England v USA, 12th June 2010

[ToffeeHeel]

As a Carolina basketball fan, I will openly pull against any US Mens Basketball team coached by Coach K. My guess is that among Carolina fans, it's 50/50 those who will support the team and those who will not. So not every American basketball fan pulls for the American basketball team by default.

 

[Goat]

I still reckon we will win 4-0 to be fair.

 

[jdeezy]

England usually finish in and around the quarter final stage, I think that is where they are at this current time, I'd say they are achieving realistic goals. The English media would have you believe differently but there is nothing special about this group of players.

Except this is still a game, one of chance, in which teams which are slightly below or inferior to others can still, on any given day, pull out a WIN. So if you're a consistent quarter finals level team on talent, logic stands that, over time, once in awhile you should actually make or even WIN a final. Because quite often what most would consider the "best" team does not in fact win the major tournaments.

Germany & Italy, imo, are the best 2 examples. Their leagues are overwhelmingly considered inferior to EPL, their individual players I would argue are not lightyears ahead of England's by any means. Yet they consistently, as collective units, outperform england in major tournaments. So consistently I find it hard to ignore emerging trend & examine potential root cause(s).

And I'd start my investigation into said causes with:
1. Media
2. Fans & supporters (or lack thereof)
3. Players themselves, attitudes, etc.
4. Governing body, administrators, etc.

Pretend you're simply not good enough until you're blue in the face if it helps you sleep at night. I, for one, ain't buyin' it. And, that casually dismissive & subtly pessimistic attitude in itself speaks volumes to the very point. If you're a quarter final team, then work harder, be better at something, & find a way to overachieve & get beyond the quarters. The first place I'd look if I were captain of the English ship would be your collective mirrors.

 

[chicoazul]

England are [Poor language removed].

 

[Mutzo Nutzo]

England are [Poor language removed].

Arteta for England

 

[NHRevs]

On the flip side, your reference to your proud Liverpool heritage made me stop & think. I thought about myself, who while I've been in florida for a good time, really grew up in new york & still very much associate w/ those roots. And, then I thought about how over the top, intense, & even obnoxiously dismissive of basically "everywhere else" new yorkers can be. We kind of consider NY as the center of the universe (which, to be fair, we kinda ARE!), & OBVIOUSLY the center of America (w/ a couple other "small" cities as sidekicks, some coastlines & other cool places to visit on occasion thrown in for good measure). And I realize this attitude doesn't come across or sit well w/ many other americans across the country.

I still, however, root for a new yorker & texan just the same when our colors are on the line, & would like to think most texans would do the same. But maybe I'm not in the best position to fully understand or appreciate your guys' side of it. I suppose I'm more akin to a Londener who's difficult to not begrudge even when in theory we should be rootin' together for country??

Ah well, good insights either way.

To extend this a little - yeah, I'm a Revs supporter, and that's somewhat passionate because my history with the team covers more of the history of the team. But I'm not a New England native, so while I do watch the Pats, Celts, Sox from more or less a supporter's perspective, it's certainly not passionate. However, I bleed maize and blue for the Michigan Wolverines, have since I was born, will until I die. That's where my passionate support lies and (for American sports) always will. I will even try to rationalize some of the latter day unpleasantness *ahem*

I think the thing is, though, there are large numbers of Americans for whom the US team ISN'T their team. 1st generation immigrants get a complete pass; 2nd generation get half a pass....after that...we've got large chunks of the soccer-supporting population that look to other countries first - Italy, Mexico, a few others, rather than the U.S.

 

[jhf14]

England vs. USA... LEGO STYLE

http://www.youtube.com/v/gXo2nm2ODF0&hl=en_US&fs=1&

 

[jdeezy]

To extend this a little - yeah, I'm a Revs supporter, and that's somewhat passionate because my history with the team covers more of the history of the team. But I'm not a New England native, so while I do watch the Pats, Celts, Sox from more or less a supporter's perspective, it's certainly not passionate. However, I bleed maize and blue for the Michigan Wolverines, have since I was born, will until I die. That's where my passionate support lies and (for American sports) always will. I will even try to rationalize some of the latter day unpleasantness *ahem*

I think the thing is, though, there are large numbers of Americans for whom the US team ISN'T their team. 1st generation immigrants get a complete pass; 2nd generation get half a pass....after that...we've got large chunks of the soccer-supporting population that look to other countries first - Italy, Mexico, a few others, rather than the U.S.

Ah, I see. So you've got that Michigan/Ohio State thing goin' on. Tbh, as much as I love passionate rivalries, that one always seemed to cross the line into borderline weird territory. The whole grown men acting like (or trying to) they're 19 & in college again. Probably b/c I never went to one of those "big" schools where the sports teams are religion. But dated couple chics who went to either of those 2 & somehow that rivalry always ended up creeping me out.

Maybe it was just the girls???

Yeah the whole U.S. soccer sorting is impossible. It's all over the place hell if I can figure it out. But it's growing, which is good. And England still could do for an attitude tuneup

 

[ToxtethBlue]

Except this is still a game, one of chance, in which teams which are slightly below or inferior to others can still, on any given day, pull out a WIN. So if you're a consistent quarter finals level team on talent, logic stands that, over time, once in awhile you should actually make or even WIN a final. Because quite often what most would consider the "best" team does not in fact win the major tournaments.

Germany & Italy, imo, are the best 2 examples. Their leagues are overwhelmingly considered inferior to EPL, their individual players I would argue are not lightyears ahead of England's by any means. Yet they consistently, as collective units, outperform england in major tournaments. So consistently I find it hard to ignore emerging trend & examine potential root cause(s).

And I'd start my investigation into said causes with:
1. Media
2. Fans & supporters (or lack thereof)
3. Players themselves, attitudes, etc.
4. Governing body, administrators, etc.

Pretend you're simply not good enough until you're blue in the face if it helps you sleep at night. I, for one, ain't buyin' it. And, that casually dismissive & subtly pessimistic attitude in itself speaks volumes to the very point. If you're a quarter final team, then work harder, be better at something, & find a way to overachieve & get beyond the quarters. The first place I'd look if I were captain of the English ship would be your collective mirrors.

Well I watch alot of football and I don't think England/English players are as good as people make out. They lack the composure that the top teams have and aren't developing top class, technical midfield players who are at ease at this level. The Premier League is what it is because of the influx of foreign players and the obvious mix of styles which makes it such a unique League.

So if there is a problem, in my opinion, it's at youth level, the development of young players. As for the current players, they perform how I expect them to, decent side, but nothing special.

 

[bluebloodinmyveins]

Stop moaning you lot FFS. Try having a national team that struggles to beat San Marino.

 

[jdeezy]

Well I watch alot of football and I don't think England/English players are as good as people make out. They lack the composure that the top teams have and aren't developing top class, technical midfield players who are at ease at this level. The Premier League is what it is because of the influx of foreign players and the obvious mix of styles which makes it such a unique League.

So if there is a problem, in my opinion, it's at youth level, the development of young players. As for the current players, they perform how I expect them to, decent side, but nothing special.

I agree they're overhyped & overrated. And I also think a top class technical mid would make world of difference. Don't know enough about the development system. But now that you mention it, Arteta could do some major damage in the current side. Could be difference in beating top sides.

So let's revise my list of to dos for England to include: operation nationalize-specifically geared (but not limited to) spain/brazil

 

[chicoazul]

Stop moaning you lot FFS. Try having a national team that struggles to beat San Marino.

Leave Scotland alone you beast.

 

[bluebloodinmyveins]

Leave Scotland alone you beast.

Scotland have players that play first team football. Ours play reserve footie, or so far down the league their teams players wash their own kits.

 

[chicoazul]

Scotland have players that play first team football. Ours play reserve footie, or so far down the league their teams players wash their own kits.

Ace accent though.

 

[Seamus Colemole]

Well I watch alot of football and I don't think England/English players are as good as people make out. They lack the composure that the top teams have and aren't developing top class, technical midfield players who are at ease at this level. The Premier League is what it is because of the influx of foreign players and the obvious mix of styles which makes it such a unique League.

So if there is a problem, in my opinion, it's at youth level, the development of young players. As for the current players, they perform how I expect them to, decent side, but nothing special.

I don't know for sure but are England the only team in this world cup whose players all play their league football in their home country?