What is the plan? Were are we heading?

[balggy]

I'm still fairly confident we will finish in the top 7, above Southampton, Stoke, West Ham etc.

That would take us back to where we were before Martinez arrived "best of the rest".

Considering our last two league campaigns, that would have to be seen as a massive improvement. I don't see how we could realistically expect anything above top 7 considering how poor we have been over the past two seasons.

Southampton were 13th on 2nd January when they got beaten 1-0 by Norwich. They were sat three points and two positions below Everton and we had a game in hand.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/35180064

Koeman then led Southampton to finish 6th place and 16 points above us.

So yes, we have a tough run coming up but least at lest try and get behind this bloke. Heads falling off all over the place this morning.

 

[l4toffee]

I'm going the pub. I don't know about anyone else

 

[BlueToff]

Hmmm.

The truth is he is only here because Moshiri let him write his own cheque.

He never wanted to be here but Moshiri made him an offer he could not refuse.

And Koeman was so "excited" about his big step up he went away on holiday before even making an appearance here.

Some boys on here raged about that fact at the time but most of us, myself included, shrugged our shoulders and blanked what was an obvious snub to our great club.

Whoever heard of a club announcing a new nanager but could not unveil him until he came back from Benidorm or wherever he was

Since then he has never tried to enthuse the fans either with words, a "statement of intent" as it were, nor even on the field of play.

We play a dull, sterile brand of football u dear Koeman.

His "marquee signing" is not a very good player but will no doubt keep his place on the team next game.

He is now presiding over what can only be described as a shambles......five points from the last eighteen and no one knowing where the next win is coming from.

COYB

Khal... He was on holiday already when the contract was signed.

And no we don't play a dull style.

When it's clicked so far (the few times it has) it has been delightful. However, we did get our arse handed to us last night.

But, we're sixth. We're higher now than we have been at any point in the last two years. Small steps and all that.

The plan is to be challenging for the European spots. There's still absolutely no reason why we can't do just that.

 

[Blue Cheese]

Khal... He was on holiday already when the contract was signed.

And no we don't play a dull style.

When it's clicked so far (the few times it has) it has been delightful. However, we did get our arse handed to us last night.

But, we're sixth. We're higher now than we have been at any point in the last two years. Small steps and all that.

The plan is to be challenging for the European spots. There's still absolutely no reason why we can't do just that.

Give over, It's boring as hell. Gone from one extreme under Martinez, attack, attack attack regardless of defence to put 11 behind the ball and hope to snatch a point.

How anyone can say we have not been dull is lying to themselves.

 

[BlueToff]

Give over, It's boring as hell. Gone from one extreme under Martinez, attack, attack attack regardless of defence to put 11 behind the ball and hope to snatch a point.

How anyone can say we have not been dull is lying to themselves.

Would you describe what we played under RM from January onwards as 'attack attack attack'? It wasn't at all. It was boring as sin. The thing was we regularly defended as bad as we did last night.

And no it hasn't. We've been, on the whole, winning. People were complaining last year about wanting points rather than style and now it's the other way around, they still aren't happy.

There's no excuses for what happened last night. None.

But it did happen and now it's all about a response. Showed how much we rely on Gueye, mind, to provide any energy in that midfield. Which is a worry but also, completely crumples this stupid theory about Koeman's signings being poor.

 

[Blue Cheese]

Would you describe what we played under RM from January onwards as 'attack attack attack'? It wasn't at all. It was boring as sin. The thing was we regularly defended as bad as we did last night.

And no it hasn't. We've been, on the whole, winning. People were complaining last year about wanting points rather than style and now it's the other way around, they still aren't happy.

There's no excuses for what happened last night. None.

But it did happen and now it's all about a response. Showed how much we rely on Gueye, mind, to provide any energy in that midfield. Which is a worry but also, completely crumples this stupid theory about Koeman's signings being poor.

No funnily enough, I'd liken Martinez last few months to yesterday and that's worrying. 11 games in and I've not seen anything to make me think this team can finish top half.

I'm not on the managers case yet, the players need a good look at themselves. I think the biggest disappointment is how we haven't capitalised on the 'new manager in' vibe. Lasted a couple of weeks now we are back to last march again.

Gueye sorely missed yesterday, Barry maybe just maybe is hindering our midfield, he's a good solid pro but he gets run circles around when a team have movement, the midfield is shocking and our forwards are all under the impression the manager doesn't rate them, it's not been a good start to his tenure off the pitch that's for sure. Not great on it either but we are 6th I mean papering over cracks comes to mind.

 

[Geoff Nulty]

I'm worried about the make-up of the board - Harris' appointment seems ridiculous to me - and the performances on the pitch, but the soonest best time to judge yesterday's result in particular and matters in general will be the end of January, when we'll know how we've gone about things on and off the pitch - lessons learned regarding attitude, recruitment, formation, style of play, points gained and so on. For me, though, one thing is crystal clear right now: the club's approach to communications is appalling.

 

[Toffeelover]

it would be very nice to hear the overall plan for the next 5 years, and going forward,from the one person who actually knows. no not koeman, and definatly not kenwright. our new 'major shareholder' mr moshiri.

the silence is starting to get absolutely deafening.

Koema's contract is only for 3 years.

 

[ianefc]

Koema's contract is only for 3 years.

So is Guardiola's, does that mean City have no plan?

 

[Toffeelover]

So is Guardiola's, does that mean City have no plan?

Can't say mate but they have more money. Ask yourself why did RK reject the offer from Saints and join us? Did he have a plan for Everton?

Mind we are all in a state of mega fume after yesterday's thrashing.

 

[ianefc]

Can't say mate but they have more money. Ask yourself why did RK reject the offer from Saints and join us? Did he have a plan for Everton?

To improve us. A completely disjointed squad, unfit, lacking in dicipline, no respect for previous managment, lacking an idea on what football is, completely lacking in defensive know how. That's the state of affairs he found here, he was never ever ever ever gonna sort that in a few months. Look at Mourinho at UTD look at Pochettino's start with Spurs, look at Klopp's start with Liverpool.

We've been woefully mis-managed to levels bordering unprofessional, in some cases (according to Barry) crossing the line in to non-professional territory.

Never going to be a quick fix.

 

[Toffeelover]

To improve us. A completely disjointed squad, unfit, lacking in dicipline, no respect for previous managment, lacking an idea on what football is, completely lacking in defensive know how. That's the state of affairs he found here, he was never ever ever ever gonna sort that in a few months. Look at Mourinho at UTD look at Pochettino's start with Spurs, look at Klopp's start with Liverpool.

We've been woefully mis-managed to levels bordering unprofessional, in some cases (according to Barry) crossing the line in to non-professional territory.

Never going to be a quick fix.

Ian, the true state I think has been glossed over not so much now but in the previous two season and by BK. In addition I have we been over confident in the standing of our club?

 

[Nil Satis Niasse Optimum]

Stekelenberg, thanks for those saves against City but too many errors already this season. Get Robles in until January then go all out for a top keeper.

Jagielka, been good for us without being outstanding, but never a captain or leader and his best days are long gone. Needs benching and Mori given a run in the team until January where Koeman can decide whether to stick with him or get a better player in.

Our left-sided problem. We used to be lethal down the left, it was a joy to watch Baines/Pienaar in their prime but now Pienaar is gone with no suitable replacement found, and Baines a constant crock. Oviedo can do a job every now and again, but is clearly not good enough to be our first choice left back. Baines ain't improving from here, so this position needs addressing, along with Mirallas who has so little impact on games it's unreal.

Coleman, sort yourself out! Used to be fantastic, but something has changed and that 60 grand song is starting to become a little embarrassing. No, in all honesty though he needs a rocket up his arse and to get back to the standards he was at two years ago. Still have faith in him and think he can come good.

Deulofeu, what's up with him? Can't remember the last time he did something positive on the field? I know he rarely starts (I agree with the decision too), but he was setting Lukaku up for fun just over a year ago. Now he doesn't cross, can't take on a man and is blowing out of his arse after being on the field for half an hour.

Barkley, what was the point of his cameo against West Ham if he's just going to be anonymous the very next game? Mr One-Good-Performance-In-Five (along with Bolasie).

No backup strikers of any quality whatsoever, yet wasting millions this season on players who'll never start or, when they come on, make any positive impact on the game.

How could the transfer window have gone so wrong? Will anything be addressed in January? Will the board even provide funds to the manager?

Players we have to keep and build around:
Williams (good for another 18 months), Holgate (no explanation needed), Gueye (no explanation needed), Davies (promising youngster), Lukaku (no explanation needed)

Players worth keeping as they could yet still come good:
Coleman (still love him, desperate for him to return to form), Mori (value is high, he may come good with us but if not could probably offload him for 15m in a year), Barkley (wouldn't want us to give up on a home grown talent just yet), Deulofeu (still has a chance)

Players to offload if any half decent offer comes in:
Robles (not good enough), Stekelenburg (not good enough), Baines (crock and finished as a top 6/7 left back), Jagielka (finished as a top 6/7 centre back), Mirallas (not good enough), Lennon (not good enough), McCarthy (not good enough), Bolasie (far too inconsistent), Oviedo (not good enough)

Players to get rid of ASAP:
Gibson (crock), Cleverley (nowhere near good enough), Besic (crock), Kone (waste of space)

Didn't include Barry (gone at end of season surely) or Valencia (loan).

I count that 15 players in the bottom two sections (and including Barry and Valencia) - no surprise really that we look like a bang average side at best, is it?

Koeman has so much to sort out it's crazy. If we don't bring in at least three decent players to challenge for a starting role we'll be looking at around 10th at best. Some statement after being taken over by a billionaire.

 

[ianefc]

Ian, the true state I think has been glossed over not so much now but in the previous two season and by BK. In addition I have we been over confident in the standing of our club?

Yes

 

[ianefc]

Ian, the true state I think has been glossed over not so much now but in the previous two season and by BK. In addition I have we been over confident in the standing of our club?

Martinez set this club back years. He had players thinking they were doing ok when they weren't, it's a mindset and one that can't be changed at the click of a finger?