Install the app
How to install the app on iOS

Follow along with the video below to see how to install our site as a web app on your home screen.

Note: This feature may not be available in some browsers.

The 5/4/2016 pro Martinez thread

Status
Not open for further replies.
OK...who's the Pollyanna who's kicked this thread off?

Can the WUM please desist...
...failing that, I'll generously give Booby til Xmas 20( )*

*bracket to be filled by a (species endangered) Martinez cultist.
 
OK...who's the Pollyanna who's kicked this thread off?

Can the WUM please desist...
...failing that, I'll generously give Booby til Xmas 20( )*

*bracket to be filled by a (species endangered) Martinez cultist.
How does 2048 sound?
 
Ross is to his credit, and we've been good going forward for the most part this season mate, but mentality/tactics have scuppered that so we've been crap.
He hasn't got results, simple as that. Even if he wins most of the games left this season, he'll still have the axe hanging over his head going into next season from the fanbase.
A trophy will change things slightly but not enough, and there's no guarantees in that regard.

I love how he gets so much credit for a player who everyone already knew had talent.

Barkley is developing in spite of him.
 

Well not really, cos SAF was the same, he also came close to getting the boot, BUT, it was a vastly different era.

It's a legit argument tho. If United sacked fergie (which the vast majority wanted) then they don't have the history they have now. Absolutely nowhere near it infact.

In the day of 24 hour news cycles and instant gratification SAF and HK would not have made it.

It is the world we live in and better to accept it rather than fight it. It's the world we live in today.

Not saying it's right or wrong, but it is reality.

Ah the old Alex Ferguson argument

Sure, every manager who underperforms gets compared to him instead of the countless managers who didn't go on to become one of the greatest managers ever.

Bobby fa cup and relegation in same season
SAF European Cup winners Cup with Aberdeen

I know which I would hire
 
I can't win this argument as things stand, I know that.

But we have a semi final on the horizon and possibly a trophy in the cabinet to come.

It is not unthinkable we could totally kick on from there and become the best we could possibly be.

Fine margins have killed us this season and it's affected the players for sure.

A new season with finer tuning and momentum could see us absolutely destroy anything put in our way.

This is NOT a Mike Walker situation.

It absolutely is a Mike Walker situation.

The man's out of his depth.

4 home wins is not a fine margin
 
Do I need to quote my own post from two or so days ago that should've piped you down from using that? It is nothing to do with that. Times evolve, teams evolve, players evolve, fans evolve - things move forward. Sorry this isn't the 70s/80s when the fans were more patient. Also they probably were as Kendall was actually someone in the eyes of the fans and the board - he was already a Legend, not someone who relegated a side, but won a cup.

If you inherit a stable team and take it backwards you're in deep trouble.

So let's breakdown something here, as I was reading up on the topic earlier: Kendall vs Martinez.

Despite what the people are saying that the football and everything was crap (and it probably was, I can't say anything here for obvious reasons, but let's ignore that fact for one second) - when Kendall joined as manager Everton STALLED, i.e. finished 7-8th for 3 seasons straight, we didn't go backwards. In fact, Kendall took over, and we were a lot lower down the league, he picked us up and consecutively finished between 7th and 8th, for 3 years straight, before winning everything in sight. So, in other words (because you're Dave #2 and you'll clearly not understand, I'm guessing?), Kendall inherited a worse-off side, got them to a better league finish in the first time of asking, then kept them there until he actually progressed and we all know what happened next. As a side note - in all of Kendall's unsuccessful campaigns, so to say, Goodison was a fortress, as we have lost a total of 8 home games over 3 seasons.

Martinez, on the other hand, inherited a very stable side finishing 5-7th for the last 5 years or so, got them to finish... 5th (RECORD POINTS THO LAD 72 MAGICAL NUMBER THAT LAD, I know, but 5th is 5th), and now we've finished 11th once, and we're on course for a same/worse finish this year. To blatantly spell it out - he took a good side, and, in essence, ruined it, by finishing lower and lower, and playing worse and worse, and looking less and less competitive by the year. Might I also remind that he got a fantastic squad of players, added some very good players himself (all on him, RFM, Lukaku, Del, etc are his transfers obviously) and has somehow gotten worse. Signs of a good manager that I want to trust for another year, that.

Do you now, PROBABLY HOPEFULLY, see why people want Martinez out? Nothing to do with instant gratification of any sort, he's just out of his depth here, and it proves by the game. OH BUT WE'RE IN THE CUP LAD THOUGH is what you'll say, and well done to us/him for that. Except we lucked past Bournemouth who could've scored several times before we actually woke up up, as they had the chances, and the other two before that were the FA giants of... Carlisle and Dag & Red. Round after that, we beat Chelsea, was a good game, we actually looked solid. But, see, we can't look solid in 1-2 games and then look disorganised, gormless and spiritless for the next 5-6 every single time.

I hope we win the cup, but I also hope he goes after that. He's done for me, he's done for nearly everybody that supports Everton. Not because of instant gratification (AGAIN), but because he dug himself into a hole, by blaming everyone and their nan, instead of confessing he's made a mistake; also literally 3 years have passed since we've known he doesn't want to work on defence and set pieces, and both of those things have cost us plenty of games, and nothing's changed. THREE years.

I'm sure you're essentially WUM-ming a-la Davek here anyway, but thought I'd answer before I go to bed anyway, for fun.
Excellent post. Very well said.
 
In the day of 24 hour news cycles and instant gratification SAF and HK would not have made it.

It is the world we live in and better to accept it rather than fight it. It's the world we live in today.

Not saying it's right or wrong, but it is reality.

3 years now = instant

You need to stop spouting Dave's lines

Think about the facts and have an opinion
 

I love how he gets so much credit for a player who everyone already knew had talent.

Barkley is developing in spite of him.
In spite?
Nah.
Plenty of players have talent, few go on to be good or great players.
Ross has really developed into a much better player under Martinez as a result of the faith and trust in him, particularly how Martinez has allowed him to make mistakes.
He's a much more mature player now with plenty more to his game than he had as the talented stripling under Moyes.
Fully capable of running the game for us and contributing even when he doesn't score or assist. That didn't happen before.
 
You know if he wins the Cup he will not be dismissed. I want that trophy more than anything.

Sadly for me it will means there will be a dark stormy cloud continuing to linger over the club as we enter 2016-17.
Really? If we win the cup we've lifted the cup burden off us, we're back in Europe, we're going into our first transfer window and then season under our new billionaire. I'd say it would be looking quite nice.
 
In spite?
Nah.
Plenty of players have talent, few go on to be good or great players.
Ross has really developed into a much better player under Martinez as a result of the faith and trust in him, particularly how Martinez has allowed him to make mistakes.
He's a much more mature player now with plenty more to his game than he had as the talented stripling under Moyes.
Fully capable of running the game for us and contributing even when he doesn't score or assist. That didn't happen before.

He was 17 before.

He has matured and developed but that would have happened under any manager. He was already around the fringe of the 1st team with moyes

And yes mistakes are good if used as a learning opportunity but I think Martinez hurts him and stones by constantly spouting about how good they are despite poor performances
 
Really? If we win the cup we've lifted the cup burden off us, we're back in Europe, we're going into our first transfer window and then season under our new billionaire. I'd say it would be looking quite nice.

We're back in Europe and Bobby has his excuse for next seasons poor performance lined up
He loves the FA cup he gets away with murder because of it.
 

Status
Not open for further replies.

Welcome to GrandOldTeam

Get involved. Registration is simple and free.

Back
Top