Farhad Moshiri

[Bob Elstone]

@DerbyshireAndHarper
I am a simple man and have a simple question.
80mil(loan) +87.5mil (purchase of shares)= 167.5 mil.
Where has your figure of over 200 million investment by FM come from?
I would also point out that although the loans were paid off, there is a picture showing the projected borrowings figires for 16/17 from the GM which clearly shows borrowings of 80mil from BHHL and 22.5 mil from Rights and Media Funding.
The RMF loan was not extortionate in terms of interest at 5.2%. At their peak in terms of interest rates, Vibrac/RMF charged 8.8% as opposed to 8.2% charged by Barclays/Investec Bank which preceded them from memory.
I am an FM believer, but please lets not over-egg things.

players additions minus outgoings?

 

[kithnou]

players additions minus outgoings?

TV money?

 

[hibbo'sclass]

players additions minus outgoings?

TV money?

Both of these suggestions are EFC generated, not investment by FM.

 

[kithnou]

Both of these suggestions are EFC generated, not investment by FM.

Correct mate. I was answering Bob as to where player related money may be coming from.

 

[hibbo'sclass]

Correct mate. I was answering Bob as to where player related money may be coming from.

Strangely, I twigged that eventually and was just amending my post.
Sorry

 

[njligernj]

What would be a fair estimate for actually cost of the interest free loan to Mosh?

Assuming he wouldn't just leave the money under his mattress and would invest it in some sort of fund?

What would he get back on that over 10 years?

People often use 7% annual return for these calculations which is partly down to notorious investor Warren Buffet who once said 7% was the number for reasons known only to his delicate infallible genius. Some Buffet fanboy carved data until he found 7% annual hiding in the S&P over some arbitrary date range and used that to slobber over Buffet. Slobbering over Buffet is how white people who wear bow ties and live in the north east of the US spend almost 100% of their free time.

So there's your answer: 7% compound on whatever amount you think he's spent on Everton. Quick question mate: why do you suppose Moshiri would suddenly decide to invest in a mutual fund down at the local Barclays rather than continue his practice of investing in State controlled oil and energy funds which due to being controlled by a brutal system of oppression guarantee a far greater return than the 7% some middle managers about to blow their retirement naively expect to get from the market?

Your question also assumes rich people use their actual money to buy things. His actual immediate cash outlay wouldn't be the same literal amount he has "invested" into Everton the way people did the maths here. Sometimes it isn't always about returns; sometimes investors are more concerned with a successful asset relocation initiative.

Oh look another thread ruined. The mods need to seriously get this suorted as every thread is just constant bickering.

Servers are expensive. Sites will never do anything about people you consider trolls because trolls work and people respond to trolls in ways that benefit the website. (FWIW I don't believe Davek is a troll but for the purpose of helping you understand why you will never get what you want it doesn't matter if he is or isn't a troll only that you think it's true.)

Almost any rule I can think of which would make conversation more productive on discussion sites would also lower uniques and page views and therefore revenue. That's the real problem you need to address if you want change (in that way the internet is just like real life -- it's also essentially the same reason the news doesn't report valuable information as often as they show blood soaked misery porn.)

Trolls (by your definition) and forums have a symbiotic relationship. Mods and site owners define trolls differently than you and most actual users do so they don't have to ban the people who generate most of the page views.

 

[TheGhostOfBolasie]

Finally we've got the marquee signing we were all craving - welcome home José lad.

 

[bluestevon]

People often use 7% annual return for these calculations which is partly down to notorious investor Warren Buffet who once said 7% was the number for reasons known only to his delicate infallible genius. Some Buffet fanboy carved data until he found 7% annual hiding in the S&P over some arbitrary date range and used that to slobber over Buffet. Slobbering over Buffet is how white people who wear bow ties and live in the north east of the US spend almost 100% of their free time.

So there's your answer: 7% compound on whatever amount you think he's spent on Everton. Quick question mate: why do you suppose Moshiri would suddenly decide to invest in a mutual fund down at the local Barclays rather than continue his practice of investing in State controlled oil and energy funds which due to being controlled by a brutal system of oppression guarantee a far greater return than the 7% some middle managers about to blow their retirement naively expect to get from the market?

Your question also assumes rich people use their actual money to buy things. His actual immediate cash outlay wouldn't be the same literal amount he has "invested" into Everton the way people did the maths here. Sometimes it isn't always about returns; sometimes investors are more concerned with a successful asset relocation initiative.



Servers are expensive. Sites will never do anything about people you consider trolls because trolls work and people respond to trolls in ways that benefit the website. (FWIW I don't believe Davek is a troll but for the purpose of helping you understand why you will never get what you want it doesn't matter if he is or isn't a troll only that you think it's true.)

Almost any rule I can think of which would make conversation more productive on discussion sites would also lower uniques and page views and therefore revenue. That's the real problem you need to address if you want change (in that way the internet is just like real life -- it's also essentially the same reason the news doesn't report valuable information as often as they show blood soaked misery porn.)

Trolls (by your definition) and forums have a symbiotic relationship. Mods and site owners define trolls differently than you and most actual users do so they don't have to ban the people who generate most of the page views.

Spot on and most people don't realise that.

 

[TheCount]

So there's your answer: 7% compound on whatever amount you think he's spent on Everton. Quick question mate: why do you suppose Moshiri would suddenly decide to invest in a mutual fund down at the local Barclays rather than continue his practice of investing in State controlled oil and energy funds which due to being controlled by a brutal system of oppression guarantee a far greater return than the 7% some middle managers about to blow their retirement naively expect to get from the market?

I didn't think he'd pop down to Barclays, just thought a fund investment would give a baseline figure.

I sort of knew the answer, just wanted to point out that an £80m interest free loan would actually cost the lender.

 

[truebluejersey]

That is total revisionist history. I'm sure you, like almost all of the rest of us, were loving that season. Sure, it turned out it was the emperor's new clothes, but we bossed some seriously good teams that year. Prove me wrong, vault yourself saying Martinez was garbage during that run. He turned out to be a fraud but that season was great fun and it diminishes your argument pretending it wasn't.

So me saying I think Koeman is a better prospect than Martinez diminishes my argument. I knew Martinez was no good after the anfield disaster when his mate (another fraud) had to shackle Liverpool to prevent a double figure pasting and Martinez stood there arms folded like a cardboard cut out not knowing what to do. If you think Martinez was a better prospect than Koeman you carry on.

 

[Dymak]

Because Bill Kenwright would not have been able to afford to sack Martinez, nor have the available funds to attract Koeman.



Not necessarily. Him not converting the debt to equity straight away doesn't mean he's not willing to splash as the cash on players, as has already been proven by his spending thus far since July 2016, the start of his first window.

I'm sorry, but what are you talking about? Martinez' compensation and the recruitment of Koeman were paid via club revenues that would still have been in existence if Kenwright was in control. Neither of these costs have been met with investment from Moshiri.

Again, you are acting like Moshiri has been meeting Everton's expenditure on transfers since July 2016, when in reality the expenditure has been met with club revenues on the back of an almighty TV deal.

Moshiri's investment in the club, beyond that of share purchase, is currently limited to the circa 7 million pound a year sponsorship of Finch Farm, and the interest free loan, which really should have formed part of the purchase cost anyway.

 

[maccavennie]

Finally we've got the marquee signing we were all craving - welcome home José lad.

I was actually thinking about this last night. We actually haven't signed anyone who we wouldn't have been able to sign pre Moshiri with all the money that's floating about. @kithnou made some valid points a couple of days ago about us not being able to attract the top top calibre of player probably needed to make the long term jump.

I guess the stadium is the major thing needed to get us progressing as a club because we struggled in the summer to sign top players, not sure who we are after now but again someone else mentioned Koeman was hired to attract top players because of his rep. No sign that's worked as yet either.

not moaning, just my own observations on things.

 

[truebluejersey]

I'm sorry, but what are you talking about? Martinez' compensation and the recruitment of Koeman were paid via club revenues that would still have been in existence if Kenwright was in control. Neither of these costs have been met with investment from Moshiri.

Again, you are acting like Moshiri has been meeting Everton's expenditure on transfers since July 2016, when in reality the expenditure has been met with club revenues on the back of an almighty TV deal.

Moshiri's investment in the club, beyond that of share purchase, is currently limited to the circa 7 million pound a year sponsorship of Finch Farm, and the interest free loan, which really should have formed part of the purchase cost anyway.

Yes but Moshri's financial muscle is opening the doors to financial borrowing/riches that Bill would not have.

 

[kithnou]

I was actually thinking about this last night. We actually haven't signed anyone who we wouldn't have been able to sign pre Moshiri with all the money that's floating about. @kithnou made some valid points a couple of days ago about us not being able to attract the top top calibre of player probably needed to make the long term jump.

I guess the stadium is the major thing needed to get us progressing as a club because we struggled in the summer to sign top players, not sure who we are after now but again someone else mentioned Koeman was hired to attract top players because of his rep. No sign that's worked as yet either.

not moaning, just my own observations on things.

Thanks mate.

Yes, I'm not moaning either. However I am concerned that after 2 windows I am seeing no activity in stature to match Moshiri's comments in relation to on field progress.

As I mentioned a few days back, players and their managers aren't gullible as success starved supporter bases. Words and intention mean nothing if the activity isn't there to accompany them.

Farhad will be amazing for us off field. My concern with him from day one though still stands. I can't see how we will compete for titles on field.

 

[truebluejersey]

Thanks mate.

Yes, I'm not moaning either. However I am concerned that after 2 windows I am seeing no activity in stature to match Moshiri's comments in relation to on field progress.

As I mentioned a few days back, players and their managers aren't gullible as success starved supporter bases. Words and intention mean nothing if the activity isn't there to accompany them.

Farhad will be amazing for us off field. My concern with him from day one though still stands. I can't see how we will compete for titles on field.

The progress barometer I'm using at the moment is that since Moshri's arrival there has been no rumblings of players wanting to move to bigger clubs, its as if they know that something big could be round the corner. it is a rather simple unscientific way of thinking though.