Summer Transfer Window 2017

[Mikey_Fitzgerald]

 

[Slippin Jimmy]

If you're referring to Osako, then yes.

The major difference between us and Spurs yesterday was the creative players they can turn to. In fact, that's the major difference between us and all those above us. We have bucket loads of sweat and endeavour but nothing, short of Barkley getting on the ball and doing something out of left field now and again, in terms of creativity. Our team's character is all about hard working and it's simply not enough. Which is why ridding us of a player like Deulofeu made no sense, btw. However inconsistent he was he did offer us the odd bit of flair and creation that could work for us. Now we have a lot of hard runners and little more. Playing that quartet of CMs yesterday just hammered home the hard work / creativity imbalance in this team he's building.

As for 'we need LB competition for Baines'. Sorry, we need a LB - period.

Agree with that, I don't know what people are expecting us to do though coz we're going to be given £30 mill tops in the summer if we're lucky and creative players is never a priority with us although we need atleast 2 of them.

 

[davek]

Agree with that, I don't know what people are expecting us to do though coz we're going to be given £30 mill tops in the summer if we're lucky and creative players is never a priority with us although we need atleast 2 of them.

The clubs at the top all have at least two:

Liverpool: Lallana and Coutinho
Chelsea: Fabregas and Hazard
United: Mata and Mkhitaryan
Spurs: Eriksen and Alli
City: Silva and Toure and De Bruyne
Arsenal: Ozil and Cazorla

We have Barkley, but he's being increasingly neutered and played with the emphasis upon work rate rather than creativity.

 

[bluestevon]

The clubs at the top all have at least two:

Liverpool: Lallana and Coutinho
Chelsea: Fabregas and Hazard
United: Mata and Mkhitaryan
Spurs: Eriksen and Alli
City: Silva and Toure and De Bruyne
Arsenal: Ozil and Cazorla

We have Barkley, but he's being increasingly neutered and played with the emphasis upon work rate rather than creativity.

Heres the thing though Dave, you do have a point, but your letting a bit of bias get in the way at the end, basically about Barkley and his development as a player udner Koeman.

Take those players you have listed:

Lallana - gone from avarage to looking a very good player the majority of this season - as Klopp now has him working his arse off in games, Coutinho - similar, he is now working a lot more than any other season, the result - both of them are performing better.

Hazzard - works exceptionally hard when Chelsea don't have the ball - and obviously when they do, the thing that seprates his 3 seasons at Chelsea are last seaosn he took the foot of the gas and basically became a luxury player who stopped putting in the effort and his game nosedived as a result, Fabregas - becoming more and more marginalised due to his defensive liabilities - and why he barekly features as a starter OR in any of the big games

Eriksen - Player who has covered the most distance int he entire league this season
Alli - regarded as a very energetic and hard working player with a very good engine on the lad

Mata - defensive liabilites, but the fact he has such great vision and creativity means he can get away with it (just about) still been bombed out by Mourinho once already and no surprise should he do it again this summer - entirely due to not being 'hard working' enough - Mourinho kind of wants the entrie package in a creative player.

Mkhitaryan - works his are off when in possession and one of the thigns that has him rated so much was how much hard work he puts in on top of his creative and flair side. Regarded as one of the Bundesligas hardest working players.

Toure - utter show ponjt these days, gets embarrassed in any big game and against any really good quality centre mids
De Bruyne - very hard working player
Silva - the expcetion - awful defensively and cant defend, but similar to Mata skill wise (if not better) also very very consistant

Ozil - goes missing any big game, a flat track bully, his attitude encapsulates everything wrong with Arsenal as a club the past 10 years.
Cazorla - great little player - hard working as well, Arsenal fell apart when he went missing.


So what Koeman is doing with Barkley is to try to turn Barkley into the type of player on a elite level, creative, hard working, and consistant, instead of a player who on his day can be brilliant and then on his day be like we are playing with 10 men instead.

Barkley isn't a good enough player to have such a massive area of weakness in his game and overcome it with his plus points, yes god enough with those flaws for a mid table or lower side t still be a 'star' - see aunautovic, the swiss hobbit, traore at boro and various other examples.

Like Komean or not, think he will do anything with us or not, the one thing he will have done is to have turned Barkley into a far more rounded and overall much much better player mate. For example look at the spurs ppost match reactions from our lot, i can neverremember a game we got comprehensively outplayed so much when Barkley wasn't getting it from all sides - after this he's the one player who universally is getting praised - that's down to the change in his game and the fact he is becoming a player with consistancy and more to his game than a 25y blast or really mazy run/flick whatever.

 

[davek]

Heres the thing though Dave, you do have a point, but your letting a bit of bias get in the way at the end, basically about Barkley and his development as a player udner Koeman.

Take those players you have listed:

Lallana - gone from avarage to looking a very good player the majority of this season - as Klopp now has him working his arse off in games, Coutinho - similar, he is now working a lot more than any other season, the result - both of them are performing better.

Hazzard - works exceptionally hard when Chelsea don't have the ball - and obviously when they do, the thing that seprates his 3 seasons at Chelsea are last seaosn he took the foot of the gas and basically became a luxury player who stopped putting in the effort and his game nosedived as a result, Fabregas - becoming more and more marginalised due to his defensive liabilities - and why he barekly features as a starter OR in any of the big games

Eriksen - Player who has covered the most distance int he entire league this season
Alli - regarded as a very energetic and hard working player with a very good engine on the lad

Mata - defensive liabilites, but the fact he has such great vision and creativity means he can get away with it (just about) still been bombed out by Mourinho once already and no surprise should he do it again this summer - entirely due to not being 'hard working' enough - Mourinho kind of wants the entrie package in a creative player.

Mkhitaryan - works his are off when in possession and one of the thigns that has him rated so much was how much hard work he puts in on top of his creative and flair side. Regarded as one of the Bundesligas hardest working players.

Toure - utter show ponjt these days, gets embarrassed in any big game and against any really good quality centre mids
De Bruyne - very hard working player
Silva - the expcetion - awful defensively and cant defend, but similar to Mata skill wise (if not better) also very very consistant

Ozil - goes missing any big game, a flat track bully, his attitude encapsulates everything wrong with Arsenal as a club the past 10 years.
Cazorla - great little player - hard working as well, Arsenal fell apart when he went missing.


So what Koeman is doing with Barkley is to try to turn Barkley into the type of player on a elite level, creative, hard working, and consistant, instead of a player who on his day can be brilliant and then on his day be like we are playing with 10 men instead.

Barkley isn't a good enough player to have such a massive area of weakness in his game and overcome it with his plus points, yes god enough with those flaws for a mid table or lower side t still be a 'star' - see aunautovic, the swiss hobbit, traore at boro and various other examples.

Like Komean or not, think he will do anything with us or not, the one thing he will have done is to have turned Barkley into a far more rounded and overall much much better player mate. For example look at the spurs ppost match reactions from our lot, i can neverremember a game we got comprehensively outplayed so much when Barkley wasn't getting it from all sides - after this he's the one player who universally is getting praised - that's down to the change in his game and the fact he is becoming a player with consistancy and more to his game than a 25y blast or really mazy run/flick whatever.

Yes, all or most of those players also work hard when they don't have the ball. But I'm not contesting that we should have creative players who are passengers in the team. Deulofeu won't ever manage the off the ball workload and maybe wouldn't have been the answer for us. But he does have something we don't have in the squad right now and should have been retained in order to throw on in games like yesterday where only creativity and not hard running could turn a game back our way.

As for Barkley: he might be applying himself a lot more, but it also is at the expense of him being the difference in games. Yesterday he won praise for putting himself about. I don't want to hear that, I want to hear about him coasting past Spurs players and driving forward our attack from deep to the edge of their box. I don't think Koeman has that balance of effort and creativity from Barkley you seem to attribute to him. I'm being 100% honest here when I say he looks a shadow of the player who burst into the team a few seasons back, and for two thirds of last season he was flying. I see now a lad who's doing what his manager demands and doing it for a quiet life. Jamie Redknapp might just have it right for once when he suggests Barkley would prefer pastures new than to hang about this squad and manager much longer.

 

[FTY]

Be good if Kier actually meant anything and you didn't just get a random logo to shoehorn your joke in

 

[bluestevon]

Yes, all or most of those players also work hard when they don't have the ball. But I'm not contesting that we should have creative players who are passengers in the team. Deulofeu won't ever manage the off the ball workload and maybe wouldn't have been the answer for us. But he does have something we don't have in the squad right now and should have been retained in order to throw on in games like yesterday where only creativity and not hard running could turn a game back our way.

As for Barkley: he might be applying himself a lot more, but it also is at the expense of him being the difference in games. Yesterday he won praise for putting himself about. I don't want to hear that, I want to hear about him coasting past Spurs players and driving forward our attack from deep to the edge of their box. I dint think Koeman has that balance of effort and creativity from Barkley you seem to attribute to him. I'm being 100% honest here when I say he looks a shadow of the player who busts into the team a few seasons back, and for two thirds of last season he was flying. I see now a lad who's doing what his manager demands and doing it for a quiet life. Jamie Redknapp might just have it right for once when he suggests Barkley wild prefer pastures new than to hang about this squad and manager much longer.

Fair points Dave, but can you honestly remember away from home Barkley ever being the difference in a big game?

Lack ofvflsir and creativity in some games maybe comes down to just not having the players and movement around him - which painfully we still badly lack, spurs for example doubled up every time he had it, don't think he's lost any of that side of his game at all, just think he's getting targetted as our only creative option more and more now, I actually think week in week out he's playing better noe than ever.

As for redknapp mate, no he's just an utter braindeaf cockwomble who cos he played for the rs who is now a lifelong red, spurs fans detest him as well, his birds fit and he's an ex cokehead with a famous dad, utter blert

 

[Mikey_Fitzgerald]

Be good if Kier actually meant anything and you didn't just get a random logo to shoehorn your joke in

Are you dissing the fine folk at Kier Group Construction Company?

Cos I have it on good authority that they're proper hench lar

 

[Saint Domingo]

Mikel Arteta circa 07/08 please.

 

[davek]

Fair points Dave, but can you honestly remember away from home Barkley ever being the difference in a big game?

Lack ofvflsir and creativity in some games maybe comes down to just not having the players and movement around him - which painfully we still badly lack, spurs for example doubled up every time he had it, don't think he's lost any of that side of his game at all, just think he's getting targetted as our only creative option more and more now, I actually think week in week out he's playing better noe than ever.

As for redknapp mate, no he's just an utter braindeaf cockwomble who cos he played for the rs who is now a lifelong red, spurs fans detest him as well, his birds fit and he's an ex cokehead with a famous dad, utter blert

I remember Barkley rampaging against Liverpool in his first big derby. Dropped back deeper second half after a reshuffle and he frightened the life out of them. It turned the match around and although it ended 3-3 and Lukaku scored two, Barkley was the big difference.

Overall, I see the balance between the work rate and creativity going from 30% / 70% respectively prior to Koemans arrival to 60% / 40% now. That to me is going in the wrong direction for a team crying out for creativity and vision on the ball.

 

[Barnfred 55]

Heres the thing though Dave, you do have a point, but your letting a bit of bias get in the way at the end, basically about Barkley and his development as a player udner Koeman.

Take those players you have listed:

Lallana - gone from avarage to looking a very good player the majority of this season - as Klopp now has him working his arse off in games, Coutinho - similar, he is now working a lot more than any other season, the result - both of them are performing better.

Hazzard - works exceptionally hard when Chelsea don't have the ball - and obviously when they do, the thing that seprates his 3 seasons at Chelsea are last seaosn he took the foot of the gas and basically became a luxury player who stopped putting in the effort and his game nosedived as a result, Fabregas - becoming more and more marginalised due to his defensive liabilities - and why he barekly features as a starter OR in any of the big games

Eriksen - Player who has covered the most distance int he entire league this season
Alli - regarded as a very energetic and hard working player with a very good engine on the lad

Mata - defensive liabilites, but the fact he has such great vision and creativity means he can get away with it (just about) still been bombed out by Mourinho once already and no surprise should he do it again this summer - entirely due to not being 'hard working' enough - Mourinho kind of wants the entrie package in a creative player.

Mkhitaryan - works his are off when in possession and one of the thigns that has him rated so much was how much hard work he puts in on top of his creative and flair side. Regarded as one of the Bundesligas hardest working players.

Toure - utter show ponjt these days, gets embarrassed in any big game and against any really good quality centre mids
De Bruyne - very hard working player
Silva - the expcetion - awful defensively and cant defend, but similar to Mata skill wise (if not better) also very very consistant

Ozil - goes missing any big game, a flat track bully, his attitude encapsulates everything wrong with Arsenal as a club the past 10 years.
Cazorla - great little player - hard working as well, Arsenal fell apart when he went missing.


So what Koeman is doing with Barkley is to try to turn Barkley into the type of player on a elite level, creative, hard working, and consistant, instead of a player who on his day can be brilliant and then on his day be like we are playing with 10 men instead.

Barkley isn't a good enough player to have such a massive area of weakness in his game and overcome it with his plus points, yes god enough with those flaws for a mid table or lower side t still be a 'star' - see aunautovic, the swiss hobbit, traore at boro and various other examples.

Like Komean or not, think he will do anything with us or not, the one thing he will have done is to have turned Barkley into a far more rounded and overall much much better player mate. For example look at the spurs ppost match reactions from our lot, i can neverremember a game we got comprehensively outplayed so much when Barkley wasn't getting it from all sides - after this he's the one player who universally is getting praised - that's down to the change in his game and the fact he is becoming a player with consistancy and more to his game than a 25y blast or really mazy run/flick whatever.

The simple fact remains though mate, as Dave said, we do need a second playmaker to help out Ross. Someone who can chip in with goals, take over set play responsibilities, and just generally take some of the weight off Ross in the creativity department. Sigurdsson isn't a bad shout and ticks the various boxes. Personally I would prefer somebody a bit cuter around the box, a Silva/Cazorla type player. Depends who is available and who we can attract. Said it before, I'd go after Lewis Baker if we can manage to prize him away from Chelsea.

 

[Barnfred 55]

Yes, all or most of those players also work hard when they don't have the ball. But I'm not contesting that we should have creative players who are passengers in the team. Deulofeu won't ever manage the off the ball workload and maybe wouldn't have been the answer for us. But he does have something we don't have in the squad right now and should have been retained in order to throw on in games like yesterday where only creativity and not hard running could turn a game back our way.

As for Barkley: he might be applying himself a lot more, but it also is at the expense of him being the difference in games. Yesterday he won praise for putting himself about. I don't want to hear that, I want to hear about him coasting past Spurs players and driving forward our attack from deep to the edge of their box. I don't think Koeman has that balance of effort and creativity from Barkley you seem to attribute to him. I'm being 100% honest here when I say he looks a shadow of the player who burst into the team a few seasons back, and for two thirds of last season he was flying. I see now a lad who's doing what his manager demands and doing it for a quiet life. Jamie Redknapp might just have it right for once when he suggests Barkley would prefer pastures new than to hang about this squad and manager much longer.

I agree that we shouldn't have got rid of Deulefeu without bringing in somebody similar during the transfer window. Whether he has a long term future with us or not, he offered something different from the bench that we don't have now. Wouldn't have made any difference yesterday but may have done away to Stoke and Middlesborough.

 

[DanB90]

Who's Kierracist Cryknee?

 

[Mikey_Fitzgerald]

Who's Kierracist Cryknee?

He's the best player in all of Prussia mate

 

[Mikey_Fitzgerald]

Mikel Arteta circa 07/08 please.

He's too busy failing to get into the Spain team mate, will have to cast our net wider