fixtures come at wrong time...

 

[chazzle_dazzle]

So not:

Baines
Jagielka

No it wasn't either of them, however they have both had words with the manager - interesting you think they'll be sold this summer??

 

[BlueToff]

Actually, has he ever said- I set the team up wrong, or I take responsibility?

In fairness to RM I think he rarely gets his set-up wrong in terms of formation.

It's how he instructs the team to sit off - or does he tell them to press but they are not up to it?

Against Chelsea we pressed high and unsettled them and the players all played well. Against Arsenal we sat off and they played through us and the players all played badly.

It's RM's inability or refusal to adapt in a game that is the issue. His set up in terms of formation is often spot on. I don't think anybody would have disagreed with his team selection on Saturday, for example...