The Everton Board Thread (Inc. Bill Kenwright / Blue Union)

[mawders]

The prefix "in" adds all of that? My dictionary defines "Tangible" as thus: a : capable of being perceived especially by the sense of touch : palpable b : substantially real : material
2
: capable of being precisely identified or realized by the mind <her grief was tangible>
3
: capable of being appraised at an actual or approximate value <tangible assets>

The last sentence is key. The predicament we are in, is that Accts and banks don't recognise players value.

We will have to agree to disagree on this. Sorry to hammer this home. In the academic literature, which I am very familiar with, a tangible asset is something which a firm either owns or has access to which can be bought or sold on the market (called Strategic Factor Markets). An intangible asset is something that cannot be bought and sold on the markets and therefore the firm that holds that assets, such as reputation or customer loyalty, can have a competitive advantage over rivals. For example, Man Utd have a huge support in China. This is intangible because everton cannot just go out and buy this support. In terms of players, clubs own the registration of players which are bought and sold on the market. This makes players tangible assets of clubs, for the length of the contract at least. The fact that it is difficult to value players is besides the point. They are tangible because they are tradeable. End of.

Now, what should have been said by the person who was interviewed which would have made that person appear more knowledgeable (and therefore have more credibility) is.....the club have either sold or mortgaged off tangible property-related assets such as Bellfield and Goodison. The only other tangible assets of significant value that the club hold are the players. However due to the severe fluctuations in their value because of market vagaries and characteristics of players themselves that are out of the clubs control (age, form, injuries etc) plus the illiquid nature of the 'assets', banks and other institutions do not usually allow player valuations to be included on balance sheets. So although the club could sell players to raise capital, it cannot borrow against them. Therefore, the club currently has no means of generating income other than the commercial ventures it already performs and the performance of the team on the pitch. We are demonstrating because we, the fans, cannot understand why a club like everton which has huge worldwide support and a long, rich tradition, is failing so dramatically on the commercial front. We also do not understand what is making everton unattractive to buyers. We ask for more transparency, and if certain members of the Board either cannot or will not invest their own money (which is normal at a football club) then we ask them to stand aside, or at least relinquish responsibility for commercial ventures, because they are clearly not creating any value for the club

 

[Summerskin]

Ffs why can't we spend money like Man City Kenwright out!

 

[paulbefc]

FFS

Anyone else spot the advertising on the main site? He's sold out on us!!

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

 

[steken1]

Ffs why can't we spend money like Man City Kenwright out!

Show me an Evertonian who has asked for that at any point?

 

[neonleon]

You asked the question how an investor can make money from football? You said you will go and march if I gave you a perfectly plausible answer, which I did. Does this mean I'll see you at the march?

United's ground weren't always that big, they weren't always considered the worlds biggest club, they went 20 odd years without getting near the title and they were as poorly managed at one point as we are now. Does this scenario ring any bells?

Someone with foresight and acumen saw the potential and developed what we see today, that happened on and off the pitch. Who's to say that can't be us in 20yrs time??? Or do we just give up and slide aimlessly away from view?

I didn't say leveraged buyouts were the way forward or that the Glazers are great, but even the most myopic septic tank can see how they have developed the club. I agree with the green and gold campaign because as things stand football stinks. But I'd rather us be winning while it stinks that stagnate and potentially die. United have been in 3 of the last four CL finals and have picked up league titles non stop since the Glazers took over. They weren't as succesful in europe as they are now before the takeover. That can't be argued!!!

First off, the bit in bold. Perhaps you'd like to answer my question. Or is your answer to "how can an investor make money from EFC?" - become a global brand like united get a leveraged buyouts from some Americans, do some high profile sponsorship deals and sell your best player then float on the stock exchange (results as yet only speculative).

Even the answer you gave as ludicrous as it was is full of holes. Aside from the main one that we aren't United, we don't know if they (man U) will float on the singapore stock exchange and what kind of money that will raise and how much stake the glazers would have to surrender (25 - 35%?). According to this report they hope to raise 1 billion dollars but may only raise 300 million pounds which laughably doesn't cover the 370 million pound debt they accrued onto the club by their own stinking greed.

They can do this, trading in the far east because United is such a huge global brand. Everton isn't. We can try to raise our profile by many means, indeed we are and we should do better, but becoming the largest brand in the world isn't a button we can press. It comes from success. Catch 22. Success comes from money. After Leeds there aren't many investors willing to bankroll success indefinitely. City and Chelsea. Any mention of Liverpool is short term, we've yet to see if they'll get sustained backing.

Everyone is looking at this emotionally, like a fan. Unless a billionaire fan buys us, chances are it'll be a business person demanding a return on his investment. Beyond brutally asset stripping Everton of players and then selling the club a season later I don't see where any profit can come from. A potential owner has to buy the club (£100 million odd) A stadium needs to be built or radically expanded. Corporate facilities improved. (150 million odd) Debts and overdraft cleared. (40 million odd)

300 million in the hole before any investment in the squad can begin.

How the hell does anyone begin to claw that money back let alone make a profit? The interest alone on borrowing that kind of money would be crippling.

 

[neonleon]

Chico is now in Elstone's brain as the OS clearly shows.

Expect Chang sponsorship to be ditched for Greggs and toffee lady to be replaced by busty babes.

 

[steken1]

Have you only been watching football for 5 minutes or something. In the early 80's when our neighbours were dominating everything United played in a 44,000 stadium before football fans could even spell the word corporate. They barely won a trophy and were in serious decline on and off the pitch. The Edwards family bought in, appointed the man who's gone on to be the best manager of all time and they both grew the club. Your completely right in that we aren't Man Utd but they are certainly off the pitch what we should aspire to if we ever want to compete at the top end of the game, ever again???

It's not full of holes at all. You never actually pointed any holes out.

You asked how an investor can make money from football. I explained one way and gave an example.

Are you saying that if the Glazers sold thier stake in United today they will have lost money? Of course not so thats how, hardly full of holes. If they float you can guarentee that 25% of that club will be worth at least 75% of what they paid. Thats profit, what you said can't be done. I'm saying that could be us in the future with the right people in charge, not neccesarily billionaires.

I don't know if you've noticed but EFC are already a global brand, were the fourth most successful team in the richest and most popular league in the world, that plays by far the worlds most popular sport. A man of vision would undoubtedly be able to grow that brand and capitalise on it. Similar to what the Glazers have done with Man Utd. Record profits of £110 mill. For the last ten years all Kenwright has done is cry poverty, even when we weren't that skint. Very, very bad PR.

I want to see us winning and if that means someone like the Glazers come in and take their pound of flesh I'd grudgingly accept that, stinking greed or not.

Maybe you wouldn't, I wouldn't criticise you for it but all I can read from your posts is that you think it's impossible for us to even challenge again, like our fortunes can't be altered without a billionaire. I don't think thats true.

Improve the business and the new ground or improvements may well pay for themselves.

 

[steken1]

I was thinking just that whilst reading it, where in for a long few years lar

Also the clubs been up for sale for three years??? Bill said 10, the Kirkby documents said were not for sale.

I wish Big Phil would make his mind up

 

[Lien]

Another fine mess.

 

[Carl J]

heard it all b4 believe it when i see it

 

[Hibbert&Ernie]

ye my 10 year old likes the snow as well

And that the organisers make everyone turn up in short pants.

 

[thebluefox]

And that the organisers make everyone turn up in short pants.

you r about has funny has getting kicked in the boll...ks by a size 12 pair of steeles

 

[Matt Damon]

Allegedly Chicoazul's new catch phrase is "Never miss another doodle".

Should of expected that. He likes to discuss his toilet habbits in the ale house.




As for Everton. Well The PR statements have been ridiculous, stupid and idiotic. Derek Hatton. FFS.

Then you've got Blue Union teds.


Its all a parody of itself.

 

[davek]

Have you only been watching football for 5 minutes or something. In the early 80's when our neighbours were dominating everything United played in a 44,000 stadium before football fans could even spell the word corporate. They barely won a trophy and were in serious decline on and off the pitch. The Edwards family bought in, appointed the man who's gone on to be the best manager of all time and they both grew the club. Your completely right in that we aren't Man Utd but they are certainly off the pitch what we should aspire to if we ever want to compete at the top end of the game, ever again???

It's not full of holes at all. You never actually pointed any holes out.

You asked how an investor can make money from football. I explained one way and gave an example.

Are you saying that if the Glazers sold thier stake in United today they will have lost money? Of course not so thats how, hardly full of holes. If they float you can guarentee that 25% of that club will be worth at least 75% of what they paid. Thats profit, what you said can't be done. I'm saying that could be us in the future with the right people in charge, not neccesarily billionaires.

I don't know if you've noticed but EFC are already a global brand, were the fourth most successful team in the richest and most popular league in the world, that plays by far the worlds most popular sport. A man of vision would undoubtedly be able to grow that brand and capitalise on it. Similar to what the Glazers have done with Man Utd. Record profits of £110 mill. For the last ten years all Kenwright has done is cry poverty, even when we weren't that skint. Very, very bad PR.

I want to see us winning and if that means someone like the Glazers come in and take their pound of flesh I'd grudgingly accept that, stinking greed or not.

Maybe you wouldn't, I wouldn't criticise you for it but all I can read from your posts is that you think it's impossible for us to even challenge again, like our fortunes can't be altered without a billionaire. I don't think thats true.

Improve the business and the new ground or improvements may well pay for themselves.

Spot on this, and follows up on your point yesterday that the incompetents running the club day to day and the absentee landlords who own it have talked Everton into the gutter.

Everton haven't capitalised in a decade of riches and commercial possibilities in English football because the parasites in the boardroom have had one goal: Plan A, to get a stadium built and pid for by others (even if it was a shed built in another town) and then to stick their hands out for a big pay day when they sold up. Twelve years of that, bolstered by selling anything and everything that had a valuation placed on. What a legacy.

I've said it before, Bill Kenwright will go down in Everton history as a more reviled figure than John Houlding.

 

[EFC-Liam]

Anyone heard the latest on the takeover talk? Got text this, this morning - Apparently the interested European investor is based out of Peckham, London. His name is Derek Trotter (known as Del Boy to his close associates) and he is the managing director of Trotters Independent Traders (T.I.T.). His business partner is believed to be his younger brother Rodney, the companies financial advisor. He possess two GCE's in mathematics & art. Although talks initially broke down when Del Boy went bankrupt, it is believed Kenwright was keen to resume talks after over hearing Del say "don't worry, this time next year, we'll be millionaires".

Rumours are also rife that the interested Chinese party is John, the owner of the Goodison Road Chippy, John's initial offer of a Curry Chip barm & a can of Pepsi was turned down by Kenwright, who is driving a hard bargain, demanding his preferred choice of drink.. a can of Fanta fruit twist.

Reports that Mr Chow is the other interested asian party are still unconfirmed.