Tom Davies

[catcherintherye]

Dowell shouldn't be in the first team squad atm though Dave, those who regularly watch the under 23s and the player himself have commented on his form this season being much down on last years.

Under 23s need to excel at that level to earn the step up - at least that's the way it should/needs to be to properly motivate them to keep improving.

Really the team can carry maybe one or two max luxury players, ones who don't quite put the workdays in of a Davies or gueye, atm Barkley and lukaku fall into that catagory as at times does mirallas, obviously the managers trying to change that with those, and to a degree is showing signs all of those are working much harder of late.

Dowell anyways is behind maybe 3-4 others at a guess in his chances of breaking into the squad, Kenny and maybe Walsh would both get a chance before him I'd say. obviously holgate and Davies already have. Lad really needs a good loan spell to show he's ready now.

From what Unsworth Dowell has filled out and grown 2 inches. I do think it makes a big difference (and probably underpins his loss of form).

It was strange, people were hard on Dowell in pre-season and against Norwich. I thought he played well pre season (a great run against MK Dons for example) and looked very lively against Norwich. I know he was very disappointed to be down the pecking order again but looks to be getting himself back not track.

The growth though will help him be able to compete physically. That is essential at this level especially for Koeman. I think a championship loan for him and Walsh (akin to Connolly) would do them the world of good. Getting 20 games of competitive football at that standard I think would have both ready for the first team squad next season.

What Koeman says is right though, you can't blood 10 Tom Davies's at once. Even Fergusan, who is held up as a template of how to do it didn't do that with his class of 92. If Davies, Holgate and possible DCL/Lookman can establish themselves this season then we can have a look at the next trench next season.

 

[davek]

I must say, I was well impressed with Korman's decision to start Davies against City. He clearly trusts good youth players if he thinks they are up to the job. Granted, he prefers larger, powerhouse type players, and I don't know too much about Dowell apart from that preseason, but I think if he's good enough he will play him.

Doubt he'd have played against City if Gueye had been available, tbh. Let's see if he plays today. I have my doubts.

 

[mightymoyes]

Doubt he'd have played against City if Gueye had been available, tbh. Let's see if he plays today. I have my doubts.

did you miss the southampton game he started when gueye was available?

 

[davek]

He's been bang out of form for the U23's, he even admitted in an interview the other day. That's why he and the club want him to go out on loan

Dowell shouldn't be in the first team squad atm though Dave, those who regularly watch the under 23s and the player himself have commented on his form this season being much down on last years.

Under 23s need to excel at that level to earn the step up - at least that's the way it should/needs to be to properly motivate them to keep improving.

Really the team can carry maybe one or two max luxury players, ones who don't quite put the workdays in of a Davies or gueye, atm Barkley and lukaku fall into that catagory as at times does mirallas, obviously the managers trying to change that with those, and to a degree is showing signs all of those are working much harder of late.

Dowell anyways is behind maybe 3-4 others at a guess in his chances of breaking into the squad, Kenny and maybe Walsh would both get a chance before him I'd say. obviously holgate and Davies already have. Lad really needs a good loan spell to show he's ready now.

All no doubt true. Although bad injuries can affect some players longer than others, and he had a bad one IIRC...and just as he was threatening to make a breakthrough. I can only say that from what I've seen of him he is clearly a talent. First touch is superb and he knows where the ball's going next before he receives it. Those are the qualities you look for.

I haven't seen Kenny or Walsh so cant comment.

 

[chippy1722]

From what Unsworth Dowell has filled out and grown 2 inches. I do think it makes a big difference (and probably underpins his loss of form).

It was strange, people were hard on Dowell in pre-season and against Norwich. I thought he played well pre season (a great run against MK Dons for example) and looked very lively against Norwich. I know he was very disappointed to be down the pecking order again but looks to be getting himself back not track.

The growth though will help him be able to compete physically. That is essential at this level especially for Koeman. I think a championship loan for him and Walsh (akin to Connolly) would do them the world of good. Getting 20 games of competitive football at that standard I think would have both ready for the first team squad next season.

What Koeman says is right though, you can't blood 10 Tom Davies's at once. Even Fergusan, who is held up as a template of how to do it didn't do that with his class of 92. If Davies, Holgate and possible DCL/Lookman can establish themselves this season then we can have a look at the next trench next season.

I would get as many of the better ones out on loan as we can, pre-season is normally when the good ones mix with the first team, and the more they play competitively the better it will be for them.

Lookman is young but he's played a fair bit in a tough league, the type of player he is, he will have been booted around in that league so should be prepared at least for the physicality of the PL.

 

[davek]

Wait till you see Liam Walsh mate. A fantastic footballer but lack of size could cost us him. He's akin to Paul Scholes at the end of his career.

The point you make is a good one. The manager values certain players and it may well cost Dowell & Walsh who I think would have "made the grade" under Martinez. I still hold out hope, it's good to hear Dowell has shot up and filled out.

It's why I hate a change in style from control of the ball to gaining territorial advantage. It can obliterate the careers of young players at a club at a stroke...talents that have been nurtured to play a certain way.

In theory this is what a D0F has to be employed for: to head hunt new mangers who can carry on a system/style already in place and improve on it.

 

[Eggs]

...fine article in the Times about Davies. Unfortunately I can't post the link but it reflects what a down to earth lad he is.

 

[davek]

did you miss the southampton game he started when gueye was available?

My (obvious) point is that he'll start Gueye in a match of that magnitude over Davies every time.

 

[mightymoyes]

My (obvious) point is that he'll start Gueye in a match of that magnitude over Davies every time.

or maybe both together like against southampton instead of barry.
you think he'll bring schnederlin in for him today?

 

[Eggs]

It's why I hate a change in style from control of the ball to gaining territorial advantage. It can obliterate the careers of young players at a club at a stroke...talents that have been nurtured to play a certain way.

In theory this is what a D0F has to be employed for: to head hunt new mangers who can carry on a system/style already in place and improve on it.

....we needed a change because we were going nowhere. You are saying we should've got somebody who buys into the Martinez way of playing because of youngsters like Dowell and Walsh but there is no guarantee those lads would come through anyway. Regardless, if they are good enough they should be able to fit the RK team model.

Strange argument you advocate. We want to be a better side, we want to be a successful side and if RK doesn't achieve that I'm sure he'll be gone.

 

[loooweee]

It's why I hate a change in style from control of the ball to gaining territorial advantage. It can obliterate the careers of young players at a club at a stroke...talents that have been nurtured to play a certain way.

In theory this is what a D0F has to be employed for: to head hunt new mangers who can carry on a system/style already in place and improve on it.

Get your point but looking at John stones last weekend and the nature of this league. I think we can have a bit of both tbh , look at alethico* they have loads of technically gifted youngsters playing in a very physical team (although it is la liga)

 

[davek]

or maybe both together like against southampton instead of barry.
you think he'll bring schnederlin in for him today?

I think he'll play Schneiderlin with Barry, yeah.

He should go with Davies, though. I couldn't think of anything worse if I were Davies and the manager handed me a place on the bench after that performance against City.

The position is his. Let Schneiderlin bide his time like anyone else.

 

[mightymoyes]

I think he'll play Schneiderlin with Barry, yeah.

He should go with Davies, though. I couldn't think of anything worse if I were Davies and the manager handed me a place on the bench after that performance against City.

The position is his. Let Schneiderlin bide his time like anyone else.

think and hope he'll keep the same team personally. suppose we'll find out in about 2 hrs.

 

[Connor]

I think he'll play Schneiderlin with Barry, yeah.

He should go with Davies, though. I couldn't think of anything worse if I were Davies and the manager handed me a place on the bench after that performance against City.

The position is his. Let Schneiderlin bide his time like anyone else.

Same team as last week, Dave.

 

[davek]

....we needed a change because we were going nowhere. You are saying we should've got somebody who buys into the Martinez way of playing because of youngsters like Dowell and Walsh but there is no guarantee those lads would come through anyway. Regardless, if they are good enough they should be able to fit the RK team model.

Strange argument you advocate. We want to be a better side, we want to be a successful side and if RK doesn't achieve that I'm sure he'll be gone.

It's not a strange argument at all. To argue for continuity in a style of play isn't to argue for the very same approach to defending.

Most great teams find their style and dont tinker with it. They tweak it and refine it; throw out parts of it that dont work...managers too if need be. But dont make a volte face on your identity as a club. If you do that every few seasons you are lost and confused as to what the hell it is you should be trying to achieve.

We shouldn't be going from direct route one football to possession football and then back to route one football. What sort of basket case club does that willingly?