Southgate to remain England manager (For a While)

[davek]

Come on, Hazard was arguably the 3rd best player in the world from 2016-2019 while Martinez was manager, he was better than De Bruyne at that time.

Martinez made full use of Hazard and Lukaku in his forst 3/4 years. Is it his fault that Lukaku bottles big games like the SF against France in Russia? Three gilt edged chances he had to get the Belgians through to a fnal they'd have stood a great chance of winning.

 

[davek]

Im not. I am pondering why one manager with no trophies is a failure, while one with no trophies is the bestist ever.

The answer lies in the context: England are held to account much more than Belgium because of the vast resources the former have.

 

[roydo]

Martinez made full use of Hazard and Lukaku in his forst 3/4 years. Is it his fault that Lukaku bottles big games like the SF against France in Russia? Three gilt edged chances he had to get the Belgians through to a fnal they'd have stood a great chance of winning.

Lukaku and another player got him out of jail against the might of Japan didnt he?

 

[davek]

Lukaku and another player got him out of jail against the might of Japan didnt he?

That was just the flow of the game. Teams go behind and then turn it again.

A manager with a 72% win rate with Belgium cant reasonably be questioned about his credentials to lead that team. On the other hand we know through experience how many times Lukaku fails to produce in important games.

 

[roydo]

That was just the flow of the game. Teams go behind and then turn it again.

A manager with a 72% win rate with Belgium cant reasonably be questioned about his credentials to lead that team. On the other hand we know through experience how many times Lukaku fails to produce in important games.

True. The flow that is. Happened yesterday.

But lets see what club/country comes in for him. For the record, if Southgate had left England, I doubt his list of suiters would be any better.

 

[MikeH72]

Martinez made full use of Hazard and Lukaku in his forst 3/4 years. Is it his fault that Lukaku bottles big games like the SF against France in Russia? Three gilt edged chances he had to get the Belgians through to a fnal they'd have stood a great chance of winning.

Could you not say exactly the same about Southgate, Kane bottling big chances in games against Croatia and France, players missing pens in a shootout in the Euros final?

 

[DavidH]

He's a god send to the FA. He's had a reasonably good record from the last 3 major tournaments (despite beating one good side) so they know there won't be a clamour to sack him. Nothing but a yes man.

 

[davek]

Could you not say exactly the same about Southgate, Kane bottling big chances in games against Croatia and France, players missing pens in a shootout in the Euros final?

You could, but you'd be arguing that a man who got England to the SF in 2018 and then only the QFs in 2022 was going backwards and the best thing to do wpuld have been to resign...especially if he's also saying his family are getting stick.

 

[MikeH72]

You could, but you'd be arguing that a man who got England to the SF in 2018 and then only the QFs in 2022 was going backwards and the best thing to do wpuld have been to resign...especially if he's also saying his family are getting stick.

I don’t want this to look like I’m defending Southgate because I don’t rate him at all and want a change of manager for England, this is purely Roberto Martinez-bashing on my part.

 

[Billy Dean]

To not even qualify in 94 was abysmal as was the failure to qualify for Euro 08 with the squad we had then. I think that’s my point overall about Southgate when people say he’s England’s best manager since Alf Ramsay, look what he’s up against in that contest, it really doesn’t mean a lot. I think he’d be properly found out in club management, I don’t rate him as a manager at all.

I see it differently in that although he's had very talented squads, the failures of more illustrious managers who went before him, with equally if not more talented players, shows that he's done a good job overall and deserves some credit. But obviously he's got his limitations. Would definitely be interesting to see what kind of job he'd get in club football. Probably not one of the big 6. Seeing what he's done whilst working for the FA makes me think he might be more suited to being a DOF

 

[JobForTheMoyes]

When an actual good manager is in charge it makes a big difference in internationals. Look at how Mancini befuddled Gareth with a weak Italian side, or how Van Gaal nearly toppled Argentina at this World Cup. The likes of Bobby and Gareth can be given the tools but it matter if due to their shoddy workmanship at the crucial moments.

 

[Billy Dean]

When an actual good manager is in charge it makes a big difference in internationals. Look at how Mancini befuddled Gareth with a weak Italian side, or how Van Gaal nearly toppled Argentina at this World Cup. The likes of Bobby and Gareth can be given the tools but it matter if due to their shoddy workmanship at the crucial moments.

He's definitely not a worse tactician than Moyes

 

[EFCthechosenone]

When an actual good manager is in charge it makes a big difference in internationals. Look at how Mancini befuddled Gareth with a weak Italian side, or how Van Gaal nearly toppled Argentina at this World Cup. The likes of Bobby and Gareth can be given the tools but it matter if due to their shoddy workmanship at the crucial moments.

But Mancini failed with the WC qualification

 

[carolinablue232]

As long as he isn't coming to Everton, just need Martinez to find a new job now.

Don’t worry. Dave says all the top clubs are after him. We’re safe

 

[TheBigIguana]

I actually think this is really good for England. A lot of international management is just getting the team to gel in a quick period and he's shown he's quite good at that. His tactics really aren't terrible (the US just played a pretty solid game guys) and another day they might beat France be the ones who get to lose to Messi and Argentina in the final. They've got a real shot in 2024 especially if they can find a 3rd midfielder who properly complements Jude and Rice.