"The High Press"

[Raino85]

How can you say it’s boring to try and win the ball high up the pitch and transition straight into attack at a fast tempo?

Every semi-competent team uses some form of press in this day and age. However it requires your players to all be very fit. We can’t press or play against a press because our fitness and conditioning methods are from the Tudor times.

It excludes actual football players!

There is a huge reliance on strength and/or athletisism, instead of actual technical ability.

James Rodriguez said a couple of years ago 'number 10s' are becoming extinct and i agree.
The likes of Cryuff, Gazza, James etc wouldnt be as effective in todays game

 

[Raino85]

I'm surprised more teams haven't adopted the Brentford tactic of hoofing it down the flanks or down the middle. This is surely the antidote to the high press. The Wimbledon team of the eighties would have a field day.

Brentford are a better team than just 'hoof it'.
More interesting to watch than all the red bull identikit tactics of the likes of leeds, southampton etc

 

[Raino85]

Wouldn't say it was built for that. It's been around for donkey's years. Just Jurgen Klopp convinced the world he invented it.

A high press has always been about.....yes!

But its never been so 'relied' on....or players picked for purely that reason!
Medicine & supplements & stats masters have sent it to the extreme.

We see so much less 'blammo' goals anymore as the players are told not to shoot from distance any more as the percentages probably tell them they are more likely to score by passing it to the centre back drawing players out.
Its all alot more boring because of it

 

[Raino85]

Look at the physique of the players then and now and the miles they run each game
One word: HGH

Look how many clubs have coaches/nutritionists/doctors/medicals with some sort of association in there career with one of the red bull sides!

Red Bull....a multi million £ company who have access to all sorts of sciences & data bases to help produce legal stimulators.

The everton side of the 80s did some sort of press, as did arsenal and others! But the most nutritional suppliment they put in there body was probably iron from guiness

 

[wandyr79]

A high press has always been about.....yes!

But its never been so 'relied' on....or players picked for purely that reason!
Medicine & supplements & stats masters have sent it to the extreme.

We see so much less 'blammo' goals anymore as the players are told not to shoot from distance any more as the percentages probably tell them they are more likely to score by passing it to the centre back drawing players out.
Its all alot more boring because of it

Be interested to see if any stats back this statement up and also why would that necessarily mean that football is more boring. A slick passing move that ends up with a close shot is a lot more technical than leathering a ball from 25 yards away, no?

For me, it has always and will always be about balance and creating a team structure that allows adaptability in play. For example, the best teams have players who can press consistently but once they win the ball back, they have the skilled players to make the press an effective tactic. Most, if not all, of the best teams have this balance.

 

[Stevie Nicks Bootleg]

It excludes actual football players!

There is a huge reliance on strength and/or athletisism, instead of actual technical ability.

James Rodriguez said a couple of years ago 'number 10s' are becoming extinct and i agree.
The likes of Cryuff, Gazza, James etc wouldnt be as effective in todays game

Yeah, I think Klopp himself said something like: "no playmaker can be as good as an effective counter-press", which is a shame that these kind of players can't thrive as much anymore- as there's much less time on the ball. Although, Cruyff in particular had other qualities that he would use had he been born in a different era and was primarily a goalscoring centre-forward as a young player.

 

[Stevie Nicks Bootleg]

Be interested to see if any stats back this statement up and also why would that necessarily mean that football is more boring. A slick passing move that ends up with a close shot is a lot more technical than leathering a ball from 25 yards away, no?

Yeah, i don't think the 'blammo' claim is true myself. An average goal of the month package form MOTD will typically see a fair few shots from outside the box. Using, say, Everton's best ever team (84-87)- you don't see many blammo's from that time at all. The odd Sharpy pearler and some Sheedy specials from set-pieces, but not many.

 

[Raino85]

Be interested to see if any stats back this statement up and also why would that necessarily mean that football is more boring. A slick passing move that ends up with a close shot is a lot more technical than leathering a ball from 25 yards away, no?

For me, it has always and will always be about balance and creating a team structure that allows adaptability in play. For example, the best teams have players who can press consistently but once they win the ball back, they have the skilled players to make the press an effective tactic. Most, if not all, of the best teams have this balance.

Mate, you started boring me after the first line you went on about stats!

Blammo = Crowd go mad
Blammo in off the post = Crowd go mad x 2

 

[Raino85]

Yeah, i don't think the 'blammo' claim is true myself. An average goal of the month package form MOTD will typically see a fair few shots from outside the box. Using, say, Everton's best ever team (84-87)- you don't see many blammo's from that time at all. The odd Sharpy pearler and some Sheedy specials from set-pieces, but not many.

Have A Hit Son: The Decline Of Long-Range Shooting In Modern Football

Part elegy, part statistical analysis, let's investigate what happened to the lost art of shooting from distance.

the18.com

Without making you read a lot of the durge & filler
It is around this period that declines in goals from outside the penalty area and goals from free kicks also began. EPL clubs scored 186 goals from outside the 18 in 2013-14 while also finding the back of the net on 39 direct free kicks. The league has not surpassed 145 long distance goals or 29 free kick goals in a season since.

The decline of the long shot was expedited by the increased use of advanced analytics. Stats like expected goals (xG) assign lower goal-scoring probabilities to shots from distance, thus encouraging players to take high-percentage shots closer to goal instead of less fortuitous "hit and hope" attempts from distance.

Much like its cousin the mid-range jump shot in basketball — which analytics have also demonstrated to be less effective — there are still many players who possess this skill, despite its perceived obsolescence. Managers won't tell capable players to abandon these shots completely, instead, they are encouraged to use them more infrequently.

 

[Stevie Nicks Bootleg]

Have A Hit Son: The Decline Of Long-Range Shooting In Modern Football

Part elegy, part statistical analysis, let's investigate what happened to the lost art of shooting from distance.

the18.com

Without making you read a lot of the durge & filler
It is around this period that declines in goals from outside the penalty area and goals from free kicks also began. EPL clubs scored 186 goals from outside the 18 in 2013-14 while also finding the back of the net on 39 direct free kicks. The league has not surpassed 145 long distance goals or 29 free kick goals in a season since.

The decline of the long shot was expedited by the increased use of advanced analytics. Stats like expected goals (xG) assign lower goal-scoring probabilities to shots from distance, thus encouraging players to take high-percentage shots closer to goal instead of less fortuitous "hit and hope" attempts from distance.

Much like its cousin the mid-range jump shot in basketball — which analytics have also demonstrated to be less effective — there are still many players who possess this skill, despite its perceived obsolescence. Managers won't tell capable players to abandon these shots completely, instead, they are encouraged to use them more infrequently.

I actually was thinking you were referring to football from further back than 5-10 years ago, hence my 1980s example, but I suppose you were referring to before the recent 'uber-cool' high-press approach, so apologies for that.

I read the piece anyway, which made some good points, although of the teams' approach seems a bit futile - e.g. "the last Premier League sides to attempt more than half of their shots from outside the area were Tottenham and QPR in 2014-15", which seems like a waste to me for the most. And interesting to read about Bobby Brown Shoes and his inclination to go all 'blammo' at Wigan, which surprised me.

 

[wandyr79]

Mate, you started boring me after the first line you went on about stats!

Blammo = Crowd go mad
Blammo in off the post = Crowd go mad x 2

???

I had my doubts and I was interested if it was actually true. There was absolutely no need to be such a prick about it.

I can see your next post, which is the stats of goals going in from long range. It is fair enough to assume that players don't try as much as they used to but again it still does not automatically mean that football, on the whole, is less entertaining.

 

[carolinablue232]

It excludes actual football players!

There is a huge reliance on strength and/or athletisism, instead of actual technical ability.

James Rodriguez said a couple of years ago 'number 10s' are becoming extinct and i agree.
The likes of Cryuff, Gazza, James etc wouldnt be as effective in todays game

Adapt or die. Same as everywhere else.