Shipbuilding to end in Pompey

[bluejock]

Good old British Waste-Of-Space making an arse of things again.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Most of the ships in the world are built in South Korea aren't they?

 

[davek]

All this English/Scottish stuff: it's convenient for the government to sidestep the criticisms of ending the livelihoods of a thousand+ people to have the press pack getting workers at each others throats with the independent vote issue.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

It's not the government shutting the factory down though Dave. If the yards were as exceptional as some folks would have you believe, then they'd no doubt have lots of customers from overseas and wouldn't be in this situation. The reality is though that their only customer was the British government.

 

[carlos21]

It's not the government shutting the factory down though Dave.

i agree with you there.

 

[roydo]

It's not the government shutting the factory down though Dave.

Not directly, I agree. But with 3 frigates being built at Govan, and Portsmouth still being used as the RN base, and with servicing & refits still being done there, it seems to me that building all 3 new ships at Govan is a little odd.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

I mean there's a Guardian piece with Sir John Parker, former CEO of Harland and Wolff saying that back in the 80's he predicted a market for making cruise ships, which tend to be higher margin constructions. What's baffling however is that rather than blaming himself for not restructuring his business accordingly, he blames the government for not doing it for him.

No wonder the industry is in a pickle.

 

[roydo]

I mean there's a Guardian piece with Sir John Parker, former CEO of Harland and Wolff saying that back in the 80's he predicted a market for making cruise ships, which tend to be higher margin constructions. What's baffling however is that rather than blaming himself for not restructuring his business accordingly, he blames the government for not doing it for him.

No wonder the industry is in a pickle.

Kin el, they built the Titanic!!!

 

[Bruce Wayne]

http://www.theguardian.com/business/2012/jun/10/britains-last-few-shipbuilders-course-fiscal-storm

"One of my big industrial disappointments or even failures is that I failed to persuade the government of the day that there was a big future in building cruise ships. Whoever used run-of-the-mill bulk carriers or tankers drifted to the lowest-cost country. So how you survived in higher-cost countries was more sophisticated ships like cruise ships. I saw that there was going to be a lot of growth in cruise ship building so we demonstrated that this was a real growth industry. And nearly 25 years on, those forecasts would have underestimated the demand."

Hard to believe isn't it?

 

[davek]

It's not the government shutting the factory down though Dave. If the yards were as exceptional as some folks would have you believe, then they'd no doubt have lots of customers from overseas and wouldn't be in this situation. The reality is though that their only customer was the British government.

The decision was taken by BAE with the endorsement of the government. There's no disentangling the state from this industry.

 

[Coach]

We have got no aircraft carriers and half a fleet. Here is the Ark Royal now

Makes me laugh all this "nothing to do with the Government". Who cancelled all the orders for ships then?

 

[Bruce Wayne]

So the taxpayer should continue funding ships it doesn't need, just to keep an industry that has not managed to secure a single external client alive? That's madness.

 

[roydo]

So the taxpayer should continue funding ships it doesn't need, just to keep an industry that has not managed to secure a single external client alive? That's madness.

Its a difficult one for me. I am normally on the same side of the fence as you Bruce, but this was a nakedly political decision with the Scottish vote next year in mind. As such, if the Scots go their own way, then England have no ability to build Naval ships.

I think that stinks. Re not getting clients outside of government contracts, I have no idea about that. If true, then that is unforgivable.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Politicians are sods and no mistake, so it wouldn't surprise me one bit if they didn't decide to play politics over this or any other matter. The idea that they're public servants and not self servants is I think rather naive.

I just think that the viability of a company or industry should not rest on it having one client, no matter how large that client is. That's just asking for trouble.

 

[Groucho]

So the taxpayer should continue funding ships it doesn't need, just to keep an industry that has not managed to secure a single external client alive? That's madness.

As far as I know, up here Cammell Laird do repairs to existing ships, as opposed to building more.

At the moment, I think.