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Farhad Moshiri

7+ Years On... Your Verdict On Farhad Moshiri

  • Pleased

    Votes: 109 7.8%

  • Disappointed

    Votes: 1,295 92.2%
  • Total voters
    1,404
davek said:
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A week!
 
RaleighBlue said:
You're not actually countering my points. You're spinning them. Which is fine! All I'm arguing is that the club should be doing that too!

Objective means 'factually accurate'. I.E. I agree. We fired a bad manager. We brought in a manager that has won one cup, a decade ago in a different league, and did some things in the Dutch league...which, whatever. Let's not anoint him before he's succeeded.

Walsh was a head scout. Now he's a DoF (I think, but who knows?). Those are different jobs. Hopefully he can make the jump.
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John Stones will be a better defender than Ashley Williams barring a massive surprise or injury. Should we have sold him? I hope so. I really am not placing my personal opinion of our transfer business here. I'm trying to keep it objective. We sold a brilliant young player for a bunch of money and then spent that money on other players. No investment beyond that.

The point is that you're arguing that we've done good business. You are hopeful and believe in the new regime. I also have hope, though it's a bit guarded. Others are even more cynical. The club is doing nothing about that, they're just keeping silent. The silence is what I actively object to, because all it does is alienate parts of the fanbase.

You're painting me as someone with an opinion on the squad. I sit on the fence far too much for that. I'm just pointing out that our PR team is godawful, and it's people like yourself that are keeping hopes up on your own, because the VISIBLE club activity shows little difference between the Moshiri era and the Kenwright era.
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No, I countered your actual points. I didn't 'spin' them. I disagreed with your points and I presented my opinion. We didn't sign players with 'less upside' at all.

I am COUNTERING your opinion again right here.

I personally believe the jury is out on Stones being a good defender. I don't think he's a 'brilliant young player'. I think he's a promising player that has been massively overhyped, to the point that it's basically an Emperors New Clothes scenario. People apparently seem reluctant to point out the blatantly obvious, that he struggles to actually DEFEND, that his decision making is poor, that he spends too much time on the ball.

I am not 'just hopeful'. It is fact that it is our best start to a season in 10 years. It is fact that the manager made decisions to change the game vs WBA to achieve victory, and again made decisions vs Stoke to protect the victory.

You're complaining about silence. What exactly does that mean? If a deal, say for a stadium, is 75% done, why do they need to publicly comment at this point? I don't want a blow by blow commentary. I want them to tell me when something is done, or not at all.

I couldn't give a crap about 'keeping my hopes up'. I can see before my very eyes. The team has started the season well. The points on the board prove that. The club is actually spending money to improve the exterior of Goodison Park for the first time in forever. I can see that with my own eyes too. That's progress. That's different than the Kenwright era.

For someone who claims to sit on the fence, you certainly seem to be trying to belittle what's happening and trying to present it as some sort of quaint optimism/hope. I think that's a bit pathetic to be honest. If you're going to be negative, be negative. Don't try to present it as being objective though, because it blatantly isn't.
 

DerbyshireAndHarper said:
No, I countered your actual points. I didn't 'spin' them. I disagreed with your points and I presented my opinion. We didn't sign players with 'less upside' at all.

I am COUNTERING your opinion again right here.

I personally believe the jury is out on Stones being a good defender. I don't think he's a 'brilliant young player'. I think he's a promising player that has been massively overhyped, to the point that it's basically an Emperors New Clothes scenario. People apparently seem reluctant to point out the blatantly obvious, that he struggles to actually DEFEND, that his decision making is poor, that he spends too much time on the ball.

I am not 'just hopeful'. It is fact that it is our best start to a season in 10 years. It is fact that the manager made decisions to change the game vs WBA to achieve victory, and again made decisions vs Stoke to protect the victory.

You're complaining about silence. What exactly does that mean? If a deal, say for a stadium, is 75% done, why do they need to publicly comment at this point? I don't want a blow by blow commentary. I want them to tell me when something is done, or not at all.

I couldn't give a crap about 'keeping my hopes up'. I can see before my very eyes. The team has started the season well. The points on the board prove that. The club is actually spending money to improve the exterior of Goodison Park for the first time in forever. I can see that with my own eyes too. That's progress. That's different than the Kenwright era.

For someone who claims to sit on the fence, you certainly seem to be trying to belittle what's happening and trying to present it as some sort of quaint optimism/hope. I think that's a bit pathetic to be honest. If you're going to be negative, be negative. Don't try to present it as being objective though, because it blatantly isn't.
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I don't understand the level of emotion here. If you don't see John Stones as a brilliant young player, that's fine and I can see your stance. However, you cannot tell me that we spent much before he was sold. So sell to buy? It's feasible, right? Even if you don't believe it to be true, you cannot state that as fact, right?

And sure on the stadium. I'm not actually suggesting the club tell us anything. I'm suggesting the club engage with the supporters, much like you just have with me and spin the takeover as a wholly positive thing. I'm not suggesting that this is necessary to make me feel better. It's simply a good business practice to keep your customers happy. With the deadline day fiasco it should be up to the club PR department to soothe fan worries and keep the positive vibes flowing. Yet we do nothing.

Keep in mind, I am not offering opinions on the new ownership in truth - because I'm patient and hopeful. But if I look at the information in front of me, it's very easily to spin it negatively. It would behoove the club to try and get out in front of that and make it harder to spin negatively. That's my argument. Public relations is now part of football. We are disastrous at it. And that absolutely can affect the prospects of the club. Especially one desperate to raise it's profile.

You are arguing orthogonally to my point. You are arguing the negative spin that I intentionally put on our dealings to highlight how easy it is to see them in that negative light. Which is cool. But the actual point (which I clearly failed to deliver) is that the club should be doing that arguing for you rather than being reactive or assuming everything will eventually work out and make people happy. The deadline showed how that can go, right? Even the best laid plans don't survive contact with the enemy. You have to be constantly engaging on all fronts. It's simply good business sense. I am NOT objecting to how we're running the pitch side operation, I am objecting to how we're running community support (in the sense of social media and public relations), because it's piss poor.
 

davek said:
The context is justification. It's staggering to me that it's being downplayed here. Just about anyone could be called a hypocrite on that basis.

But regardless of hypocrisy, let me ask you: is continually using the word 'p***k' as a prefix when referring to a former manager ok, or should it be stopped?
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Who defines what justification is reasonable? One can easily make the claim that the football being trotted out by Martinez for 2 out of 3 seasons, coupled with the results of those games were more than enough justification.

Add in his strange transfer policy (yes, there were some good ones in there, but for me, mostly bad) and there is more than enough reasonable justification for the criticism. As far as the particular words used to describe him, if you feel they break forum rules, report them!

I can not read every post, for instance I am GMT +12, and as I go to bed when you lot are waking up. I wake up to potentially thousands of new posts, and unfortunately, I can not read them all, as I have a family and work to consider.
 
Dylan said:
Who defines what justification is reasonable? One can easily make the claim that the football being trotted out by Martinez for 2 out of 3 seasons, coupled with the results of those games were more than enough justification.

Add in his strange transfer policy (yes, there were some good ones in there, but for me, mostly bad) and there is more than enough reasonable justification for the criticism. As far as the particular words used to describe him, if you feel they break forum rules, report them!

I can not read every post, for instance I am GMT +12, and as I go to bed when you lot are waking up. I wake up to potentially thousands of new posts, and unfortunately, I can not read them all, as I have a family and work to consider.
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You're in NZ? ... what part?
 
The window, followed by the news regarding further loans being taken out, has compounded the fears I had when it was revealed that Kenwright and Elstone were going nowhere.

A future shaped by those two is something I desperately want to see Everton avoid, and the fact that one has had a promotion while the other is still very much in the thick of the action fills me with dread.

It was be incredibly disappointing if Moshiri turns out to be simply the latest actor cast in the Paul Gregg/Robert Earl role.
 

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