The return of David Moyes

[Dwight K Schrute]

As if going backwards and appointing Moyes was bad enough they have this thick melt on to talk about it. What the world must think of us with him as a spokesperson for the fans. He doesn’t speak for me that’s for sure.

View attachment 290160

Don't really see what's wrong with what he said there. Quite fair and even-handed. Better than every pundit telling us Dyche will keep us up and be careful what you wish for.

 

[RomanReigns]

There are a few things about Moyes that used to really bug me and, from what I saw at West Ham, I'm really not sure if it has changed:

1) He was awful with substitutions (an Everton manager trait tbf), nearly always negative (the Weir sub), nearly always too late.

2) Would always play favoured lieutenants who were amongst the worst players in the team over others (Neville and Hibbert spring to mind).

3) We never pressed high enough or aggressively enough. We tended to press between our own box and the half way line - far too negative.

4) Linked to the above - my biggest bugbear of all. When he wanted to see out a game, he always had us stand off and drop deep in effectively two banks of 4 to defend our box. This used to drive me mad. The amount of late goals we would concede from shots from outside the box from this tactic. Go back and actually watch it - it's insane. Everybody from Lee Hendrie to Drogba seemed to smash a late one in against us.

5) He did not value pace at all. We had so few pacy players who would get into attacking positions during his 11 year tenure. I believe he only signed Bent, Johnson, Coleman and Mirallas with genuine pace, yet used to play on the counter. Obviously, this would be the easiest to fix through different recruitment methods.

6) He had no idea how to identify or use a striker. The only really good one he signed was Yakubu. He used to get all strikers running the channel, whether it was Bent or a lump like Beattie. Saha, was massively overrated and only had one good season. I've heard people say: "if only he'd have had Lukaku." He would have had him running the line all the time (which would work occasionally, as Martinez did against Arsenal) but he lacked the technical ability to do that. Yakubu, had a great touch, a little burst of pace and was a good passer, as well as a good finisher. I think over 11 years his use of strikers was utterly horrendous and it continued to be at West Ham - persevering with Antonio because he'll run the channels over getting better players in.

7) Bigging himself up at the expense of the club - knife to a gunfight, plucky little Everton etc. Drives me mad and has stuck around ever since.

For the record, Moyes had lots of good qualities too and is miles better than Dyche. But I used to hate these things about him and have seen no evidence that any of these aspects have changed. I'm not even that bothered about the Utd move and the Baines thing - which seems to be the one sticking point for people. I am really not looking forward to this stuff again - and I know some of our other managers have done plenty of these things too.

I remember when he beat us 3-1 with arnautovic scoring as his striker

He can manage any group of footballers and will make it work somehow

West Ham United 3-1 Everton - BBC Sport

West Ham move up two places in the Premier League table to finish 13th after a Manuel Lanzini-inspired win over Everton in what could be the final game in charge for both managers.

www.bbc.com

 

[Dwight K Schrute]

I remember when he beat us 3-1 with arnautovic scoring as his striker

He can manage any group of footballers and will make it work somehow

West Ham United 3-1 Everton - BBC Sport

West Ham move up two places in the Premier League table to finish 13th after a Manuel Lanzini-inspired win over Everton in what could be the final game in charge for both managers.

www.bbc.com

Well beating Everton isn't much of a bellwether!

Not disagreeing with the other stuff I said then?!

 

[Marc bolan]

Last time moyes signed for us he was driving through Liverpool
And come out with the famous saying THE PEOPLE'S CLUB
Got a lot of blues on his side straight away

 

[Efcjake]

Like a wet fart

 

[RomanReigns]

Well beating Everton isn't much of a bellwether!

Not disagreeing with the other stuff I said then?!

I’ve already had my say on Moyes

Whether I disagree or agree with your points is irrelevant, everyone is entitled to their opinion

I just think he’s the right choice for now in order to bring us some stability and other don’t which is fine.

 

[windymiller]

I agree.

However, I wouldn't be averse to him on a short-term contract though if our top target is not available right now, whoever that might be.

He's not going to accept a short term contract, I wouldn't think.

 

[windymiller]

There are a few things about Moyes that used to really bug me and, from what I saw at West Ham, I'm really not sure if it has changed:

1) He was awful with substitutions (an Everton manager trait tbf), nearly always negative (the Weir sub), nearly always too late.

2) Would always play favoured lieutenants who were amongst the worst players in the team over others (Neville and Hibbert spring to mind).

3) We never pressed high enough or aggressively enough. We tended to press between our own box and the half way line - far too negative.

4) Linked to the above - my biggest bugbear of all. When he wanted to see out a game, he always had us stand off and drop deep in effectively two banks of 4 to defend our box. This used to drive me mad. The amount of late goals we would concede from shots from outside the box from this tactic. Go back and actually watch it - it's insane. Everybody from Lee Hendrie to Drogba seemed to smash a late one in against us.

5) He did not value pace at all. We had so few pacy players who would get into attacking positions during his 11 year tenure. I believe he only signed Bent, Johnson, Coleman and Mirallas with genuine pace, yet used to play on the counter. Obviously, this would be the easiest to fix through different recruitment methods.

6) He had no idea how to identify or use a striker. The only really good one he signed was Yakubu. He used to get all strikers running the channel, whether it was Bent or a lump like Beattie. Saha, was massively overrated and only had one good season. I've heard people say: "if only he'd have had Lukaku." He would have had him running the line all the time (which would work occasionally, as Martinez did against Arsenal) but he lacked the technical ability to do that. Yakubu, had a great touch, a little burst of pace and was a good passer, as well as a good finisher. I think over 11 years his use of strikers was utterly horrendous and it continued to be at West Ham - persevering with Antonio because he'll run the channels over getting better players in.

7) Bigging himself up at the expense of the club - knife to a gunfight, plucky little Everton etc. Drives me mad and has stuck around ever since.

For the record, Moyes had lots of good qualities too and is miles better than Dyche. But I used to hate these things about him and have seen no evidence that any of these aspects have changed. I'm not even that bothered about the Utd move and the Baines thing - which seems to be the one sticking point for people. I am really not looking forward to this stuff again - and I know some of our other managers have done plenty of these things too.

Remind you of any other recent managers?

 

[windymiller]

Last time moyes signed for us he was driving through Liverpool
And come out with the famous saying THE PEOPLE'S CLUB
Got a lot of blues on his side straight away

He's got a bit more baggage this time around.

 

[Dwight K Schrute]

I’ve already had my say on Moyes

Whether I disagree or agree with your points is irrelevant, everyone is entitled to their opinion

I just think he’s the right choice for now in order to bring us some stability and other don’t which is fine.

Fair enough. But you basically just replied to my comment which was a list of things about Moyes that clearly occurred over 11 years, with an example of when his West Ham team beat Everton and a Moyes has got dis, trust me bro (taps nose).

Wish I could share your optimism. I'm sure Moyes has learned a lot and developed his man-management skills as he's got older, but I still see all the same things that used to drive me mad in his teams.

 

[Dwight K Schrute]

Remind you of any other recent managers?

Absolutely.

But he is a better version of recent incumbents. But that is damning with faint praise.

 

[RomanReigns]

Fair enough. But you basically just replied to my comment which was a list of things about Moyes that clearly occurred over 11 years with an example of when his West Ham team beat Everton and a Moyes has got dis, trust me bro (taps nose).

Wish I could share your optimism. I'm sure Moyes has learned a lot and developed his man-management skills as he's got older, but I still see all the same things that used to drive me mad in his teams.

The issue with us and a lot of clubs right now is the lack of consistency which is why we are fighting relegation every season. We could beat Liverpool one week and then lose to Southampton the next week. You have no realistic expectation of a winning any games anymore.

What I liked about Moyes was his ability to beat the lower sides on a consistent basis and make it difficult for his teams to get beat especially at home. You were convinced under Moyes that you would beat someone like a Newcastle or a Fulham at home quite comfortably.

In recent years, goodison park has not been a fortress. Sides like Huddersfield have even got a point here and the likes of Sheffield United, Fulham, Bournemouth, Watford etc have beaten us comfortably. I remember Fulham had some ridiculous record of 50+ years where they couldn’t beat us at home. Even wolves beat us 3 times in a row at goodison until this season.

The last few years we have been getting around 3/4/5 wins out of 19 every half season which is bad, real bad.

We should be trying to aim for around 6/7/8/9 wins every half season

I believe that someone like Moyes can achieve that.

It won’t be pretty. It won’t be great at times but it will be consistent and just enough.

No one advocating for Moyes actually thinks he will make us world beaters that will qualify for Europe within 2 seasons. We just want to win the games we should be winning at home to the likes of Ipswich, Southampton and Leicester and finish comfortably in mid-table.

 

[Gwladys St. Glory]

The issue with us and a lot of clubs right now is the lack of consistency which is why we are fighting relegation every season. We could beat Liverpool one week and then lose to Southampton the next week. You have no realistic expectation of a winning any games anymore.

What I liked about Moyes was his ability to beat the lower sides on a consistent basis and make it difficult for his teams to get beat especially at home. You were convinced under Moyes that you would beat someone like a Newcastle or a Fulham at home quite comfortably.

In recent years, goodison park has not been a fortress. Sides like Huddersfield have even got a point here and the likes of Sheffield United, Fulham, Bournemouth, Watford etc have beaten us comfortably. I remember Fulham had some ridiculous record of 50+ years where they couldn’t beat us at home. Even wolves beat us 3 times in a row at goodison until this season.

The last few years we have been getting around 3/4/5 wins out of 19 every half season which is bad, real bad.

We should be trying to aim for around 6/7/8/9 wins every half season

I believe that someone like Moyes can achieve that.

It won’t be pretty. It won’t be great at times but it will be consistent and just enough.

No one advocating for Moyes actually thinks he will make us world beaters that will qualify for Europe within 2 seasons. We just want to win the games we should be winning at home to the likes of Ipswich, Southampton and Leicester and finish comfortably in mid-table.

Bang on; not that I've been exactly advocating for him...

 

[Dwight K Schrute]

The issue with us and a lot of clubs right now is the lack of consistency which is why we are fighting relegation every season. We could beat Liverpool one week and then lose to Southampton the next week. You have no realistic expectation of a winning any games anymore.

What I liked about Moyes was his ability to beat the lower sides on a consistent basis and make it difficult for his teams to get beat especially at home. You were convinced under Moyes that you would beat someone like a Newcastle or a Fulham at home quite comfortably.

In recent years, goodison park has not been a fortress. Sides like Huddersfield have even got a point here and the likes of Sheffield United, Fulham, Bournemouth, Watford etc have beaten us comfortably. I remember Fulham had some ridiculous record of 50+ years where they couldn’t beat us at home. Even wolves beat us 3 times in a row at goodison until this season.

The last few years we have been getting around 3/4/5 wins out of 19 every half season which is bad, real bad.

We should be trying to aim for around 6/7/8/9 wins every half season

I believe that someone like Moyes can achieve that.

It won’t be pretty. It won’t be great at times but it will be consistent and just enough.

No one advocating for Moyes actually thinks he will make us world beaters that will qualify for Europe within 2 seasons. We just want to win the games we should be winning at home to the likes of Ipswich, Southampton and Leicester and finish comfortably in mid-table.

Don't disagree with anything you said there mate but for me the bad significantly outweighs the good with Moyes.

All we can really do is hope that the old dog has learnt some new tricks. Won't be holding my breath though!

 

[RomanReigns]

Post in thread 'Today’s Football 2021/22 Season'

January 1, 2022

this west ham side look really good

would not suprise me if moyes won a trophy with west ham

• RomanReigns

• 
• 

And he did