Roberto Martinez discussion

[blue4eva77]

I know, thats why i find it strange.

Too many changes ? cannot get the chemistry on match day going consistently from one game to the next. Yes we have had injuries and we have to make changes but there has been a few times where changing the team just for the sake of changing is needless in my opinion.

I'm still fuming about our pathetic attempt at a pre-season and players looking like turd in our games that mattered because of fitness. Pre season is for this reason and we looked shocking back in August.

 

[Dymak]

He's already too scared to replace players that he has fell in love with. Howard will be with us for years, as will an ageing, not remotely creative Gareth Barry. They wont be replaced for another 2 or 3 years I reckon.

 

[Titus Bramble]

11th or lower should see him sacked no question

What if we win the UEFA cup and the FA cup?

 

[Titus Bramble]

He's already too scared to replace players that he has fell in love with. Howard will be with us for years, as will an ageing, not remotely creative Gareth Barry. They wont be replaced for another 2 or 3 years I reckon.

In fairness Gareth Barry is very important for how we set up our team, he's obviously not back up to full speed after his injury.

 

[davek]

But if we had got that No 10 you want, where would Barkley have played? You hate him on the wings and the only time I can recall him playing in a midfield two was the first half against Palace at home last season which was hardly encouraging. The past few games Ross hasn't seemed to want to tackle anyone, even when played in the middle, which is quite a big issue for a central midfielder.

It's a good point, but one that a club with serious ambitions shouldn't even bat an eyelid at. We have to have the depth that allows us to make decisions on whether Barkley is preferred as part of a team required to hit on the counter against pressing or overcommitting opposition, or the No.10 mentioned who could pick the lock more adeptly against teams getting bodies behind the ball and looking to frustrate.

The mind set seems to be that we have to have one single player who can do all this. If that player existed they'd be going for daft money.

 

[bol-uk]

Centre of defence needs gutting, IMO. I dont care about how Jagielka hasn't been as bad as the early part of the season; and Distin is just poison on and off the field now. It needs the pair of them gone. They offer next to nothing. We also need a creative player in behind Lukaku who can provide service to him.

He had a bad transfer summer and needs to spend in January to make up lost ground.

He's the same manager who got us a more points in this league than any other though. How can we even consider seriously questioning his ability after the first genuine rough patch we get?

He has this season and at least the beginning of next season to work with before I'd start calling for his head. And there's no way he'll need that much time to sort this out. He needs to be brave and cut the dead wood. Next summer Jagielka, Distin, Pienaar, Osman, all have to go - and maybe even Howard too.

IMO, Jags is still class and Howards has been very good in most matches recently. All keepers (other than the likes of Courtois Valdes etc) make mistakes. It is not the defence that is the issue, it is the lack f incisive movement,forward play and quality through balls that are sosting us.

 

[ijjysmith]

IMO, Jags is still class and Howards has been very good in most matches recently. All keepers (other than the likes of Courtois Valdes etc) make mistakes. It is not the defence that is the issue, it is the lack f incisive movement,forward play and quality through balls that are sosting us.

I get what you mean but we are scoring goals. I think we have 2 less than at this stage last season. Not that bad.

But the keeper and Distin are costing us wins at the moment.

 

[toffee matt]

Howard has made the most mistakes in the league this season.

It's blindingly obvious that he is currently a liability

 

[Moomin]

I get what you mean but we are scoring goals. I think we have 2 less than at this stage last season. Not that bad.

But the keeper and Distin are costing us wins at the moment.

Howard should have never been beaten in the near post, that's just poor from any level of keeper. Distin got beat twice be aluko. But, overall in that second half we were total dirge.

We were lucky after Diame never scored from Barry's mistake. Jags and Besic were lucky with passes in our half not creating scoring chances for Hull.

Teams in the premier league are onto us, and we are not altering our system to combat this.

 

[McBain]

We will have to agree to disagree mate.
Last season he was fresh and he hit the ground running playing quick tempo gutsy football.
This season we are so slow and predictable.
We are not getting players in the box so have to come back.
He has clipped the wings of coleman and baines.
His is playing players out of position.
Pre season was a farce.
He has no plan b now teams are reading us.
We seem to go sideways and backwards so much mistakes are bound to happen.
He missed a trick in the transfer window not bringing in a centre half and keeper.
Why did he bother with atsu?
It is harder being in the Europa league as well I admit that and as it happens he has done a great job there but to me he is more suited to that style of football.

apart from everything in here being just wrong, I'm confused by the 'clipped wings' part. Please elaborate as to how Martinez has 'clipped the wings' of the two best full backs in the League, one of whom is as per usual at the top of the Fantasy League for Defenders and the other with three goals and an injury stretch this season all ready.

the thing is this is Martinez's third high profile job and he has had the same result each time in the previous 2. He has lots of good ideas and tries to change the way the club works which is fantastic, but then ultimatly falls short through X/Y/Z. Perhaps this will change with us but we arent exactly going to flash the cash for him every year. He still needs to work on a budget which is harder to make that next step, unlike ferguson who once he built a team that could challenge up there he then was financially backed to maintain it.

Plus winning the F.A cup, is an achievement but so has Redknapp, Houlier / Mancini and none of them are considered top managers, average at best to be honest. the yard stick is not the one cup you have won

This makes NO SENSE whatsoever. Pretty sure this thing is a Troll. Avoid. Avoid. Avoid. Danger. Danger.

As for Martinez, there's no reason not to still be 100% behind him at this point.

I don't like how he's been trying to shoehorn Lukaku, Eto'o and Barkley into the same side lately (it'd be even worse if Naismith was fit), but I'm sure results will put a stop to it sooner rather than later. The system relies massively on having someone like Barkley to carry the ball at pace, and now that he's approaching full fitness I expect to see him starting behind whoever the form striker is.

Replacing Pienaar has to be the priority in January, as despite what some absolute balloons say about him, he's been one of Everton's most important players of recent years and his regular absences are creating huge problems.

Again, Shoehorning. Clipped Wings. Shoehorning. You know it seems sometimes people get an idea in there head and from there it becomes real. How can you possibly know what someone else is thinking or the process you have to get through to make a decision about anything? Decisions made internally may not make sense in relation to your perspective, but that only makes them incorrect to you. It's making a leap in judgement from idle speculation which has no merit for practical inspection, to a self confirmed fact, and only exists because you willed it into existence. Fascinating. Pienaar bit though - very true.

I'll be honest Tim Howard's slide has been horrifying to watch. I count that 10 times this season where he's lost or come close to losing us points.

Distin is unrecognisable

Barry is not the rock he was last season.

The team as a whole feels disjointed.

Don't understand that Mirallas substitution.

The one where he was coming back from injury and must be replaced because your Head Physio tells you you should take him off or it could be another six weeks out over the Christmas period? You don't understand it because you are not Manager of Everton Football Club.

Tim Howard has 'nearly' cost us 30 points? I can't even.

His subs on Sunday were strange, tonight's unexcusable. Crying out for Eto'o only available striker and he leaves him on the bench. How stupid

Yep. What a Stoopidhead.

You could manage a Football Team standing on your head!

The level of utter stupidity, and the rationalization by some on here that the ANY decision making process is such a straightforward one belies belief. I'm confounded as to how some of you manage to organise your fingers into a collective entity cohesive enough to aim them at the Keyboard and with enough perspicacity to do it in order.

May Your Wings forever be Clipped and Your Horns Forever Be Shoed.

 

[LinekersLegs]

It's a good point, but one that a club with serious ambitions shouldn't even bat an eyelid at. We have to have the depth that allows us to make decisions on whether Barkley is preferred as part of a team required to hit on the counter against pressing or overcommitting opposition, or the No.10 mentioned who could pick the lock more adeptly against teams getting bodies behind the ball and looking to frustrate.

The mind set seems to be that we have to have one single player who can do all this. If that player existed they'd be going for daft money.

In an ideal world I'd love a player like Oscar who can do both but as you say players like that go for daft money. But we have Barkley, Naismith, Eto'o and Osman who all can offer different things in that role. Overall I don't think our problems are breaking teams down - build up play may be dealthy slow but we usually score eventually, the only league game we haven't is Swansea.

But according to the guardian journos we have dropped 12 points from winning positions - we'd be 2nd if we'd held on in those games. A lot of those have come from individual errors that have been ruthlessly punished by our opponents. It is not all on the defence because we often don't seem to press which means any counterattack quickly ends up at our centre backs. It isn't even as though they can't do it - we've seen it from the same players both last season and in flashes this.

We just seem horribly inconsistent and not quite sure what it is down to as our older players are more guilty of it than our younger ones.

 

[DanEFC92]

 

[WarringtonBlue]

The one where he was coming back from injury and must be replaced because your Head Physio tells you you should take him off or it could be another six weeks out over the Christmas period? You don't understand it because you are not Manager of Everton Football Club.

Tim Howard has 'nearly' cost us 30 points? I can't even.

.

don't understand why mirallas was subbed for pienaar, . I assumed because he was substituted it was to rest his hammy. Pienaar hasn't played since Utd IIRC and he was dire, I expected Eto'o and McGeady to come on.

I count 10 mistakes Howard has made that are major blunders or have led to goals - not all of them has cost us points, but a lot have and most should. Nowhere did I say 30 points you inferred that point out of nothing

 

[Elong]

Interesting stat, Man Utd are behind yet they're in the top 4 this season. It's a funny league this year no doubt.

 

[kithnou]

A concern I have, and I am still prepared to be patient, is that in getting in a Continental Manager ( which I agree with), I would have wanted more young quality gems from Spain, Sth America etc that, apart from my man Deulofeu who was brilliant, are nowhere to be seen.
If we are going to play average skilled Scottish , Irish and Welsh footballers to play a Spanish/Sth American style football we may as well bring back Moyes because we are kidding ourselves.