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Dunkirk

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degsy said:
Yeah right.
Tell that to the guy who didn't make it on to the last helicopter off the roof in Saigon.
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Well........The US did completely defeat and destroy the Vietcong. Then the NVA picked up the fighting. And the crap thing was for every advance/battle won, they gave it back a week later, then battled to take it back again a month later. A case of politicians dictating tactics and strategy to the people who know how to do it.

Though that war was 'lost' back home in the US. Seeing as it was a deeply unpopular war, we pulled out of Vietnam because of the promises politicians made forcing Ford to withdraw.

And the whole withdrawal was done badly as well. And as the support for the South was cut off entirely, and oil prices soaring meaning the South couldn't use their equipment, a whole lot of US hardware ended up in NVA hands.

We were certainly not a nice opponent to have during that time.
 

Dylan said:
Well........The US did completely defeat and destroy the Vietcong. Then the NVA picked up the fighting. And the crap thing was for every advance/battle won, they gave it back a week later, then battled to take it back again a month later. A case of politicians dictating tactics and strategy to the people who know how to do it.

Though that war was 'lost' back home in the US. Seeing as it was a deeply unpopular war, we pulled out of Vietnam because of the promises politicians made forcing Ford to withdraw.

And the whole withdrawal was done badly as well. And as the support for the South was cut off entirely, and oil prices soaring meaning the South couldn't use their equipment, a whole lot of US hardware ended up in NVA hands.

We were certainly not a nice opponent to have during that time.
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Human suffering on both sides aside as it were, Historically around the world how is it seen? - draw or loss.
 
degsy said:
Human suffering on both sides aside as it were, Historically around the world how is it seen? - draw or loss.
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The only winners were the Commie North!

It is all conjecture, and I know war has real tangible effects on people, but if the actual tacticians and strategists were given a free hand, the outcome would have probably been very different.
 
Uhmm, for a bit of context, IIRC, the British at Dunkirk suffered more fatalities than the US did in Vietnam for the whole time we had forces there (just looked it up....68,000 British killed at Dunkirk in less than two weeks vs 58,000 US killed from 1955-1975).

In the US we kill 20,000 people a year from drink driving!
 
Dylan said:
The only winners were the Commie North!

It is all conjecture, and I know war has real tangible effects on people, but if the actual tacticians and strategists were given a free hand, the outcome would have probably been very different.
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Is the right answer.

As the Politicians 'Control' the Generals, 99/100 times the result would have been the same...it was pretty much an 'Unwinnable' war as you are likely to find.

I'm pretty sure @johnnydawg68 just forgot to engage his sarcastic font...but I couldn't let it pass, so I gave him a tickle.
Time to move on, both historically and literally.
'There was never a good war, or a bad peace' - Ben Franklin.
 
Dylan said:
Uhmm, for a bit of context, IIRC, the British at Dunkirk suffered more fatalities than the US did in Vietnam for the whole time we had forces there (just looked it up....68,000 British killed at Dunkirk in less than two weeks vs 58,000 US killed from 1955-1975).

In the US we kill 20,000 people a year from drink driving!
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add to that the 19,000 on the first day of the Somme, you might say we're trending down.

 

LEONARD said:
I saw this at Fact today. A disappointment for me on a few levels.

The opening few minutes are really impressive, with retreating troops in action in the back streets of Dunkirk.

The Hans Zimmer soundtrack tends to drown out a lot of the dialogue, and the structure is basically a set of mini-stories rolled into one.

I appreciate it's not meant to be history or a documentary, but as a film I found it floored.
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*flawed
@tommye
 
Dylan said:
Well........The US did completely defeat and destroy the Vietcong. Then the NVA picked up the fighting. And the crap thing was for every advance/battle won, they gave it back a week later, then battled to take it back again a month later. A case of politicians dictating tactics and strategy to the people who know how to do it.

Though that war was 'lost' back home in the US. Seeing as it was a deeply unpopular war, we pulled out of Vietnam because of the promises politicians made forcing Ford to withdraw.

And the whole withdrawal was done badly as well. And as the support for the South was cut off entirely, and oil prices soaring meaning the South couldn't use their equipment, a whole lot of US hardware ended up in NVA hands.

We were certainly not a nice opponent to have during that time.
Click to expand...
Nothing personal, but American foreign policy in the following decades was just as disgusting, the obsession with everyone bowing to a few rich men's way of life
 

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