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2020/21 Carlo Ancelotti

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BlueStevie35 said:
Who would you play then? Seeing as how we’ve played Sig who’s a ghost, Gomes who’s badly out of form, Delph who’s perpetually injured and Davies who’s Davies. Or would you move formation to only have a 2 man centre?
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Anyone is a better option than Sigurdsson. Or, here is a maverick idea: Stop using the same sussed formation.
 
COYBL25 said:
You know what mate, year in year, no matter who the manager is, we get the same posters who piss their kecks in the Summer, when West Ham or Newcastle sign some B list striker. They then piss their kecks again, when we lose a few games and then soil themselves again January when we don’t sign Ronaldo.

It’s pathetic and embarrassing.
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While I totally get what you're saying, and there are always ridiculous kneejerk shouts, the truth is those people usually get proved right don't they? I mean we sacked our manager last year because we were in the relegation zone in December, having done almost exactly the same thing 2 years earlier. It's hard to have a go at people for saying things were going to go wrong when, well, you know, they did.
 
Lanolin said:
While I totally get what you're saying, and there are always ridiculous kneejerk shouts, the truth is those people usually get proved right don't they? I mean we sacked our manager last year because we were in the relegation zone in December, having done almost exactly the same thing 2 years earlier. It's hard to have a go at people for saying things were going to go wrong when, well, you know, they did.
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Some of the same people were having a near melt down over Mike Ashley and his Middle Eastern mates trying to pull a fast one over the sale of Newcastle and leaving us behind financially.

The new Man City they were calling them lol

Then they were wailing like Greek widows and predicting relegation by Christmas, as we hadn`t signed anyone within a week of the season finishing.

It`s like they hibernate when things are going well and the moment anything displeases them, up they pop like demented parrots.

It`s the same people season in, season out.

Like I said, pathetic and embarrassing.
 
gwladysnight said:
In this day and age it is about coaching, old school managers are a thing of the past. It is about improving players individually, so they fulfil their potential. Above all it is about coaching your players so that the whole of your team is greater than the sum of the parts.

Carlo isn't a coach, he is an old school motivator who now works under a Dof.

Carlo was successful in an era of old-fashioned managers. In an era of coaches he has relied on the likes of Clement who has been an abject failure at Derby, Swansea and Reading as a manager was Carlo's pick as first team coach. We now have Dunc and Carlo's lad coaching Everton.

Carlo comes in wows players with his reputation and personality and initially does well. Then the lack of coaching and fitness work catches up with his teams.

It isn't about the lack of quality in the squad it is about the lack of quality in the coaching department.
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What era was this then you speak of where he was successful? 10 years ago? 15 years ago? 20 years ago?

Last time I checked he'd won the CL 5 years ago, won the German league in 16/17 and was runners up with Napoli as well.

So by era, do you mean approx 2 seasons ago then?
 

COYBL25 said:
Some of the same people were having a near melt down over Mike Ashley and his Middle Eastern mates trying to pull a fast one over the sale of Newcastle and leaving us behind financially.

The new Man City they were calling them lol

Then they were wailing like Greek widows and predicting relegation by Christmas, as we hadn`t signed anyone within a week of the season finishing.

It`s like they hibernate when things are going well and the moment anything displeases them, up they pop like demented parrots.

It`s the same people season in, season out.

Like I said, pathetic and embarrassing.
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Fair enough, I assume I have them on mute.
 
Fact is, we should never have had a hope of getting a world class manager in Carlo and he deserves more time and resources than any previous manager.

The problem is that previous managers, Walsh and Mosh and arguably Brands, have wasted millions which means Carlo right now still has a bloated, unbalanced and beyond the first 11, not really good enough squad and it will take more than two seasons to fix that and give Carlo the team he wants and needs.

The manager is not to blame, the fact we still have to play Kenny, siggy, delph, iwobi when we lose one of our first 11 is a bigger issue that again cannot be fixed easily.

We have made a solid start to the season, we have an exceptional talent up front and are building a very strong first 11.

If fans are not happy with Carlo, the only manager we could get next would be a downgrade. Ridiculous.
 
Deulofeumygod said:
Fact is, we should never have had a hope of getting a world class manager in Carlo and he deserves more time and resources than any previous manager.

The problem is that previous managers, Walsh and Mosh and arguably Brands, have wasted millions which means Carlo right now still has a bloated, unbalanced and beyond the first 11, not really good enough squad and it will take more than two seasons to fix that and give Carlo the team he wants and needs.

The manager is not to blame, the fact we still have to play Kenny, siggy, delph, iwobi when we lose one of our first 11 is a bigger issue that again cannot be fixed easily.

We have made a solid start to the season, we have an exceptional talent up front and are building a very strong first 11.

If fans are not happy with Carlo, the only manager we could get next would be a downgrade. Ridiculous.
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(Do not think we should sack Ancelotti) My point is just to find a common understanding of what is an acceptable achievement. Then the discussion also becomes more constructive. But I disagree with some of the premises. I disagree that Ancelotti has a hopeless project, and that no matter what he does, he should be immune to criticism.

Based on the results of the last ten years, the salary budget, and the transfer budget to the club, we can not compare ourselves with clubs like Burnley. We are a top 10 club in the PL. If one agrees with that premise, and in addition agrees that Ancelotti is a world class coach, then one should be able to expect that the top 8 should be within reach. Then he performs about as expected, maybe a little better. One of the best coaches in the world should be able to do that, right?

Then you have those who argue that Ancelotti must have time to buy a completely new team, preferably world-class players. Yes, he should be allowed to build his own team, but given that he shows progression. He has already bought Allan, JR, AD, and BG. Let's see what he manages to get out of them until the next transfer window.

Secondly, the argument that he must buy himself into success (here I am thinking of the top 8), is more of a counter-argument against him being one of the world's best coaches. Of course, the sample size is far too small to be able to say anything certain about Ancelotti's project, and we know more towards the end of the season.
 
There is a very easy way to measure this if you really want.

The first 7 games Carlo had a fully fit & functioning squad. All wins , we even had the luxury winning from going behind in some games.And enough in the tank to cover a terrible keeper.

Then the Derby and the usual fallout & this time a media witchunt. Coupled with suspensions and injuries kicking in Carlo no longer has the option of putting out his strongest team. Look at the bench its dreadful.

It just shows we have a more than capable first 11 but a woefully short squad.
Give the man his first team and we go back on that run , give him quality in depth and we get a sustained run possibly getting some silverware & a crack at europe.

But yanno this takes time ( and money )
 

maccavennie said:
What era was this then you speak of where he was successful? 10 years ago? 15 years ago? 20 years ago?

Last time I checked he'd won the CL 5 years ago, won the German league in 16/17 and was runners up with Napoli as well.

So by era, do you mean approx 2 seasons ago then?
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I suggest you check again Carlo won the CL in 13/14 we are now in season 20/21.

In 16/17 may have won the League, but they did so with 82 points compared to 88 the season before he arrived. The following season he was sacked because Bayern were going backwards.

At Napoli he took over from Sarri whose Napoli achieved 91 points. Carlo got only 79 points in his first season and was on course for 46 points when he was sacked after 15 games. Again he took them backwards.

Usually managers take over clubs in the doldrums, Carlo took over Bayern after Pep moved on and Napoli after Sarri moved on. Both teams were excellent when he arrived but declined under Carlo. If you have an excellent squad and are already winning or challenging then Carlo is a pretty safe pair of hands. What he doesn't do is build clubs and improve them. That is what we need at the moment.

He is a gentleman and very popular with players, but he isn't what Everton require at the moment.
 
blulouie said:
There is a very easy way to measure this if you really want.

The first 7 games Carlo had a fully fit & functioning squad. All wins , we even had the luxury winning from going behind in some games.And enough in the tank to cover a terrible keeper.

Then the Derby and the usual fallout & this time a media witchunt. Coupled with suspensions and injuries kicking in Carlo no longer has the option of putting out his strongest team. Look at the bench its dreadful.

It just shows we have a more than capable first 11 but a woefully short squad.
Give the man his first team and we go back on that run , give him quality in depth and we get a sustained run possibly getting some silverware & a crack at europe.

But yanno this takes time ( and money )
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We only had Richarlison out against Southampton and we completely fell to pieces.

Do you think every manager in the league has the luxury of a fully fit squad to choose from every game?

Injuries and suspensions happen. It’s up to him to find a way to win without key players.

His tactics have been genuinely embarrassing over the past three games and I don’t think the Derby was much better either.
 
blulouie said:
There is a very easy way to measure this if you really want.

The first 7 games Carlo had a fully fit & functioning squad. All wins , we even had the luxury winning from going behind in some games.And enough in the tank to cover a terrible keeper.

Then the Derby and the usual fallout & this time a media witchunt. Coupled with suspensions and injuries kicking in Carlo no longer has the option of putting out his strongest team. Look at the bench its dreadful.

It just shows we have a more than capable first 11 but a woefully short squad.
Give the man his first team and we go back on that run , give him quality in depth and we get a sustained run possibly getting some silverware & a crack at europe.

But yanno this takes time ( and money )
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He inherited incredible squads at Bayern and Napoli though, he took both clubs backwards. When did he actually improve a club and take them forward.
 
GwladysBlue said:
We only had Richarlison out against Southampton and we completely fell to pieces.

Do you think every manager in the league has the luxury of a fully fit squad to choose from every game?

Injuries and suspensions happen. It’s up to him to find a way to win without key players.

His tactics have been genuinely embarrassing over the past three games and I don’t think the Derby was much better either.
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Southampton are a very good team atm and very difficult to beat.

No manager has a fully fit squad all the time but if you have aspirations of a top 4/6 finish you need a quality bench.
All them top sides are way better ours.

There was hardly a peep from you earlier this season but you must have been frothing at the mouth waiting for a poor run to vent your spleen like you always do.
Never used the ignore button yet but just maybe the 1st.
 

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