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Everton Youth Teams Thread

There is truth in that, but if they want to get back into the first team and to get another contract at Everton or somewhere else they will try to do well.

I think the young lads would benefit if they were playing in a team that had a Gbamin, Besic,Bernard, Iwobi or Mina playing alongside them now and then. They would also play against players with experience as well and that would benefit them.

The alternative is that premiership clubs will buy teams in the lower divisions and use them to give their players experience. They will at least have some control over them then.
They'd only benefit if the senior players were putting in 100% though, and as I said, I just don't think that's going to happen. If Ancelotti thought playing Bernard in the under 23s would help him get back into the first team he could do it, there's absolutely nothing stopping him. He doesn't though, because he doesn't see it that way. With that in mind, Bernard (just an example, not a reflection on him) is highly unlikely to put a massive shift in, because what benefit does it have for him? In that scenario young players could actually be significantly hindered, both by the fact they're not able to make a step up in level because senior players are blocking them, and because they're learning bad habits from senior players who frankly can't be arsed. I understand why the old system would have been better in theory, but in practice I just don't see it being possible in modern football.
 
Whilst it's illegal as far as I'm aware for an owner to have two teams in the FL pyramid, given the stiff resistance to B teams it seems obvious to me that the future of player development will be with satellite clubs in Belgium, Holland etc.

Loans are a broken ineffective system for the most part in my view. They've now got this warped view of being the magic fix to player development thanks to Fifa and FM that reality doesn't really pair up with. Teams will prioritise winning over developing a player they don't own and won't have in 6 months time.

But if your owner also owns/has an association with the team you're sending to, this allows player development to come first. We have already started these affiliation programmes ourselves though none so far have seemed an ideal candidate for loans and I have no idea how brexit will affect it. Other clubs like Vitesse for Chelsea, The City Group, Red Bull, Liverpool owners trying to buy someone, Leicester - OHL. Its quite clear this is the path prem teams are going down to try and fix it. Whether it will or not who knows but I don't think PL2 or loans are the answer
 

Basically spat his dummy out because others are training with the first team and being named on the bench and he hasn't, On one hand if he's highly rated as it sounds maybe he should be training with the first team if they think he's a huge prospect on the other hand you're only 16 and still a baby, what's the rush?
 
Hmm interesting because it's the Daily Express so not very reliable. He'd command a 4 million ish tribunal fee, would Brighton or Brentford really spend that on a 17 year old with no experience?

Arsenal have Tierney and United have 2 strong full backs so not sure they make sense.

I think the fact there's still no contract sorted does mean that he's probably tempted to go though
 
They'd only benefit if the senior players were putting in 100% though, and as I said, I just don't think that's going to happen. If Ancelotti thought playing Bernard in the under 23s would help him get back into the first team he could do it, there's absolutely nothing stopping him. He doesn't though, because he doesn't see it that way. With that in mind, Bernard (just an example, not a reflection on him) is highly unlikely to put a massive shift in, because what benefit does it have for him? In that scenario young players could actually be significantly hindered, both by the fact they're not able to make a step up in level because senior players are blocking them, and because they're learning bad habits from senior players who frankly can't be arsed. I understand why the old system would have been better in theory, but in practice I just don't see it being possible in modern football.

What I never really understand is the contradiction that exists in what many say. On the one hand they want to take it back to the mid 90's, where you had a mix of age ranges and older players mixing with younger ones. Yet often the same people will moan that our team is too old, we need more younger players in it, senior lads like Pennington shouldn't be getting a game, reserve football is not for players who are 23/24. It seems a bit contradiction to me.

My own view, is there is no magic solution for younger players. No magic bullet. 90% of players in our academy will get nowhere our 1st team and aren't even a consideration, but you need 11 to make up a team, and 16 for a match day squad. Whether you loan players or not, is sort of incidental.

I'll probably contradict myself a bit here, but what players need is regular minutes, at the highest level possible. I get the argument that they stagnate in the 23's, but players also stagnate when going out on loans. We've seen it ourselves here, Dowell, Kenny, Connolly, Williams etc all going on loan to the same level and ultimately finding that level. Yet some will blame this on "bad loans" without ever really outlining what a "good loan" looks like- before a player is sent (hindsite is 20/20).

What you are really looking for from a 16-18 year old, are the ones who will show exceptional development potential. The one's who when they go on loan, will shine and move onto the net challenge easily.

To circle it back, I'm not really sure returning to the 90's would help that much. I don't think anymore players really got developed in those days to now.
 

Can't blame the lad for maybe looking elsewhere if he thinks behind Digne & Nkounkou he'll be waiting ages for a proper go. However, this is his first year for the U23's so maybe just needs to remember he's got a long career ahead of him.

It would be frustrating to lose Small. I put him and Onyango as our best talents. However I will never blame a lad leaving if he wants better playing opportunities. If Brentford would give him that, fair enough. I don't see him getting it anywhere else, but maybe he gets a bigger contract.

For us, if we get 4m for him, plus a decent sell on fee, it will pay for the entire academy for probably a season.
 
What I never really understand is the contradiction that exists in what many say. On the one hand they want to take it back to the mid 90's, where you had a mix of age ranges and older players mixing with younger ones. Yet often the same people will moan that our team is too old, we need more younger players in it, senior lads like Pennington shouldn't be getting a game, reserve football is not for players who are 23/24. It seems a bit contradiction to me.

My own view, is there is no magic solution for younger players. No magic bullet. 90% of players in our academy will get nowhere our 1st team and aren't even a consideration, but you need 11 to make up a team, and 16 for a match day squad. Whether you loan players or not, is sort of incidental.

I'll probably contradict myself a bit here, but what players need is regular minutes, at the highest level possible. I get the argument that they stagnate in the 23's, but players also stagnate when going out on loans. We've seen it ourselves here, Dowell, Kenny, Connolly, Williams etc all going on loan to the same level and ultimately finding that level. Yet some will blame this on "bad loans" without ever really outlining what a "good loan" looks like- before a player is sent (hindsite is 20/20).

What you are really looking for from a 16-18 year old, are the ones who will show exceptional development potential. The one's who when they go on loan, will shine and move onto the net challenge easily.

To circle it back, I'm not really sure returning to the 90's would help that much. I don't think anymore players really got developed in those days to now.
Yeah I agree with that completely. I've said before, people just look at youth development all wrong. The under 23s have a squad mainly made up of players that they know have no chance of making the first team. People constantly talk about it as if every member of the youth set up is a potential first teamer, and for as long as that happens they will believe the academy is failing. If the academy can consistently produce players who can 'do a job' in the squad before ultimately finding their level elsewhere, and occasionally produce a star then it's doing just fine. The reality of youth development just doesn't match up with the ideals put forward by most.
 
Cant understand why you wouldn't have him train with the first team either. Seems like we've sort of just gave him 1 min of football and then just assumed he'd sign. We've also had games where we've not filled the bench or had 2 goalies on it. If I was a 16 year old getting told I was the best thing since sliced bread I'd be pissed off seeing that myself
 
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