Bent rejects WHU - will AJ be next?

[monty]

Time for my twopenneth

Would I sell ANY of our KEY players (ie. AJ for 20 mill, Arteta for 30 mill)

NO.

Reason being... I have posted somewhere else about this

"The minute you sell a player that has made it obvious he wants to stay, and the reason for selling that player is to finance other signings, do you not think that sends a message to the whole squad that "If you play well this year and help us succeed then your value will increase and we will sell you to bring in players that can enjoy what you helped us to create" I think that sends out a hugely negative vibe through the squad, the club, the supporters and the future signings that you may want to make."

I appreciate that we could get many more players for the money but they would not be tried and tested and already a part of our machine. This IMO opinion would be far too much of a gamble. Leeds did it if you remember with Ferdinand, Kewell, Smith etc, they fell flat on their faces as they were crap before they could succeed. I would sign cheap players for squad size improvements but they would have to be gradually introduced, and would take too long to make a recognisable improvement. I understand the reasons people are giving for wanting the money, but I honestly believe that the money does not create a better team. A good team creates a better team. And in this modern day times of over inflated prices would we be guaranteed of the players and would be be guaranteed they would actually be an improvement??

If I remember correctly the WHU story was also accompanied by the AJ's wife wants to go back south etc, sell

 

[Axlswhk]

Dont get me wrong, I can 'understand' why people might want to cash in,but I just disagree with it.
The european and african talent may or may not adapt to the premiership, its a gamble, then there's bedding-in time to consider even if they do 'come good'.
And who's to say if we find a cracker, someones not going to pay stupid money for him too?
Do we take that as well then go and buy another one?
Meanwhile the team is going sideways at best if not backwards.

I dont want to continue to be the feeder/selling club we have for the last 15 years.
Yet it seems to me some who are suggesting selling aj are advocating that exact mentality.

It's not a choice of whether you want to be a selling club or not. This cannot be control by an individual. Every footballer has a price tag, and it's not us to decide how much he's worth in our club. Your belove kenwright does that. If it comes to a point where we have to sell due to player's request or the price is too good to reject then so be it. And who says we won't improve if we sell our better players. We did better without rooney and gravesen!

 

[inertia3112]

It's not a choice of whether you want to be a selling club or not. This cannot be control by an individual. Every footballer has a price tag, and it's not us to decide how much he's worth in our club. Your belove kenwright does that. If it comes to a point where we have to sell due to player's request or the price is too good to reject then so be it. And who says we won't improve if we sell our better players. We did better without rooney and gravesen!

Of course we have no say in the final outcome, but my opinion is that we would be weaker, and its a very dangerous, negative, backwards step..
Thats all were talking about here is opinions.

I do think its risky to say 'who's to say we wont improve if we sell our better players though'.
Whilst I can see where your coming from to a degree, even you would say it would be a wrong motto for the club.

just one other thing too.......gravesen was , is, and always will be , a complete bag 'o [Poor language removed].

And whilst rooney isnt, he pretty much was for large parts of his last season with us.

 

[SuitsBlue]

whoa whoa whoa delila, gravesen was the fulcrum about which we manouvred ourselves into a top four position. I like tommy and reckon he gets unfair criticism in some parts.

 

[Rob]

Tommy was class for that one season, mostly becaus he had li tie covering his arse for 90mins and it worked a treat, also with carsley in the mix tommy was free to do what he does best.

 

[Neiler]

whoa whoa whoa delila, gravesen was the fulcrum about which we manouvred ourselves into a top four position. I like tommy and reckon he gets unfair criticism in some parts.

Seconded! New topic for "what grinds my gears" eh suits?

 

[micknick]

Seconded! New topic for "what grinds my gears" eh suits?

What topples my teepee?

 

[inertia3112]

whoa whoa whoa delila, gravesen was the fulcrum about which we manouvred ourselves into a top four position. I like tommy and reckon he gets unfair criticism in some parts.

his barmby-esque revival towards the end of his career as a blue, may well have played a part in getting to fourth.

Over the whole time he was here, the man was a liability.
As madrid and celtic, have already found out, and sheffield utd are apparently about to

 

[SuitsBlue]

i always wonder how the good and the greats of football would have been able to play in a midfield with the likes of nyarko, pembridge, gemmill, alexandersson, linderoth, tal , hughes.

as mentioned, when tie was put into midfield to do a lot of the running, gravesens passing game and work rate shone through and inspired the team to push on.

as for sheff utd, its unlikely that when they are championship destined that gravs wages will appeal.

 

[inertia3112]

i always wonder how the good and the greats of football would have been able to play in a midfield with the likes of nyarko, pembridge, gemmill, alexandersson, linderoth, tal , hughes.

as mentioned, when tie was put into midfield to do a lot of the running, gravesens passing game and work rate shone through and inspired the team to push on.

as for sheff utd, its unlikely that when they are championship destined that gravs wages will appeal.

fair point about the players alongside him, but linderoth, whilst not world class, has been a far better player everywhere else.

I still think he was a liabilty quite often, and possibly mad it harder for the above midfielders to adapt and operate effectively.

In a five man midfield, he looked far better its true.
He does possess some skill, and a lot of guile at times.
However, he cant tackle to save his life, for every tackle he won, he gave away three free kicks.
I lost count of the number of times he chased back on a players tail, then as soon as they got to a danger area he'd hack them down like a headless chicken and give them a free kick.
He was also guilty on many occasions of trying to play a square ball across the halfway line only to have it intercepted by the opposition and put us under presure.
He done this recently and cost celtic two goals against man utd in the champs league.

I know the grav debate has been done to death.
He infuriated me, and whilst I understand the support he gets, he had a bit of charisma, and could whip up a frenzy at a corner???, I cant endorse it myself.

Yeah he can be worked into a team with five in the middle to make up for his short-comings which is what we did when he looked better.
But that can strangle tactics and formations etc if you are always trying to accomodate him.

But either way we've moved on now.
Incidentally, I know you havent suggested you WOULD buy him back, but would you buy him back?
If we did how would you play him in our current set-up?

 

[SuitsBlue]

fair point about the players alongside him, but linderoth, whilst not world class, has been a far better player everywhere else.

I still think he was a liabilty quite often, and possibly mad it harder for the above midfielders to adapt and operate effectively.

In a five man midfield, he looked far better its true.
He does possess some skill, and a lot of guile at times.
However, he cant tackle to save his life, for every tackle he won, he gave away three free kicks.
I lost count of the number of times he chased back on a players tail, then as soon as they got to a danger area he'd hack them down like a headless chicken and give them a free kick.
He was also guilty on many occasions of trying to play a square ball across the halfway line only to have it intercepted by the opposition and put us under presure.
He done this recently and cost celtic two goals against man utd in the champs league.

I know the grav debate has been done to death.
He infuriated me, and whilst I understand the support he gets, he had a bit of charisma, and could whip up a frenzy at a corner???, I cant endorse it myself.

Yeah he can be worked into a team with five in the middle to make up for his short-comings which is what we did when he looked better.
But that can strangle tactics and formations etc if you are always trying to accomodate him.

But either way we've moved on now.
Incidentally, I know you havent suggested you WOULD buy him back, but would you buy him back?
If we did how would you play him in our current set-up?

Linderoth has been a far better player everywhere else - those places being not the premiership. lets see how he gets on in turkey.

As for grav being a liability, lets remember he was playing for us, for everton, Duncan Ferguson can tell you about the extra special treatment Everton players get from referees. With regards grav, i recall as clear as crystal massimo tarrico stamping on his (gravs) knee, grav took it, looked at the ref in disbelief then sat and waited for treatment (his shin pad written off there and then) - next game against spurs, 30 seconds in...crack, down went taricco, who i dont think finished the game. quality.

Another occasion, charlton at home, grav tackles one of theirs sweet pass into radzinski who scores - game finished one nil. notable for rooney getting a booking for intent - which was and is utter bollocks.

" hack them down like a headless chicken and give them a free kick."

ah this old gem, still cant understand the 'headless chicken' comment to this day, i dont know who came up with it but whoever it was should be in marketing and advertising because this 'theory' has got around so well and seems engrained in the psyche of many.

the recent CL game for celtic vs man ure, lets be fair, grav hadnt played first team for some months and had only recently arrived at celtic, but, there were many people that saw it and slapped themself on the back and said 'i always knew he was rubbish'.....'arent i the greatest'.

Grav back now? for me? in an instant, ....

............cahill
MGP......grav......arteta
............cars

attack and defence are better now and should alleviate(sp) the burden on the midfield.

If i remember correctly, England Denmark friendly at old trafford, denmark won, and man of the match was.... ????

 

[Rob]

Suits, give up on MGP already, it ain't gonna happen

 

[SuitsBlue]

8 mill clause in his contract, it can be done, it just takes the will to do it.

 

[micknick]

8 mill clause in his contract, it can be done, it just takes the will to do it.

You're a bit in love with a bloke called Morten

 

[inertia3112]

Linderoth has been a far better player everywhere else - those places being not the premiership. lets see how he gets on in turkey.

As for grav being a liability, lets remember he was playing for us, for everton, Duncan Ferguson can tell you about the extra special treatment Everton players get from referees. With regards grav, i recall as clear as crystal massimo tarrico stamping on his (gravs) knee, grav took it, looked at the ref in disbelief then sat and waited for treatment (his shin pad written off there and then) - next game against spurs, 30 seconds in...crack, down went taricco, who i dont think finished the game. quality.

Another occasion, charlton at home, grav tackles one of theirs sweet pass into radzinski who scores - game finished one nil. notable for rooney getting a booking for intent - which was and is utter bollocks.

" hack them down like a headless chicken and give them a free kick."

ah this old gem, still cant understand the 'headless chicken' comment to this day, i dont know who came up with it but whoever it was should be in marketing and advertising because this 'theory' has got around so well and seems engrained in the psyche of many.

the recent CL game for celtic vs man ure, lets be fair, grav hadnt played first team for some months and had only recently arrived at celtic, but, there were many people that saw it and slapped themself on the back and said 'i always knew he was rubbish'.....'arent i the greatest'.

Grav back now? for me? in an instant, ....

............cahill
MGP......grav......arteta
............cars

attack and defence are better now and should alleviate(sp) the burden on the midfield.

If i remember correctly, England Denmark friendly at old trafford, denmark won, and man of the match was.... ????

nah not having that spiel about the headless chicken mate.
He WAS a headless chicken, I didnt point out his lack of positioning being one of his main liabilities cause I really didnt think it needed saying.
And The reason so many people said 'i told you he was [Poor language removed]', was because he WAS [Poor language removed], but yet still gets support for the 4/5 months he was half decent.
But anyone who crows about being right is a bit of a tosser, which I wouldnt do, personally because I'll be proved just as wrong on other things, we all are, its the very nature of us all.

Now I know he had good games, like the ones you mention.
I did say he can be effective in the right scenerio.
I didnt say he had 'no' redeeming features.
But he took us for a mug for 3 years, and took us for a mug when we really needed to close ranks on that fourth spot, he [Poor language removed] off for a better offer.
I dont necessarily expect anyone to turn down madrid, but still, if he was so confident of his class(and it wasnt really carsley they wanted) they'd have been back in for him in the summer, and I may have more fondness for the shyster, if he'd have put us first.

Plus I have seen him with a mullet, explain that!