2022/23 Frank Lampard

[Blue_Eagle]

Here's the mad (and maddening) thing for me: we need someone in here who can organise a defence to get results against decent teams as well as less decent teams. We've all seen Lampard can do that, both last season and this season.

We're effectively in the hunt for a replacement who can do what a manager we already have at the club can do - but who wont do it consistently enough to get us out of trouble.

That's what's broken the back of my support for him. It's outrageous that we haven;t been setting up with the 5 at the back we seen him adopt when he first came in last season that got him a foothold in the job and that he returned to for key games later on last season - a system that also got us an unlikley point against City away. It's a system, btw, that someone like Coady knows so well and plays better in.

Lampard's been the architect of his own downfall here as much as the club's criminal unwillingness to get him a replacement in for Richarlison.

I hear you but, do you appreciate that 5 at the back strategy may very quickly back-fire against teams who aren't as offensive? And that our current three CM's aren't necessarily creative enough to make it work - placing too much expectations on the front two, in that system?

 

[Simon Buttle]

Not stated anything of the sort

Likewise I never suggested a new manager wouldn't have an effect, I said it would probably give us a short term lift.

 

[andy4efc]

This is what I mean by tedious. Bill hasn't owned the club for 6 yrs yet remains public enemy n°1, its absolutely ridiculous. And while we were are at, under Bill we were run efficiently. Unless you would hate the days of regular top 7 finishes, a top 4 spot and good cup runs

Run efficiently? Not sure on that. We had to sell Wayne Rooney, our biggest talent I've ever seen in an Everton shirt from the academy, to avoid administration. We were always on the breadline. That isn't sustainable.

David Moyes being appointed was the only good thing Kenwright did for this club. I am not a massive Moyes fan, but I can appreciate the job he did at not only keeping things steady on the pitch but doing it on a small budget for the most part.

Kenwright had how many failed ground moves? 2/3?
He has lied, and lied, and lied.
He hasn't owne dhte club for six years and YET he is still around? Why? He hasn't a scooby.

He allowed Everton football club, not only to stand still while others progressed, but to go backwards. Any regular owner who has purchased a business, sells the business and it's not his problem. He claims to be the biggest Evertonian in the world, so when seling, why did he sell to someone with no football knowledge? So why is he still there? He is the Chairman still, so he has ensured that he still gets the same input. He is not a periphery figure at the club, he is the chairman. He is still involved in the running of the club which is criminal.

Like Moshiri is at fault for some of his appointments (particularly Benitez which proved he has no clue about the club whatsoever), Kenwright is at fault for letting this person into the football club in the first place. The sheer fact that Roberto Martinez, who had one really good season and two distinctly, stale, average ones, with a top class striker in Lukaku... The sheer fact, that Roberto, no matter that he is a decent person in life, is even on teh shortlist to replace Lampard is absolutely mental. This is a man who had 3 years and got sacked, justifyably. It is completely because Kenwright still has pull and likes him as a human.

The rot was here with Kenwright, he did nothing about it. He made it worse with Moshiri.

Moshiri has made it much worse as a result with his appointments at board level, manager level and even football level.

There is a cancer in the club, and it's not one individual it's the lot of them. No manager will be able to flourish here until the club is run sustainably. Graeme Sharp being appointed to the board summed it all up. IF you want a football mind on the board, fantastic, why did they look no further than their in-house co-commentator?

This does not excuse Frank Lampard, because some of the decisions made have been surprising. But change at the bottom makes no differnece if there isn't change at the top. This includes Farhard Moshiri, this includes Bill Kenwright, this includes DBB, this includes Graeme Sharp and the rest of the board.


Also just to point out, I am just countering your points and justifying the anger and outrage at the moment, in way no personal to you sir.

 

[royvernon39]

Frank has made a balls-up of the task and he has made it worse by just terrible signings.

Frank has not devised a plan of play for a team that lacks quality. Got to play long and defensive.

Frank appears to have little in-game appreciation and rarely gets the subs right.

 

[blueblue]

If you think a new manager solves the issues that are wrong with with Everton Football Club then that's up to you.

The manager needs to get the best out of the squad of players at his disposal.... that is the yardstick the manager is judged by.

I don't believe there are many who believe FL is doing well in that assessment.

 

[maccavennie]

Imagine where we would be without Gray this season.

tbf mate we'd be 2 points worse off. I like Gray, he's the best of a massively bad bunch of wingers we currently have. His goals have got us draws, same as Gordon's tbf. What we need is match winning goals, like Maupays against West Ham.

Do you remember when Royle came in, I think Rideout scored 11-12 goals that season, but about 8 of them were match winning goals.

Kevin Campbell was the same, scored match winning goals.

 

[Simon Buttle]

The manager needs to get the best out of the squad of players at his disposal.... that is the yardstick the manager is judged by.

I don't believe there are many who believe FL is doing well in that assessment.

He isn't and not by a long way I agree and I don't doubt there are individuals who could get more from this squad however the fundamental problems that keep strangling EFC will still be there.

 

[Toff33Blues99]

Run efficiently? Not sure on that. We had to sell Wayne Rooney, our biggest talent I've ever seen in an Everton shirt from the academy, to avoid administration. We were always on the breadline. That isn't sustainable.

David Moyes being appointed was the only good thing Kenwright did for this club. I am not a massive Moyes fan, but I can appreciate the job he did at not only keeping things steady on the pitch but doing it on a small budget for the most part.

Kenwright had how many failed ground moves? 2/3?
He has lied, and lied, and lied.
He hasn't owne dhte club for six years and YET he is still around? Why? He hasn't a scooby.

He allowed Everton football club, not only to stand still while others progressed, but to go backwards. Any regular owner who has purchased a business, sells the business and it's not his problem. He claims to be the biggest Evertonian in the world, so when seling, why did he sell to someone with no football knowledge? So why is he still there? He is the Chairman still, so he has ensured that he still gets the same input. He is not a periphery figure at the club, he is the chairman. He is still involved in the running of the club which is criminal.

Like Moshiri is at fault for some of his appointments (particularly Benitez which proved he has no clue about the club whatsoever), Kenwright is at fault for letting this person into the football club in the first place. The sheer fact that Roberto Martinez, who had one really good season and two distinctly, stale, average ones, with a top class striker in Lukaku... The sheer fact, that Roberto, no matter that he is a decent person in life, is even on teh shortlist to replace Lampard is absolutely mental. This is a man who had 3 years and got sacked, justifyably. It is completely because Kenwright still has pull and likes him as a human.

The rot was here with Kenwright, he did nothing about it. He made it worse with Moshiri.

Moshiri has made it much worse as a result with his appointments at board level, manager level and even football level.

There is a cancer in the club, and it's not one individual it's the lot of them. No manager will be able to flourish here until the club is run sustainably. Graeme Sharp being appointed to the board summed it all up. IF you want a football mind on the board, fantastic, why did they look no further than their in-house co-commentator?

This does not excuse Frank Lampard, because some of the decisions made have been surprising. But change at the bottom makes no differnece if there isn't change at the top. This includes Farhard Moshiri, this includes Bill Kenwright, this includes DBB, this includes Graeme Sharp and the rest of the board.


Also just to point out, I am just countering your points and justifying the anger and outrage at the moment, in way no personal to you sir.

Unfortunately for millionaire Bill, he bought the club (no one else was fighting to own us) when the league entered a billionaire period.
Fat Manc wanted to go, it disgusts me he is held in high regard, stop deluding yourself that it was all about the money, yes it eased the financials but it wasn't the whole story.
The new owner kept him around, how is that Bills fault? It's not. The way Moshiri runs the club with zero knowledge of football, then would hate to see the state of the club with Bill not there, it would be considerably worse.
I find it hard to take an argument seriously when I read stuff like he let Moshiri into the club. Did you voice your concerns at the time about evil Moshiri or like Kenwright did you think this billionaire businessman who was prepared to spend was a good fit. Hindsight is a great thing, but can't be used as something to clout Kenwright over the head with.

 

[efcfanwirral]

Here's the mad (and maddening) thing for me: we need someone in here who can organise a defence to get results against decent teams as well as less decent teams. We've all seen Lampard can do that, both last season and this season.

We're effectively in the hunt for a replacement who can do what a manager we already have at the club can do - but who wont do it consistently enough to get us out of trouble.

That's what's broken the back of my support for him. It's outrageous that we haven;t been setting up with the 5 at the back we seen him adopt when he first came in last season that got him a foothold in the job and that he returned to for key games later on last season - a system that also got us an unlikley point against City away. It's a system, btw, that someone like Coady knows so well and plays better in.

Lampard's been the architect of his own downfall here as much as the club's criminal unwillingness to get him a replacement in for Richarlison.

I think now it makes sense to go 5 at the back with Godfrey is back, I think adding Keane or Holgate in recent months would've caused chaos. I want to see Godfrey playing as that 3rd centre back who can step out of defence when needed now though. He can be like an additional midfielder in the right circumstances

 

[andy4efc]

Unfortunately for millionaire Bill, he bought the club (no one else was fighting to own us) when the league entered a billionaire period.
Fat Manc wanted to go, it disgusts me he is held in high regard, stop deluding yourself that it was all about the money, yes it eased the financials but it wasn't the whole story.
The new owner kept him around, how is that Bills fault? It's not. The way Moshiri runs the club with zero knowledge of football, then would hate to see the state of the club with Bill not there, it would be considerably worse.
I find it hard to take an argument seriously when I read stuff like he let Moshiri into the club. Did you voice your concerns at the time about evil Moshiri or like Kenwright did you think this billionaire businessman who was prepared to spend was a good fit. Hindsight is a great thing, but can't be used as something to clout Kenwright over the head with.

Dont delude yourself into thinking that we didnt need the money. The rest of the story isn't relevant to my point. We were not run sustainably if a generational talent was sold so quickly because we desperately needed the money. Treading water for so long year on year is not sustainable running. Just like hovering above the relegation zone year after year isn't sustainable because at one point, you will drown. I also dont blame Rooney for stupid comments he made when he was younger, I dont blame him for leaving. I have said things when im 19 and regret them, ashamed of them. I remmeber once when I was younger being happy Osman got injured as he'd get subbed, I dont see that as a representation of who I am so I dont hold any personal hatred (which you appear to) towards Rooney for it.

Becuase Big Blue Bill kept himself on as chairman as part of the deal. We have seen the reports of Sheikhs being interested us before Man City but he didn't welcome it (and with my fast falling out of love with football, im not sure I'd feel any better about endless amounts of money at the cost of our soul). As I pointed out in my post, he is not the only problem, Moshiri's actions are ones that Moshiri has to answer for but Kenwright is not blameless in this. He claims to be a big blue, but was happy to sell to someone clueless because he got to stay on as Chairman. BIll Kenwright has no reason to be the Chairman of Everton football club. Do you honestly think Kenwright has no input anymore despite being Chairman? Why was Graeme Sharp appointed to the board? It wasn't Moshiri who pushed for that. Moshiri is still listening to the man and that is another rock that can be thrown at Moshiri for foolishness.

I don't have a big enough ego to say i was protesting at the thought of Moshiri coming in, I can happily hold my hands up and say at the time I thought it would be a game changer for us. Hindsight is a wonderful thing but just because it's labelled as a common phrase, doesn't mena that you shouldn't use hindsight to evaluate the errors.

Hindsight is exactly what businesses use to evaulate the errors. Data and feedback is hindsight, it allows you to look back and go, what went wrong?

This is what went wrong, and is still going wrong. It has been going wrong for years and nothing has been done about it whatsoever.

To wrap it up, as I put in my post, it is not solely on kenwright, it is on him, DBB, Graeme Sharp and im sure Countless others who have been involved with no competenance in the field. The buck lies with Moshiri because he makes the appointments, but you can't ignore the question why was he ever allowed into the club with such little idea of how to run it and that falls on Kenwright. You suggest Kenwright is above criticism, but he is CHAIRMAN of the football club? He, like all the rest should be held account.

From what I've been reading as well, the anger, the frustration is all being pelted at the lot of them, nobody is ignoring moshiri, nobody is ignoring DBB. All the anger is at the lot of them, not just Kenwright. That doesn't mean an individual can't raise their concerns regarding that individual though.

The one problem I have seen is seeing people wish illness upon Bill Kenwright because it would mean he finally leaves the club. I can't stand that. Part of me feels as though it is probably true, but it makes me sick seeing people throw it out there like it's an okay thing to say.

 

[Marius57]

Here's the mad (and maddening) thing for me: we need someone in here who can organise a defence to get results against decent teams as well as less decent teams. We've all seen Lampard can do that, both last season and this season.

We're effectively in the hunt for a replacement who can do what a manager we already have at the club can do - but who wont do it consistently enough to get us out of trouble.

That's what's broken the back of my support for him. It's outrageous that we haven;t been setting up with the 5 at the back we seen him adopt when he first came in last season that got him a foothold in the job and that he returned to for key games later on last season - a system that also got us an unlikley point against City away. It's a system, btw, that someone like Coady knows so well and plays better in.

Lampard's been the architect of his own downfall here as much as the club's criminal unwillingness to get him a replacement in for Richarlison.

You literally banged on about how the back 3/5 system had failed, was ‘shaking your opinion’ of lampard for using it, is an appalling system for us, as a ‘curse he has to get free from’ all summer.

And now because he isn’t using it much because like you say, it failed, it’s also the reason your support for him has been broken?

 

[samcdavies94]

tbf mate we'd be 2 points worse off. I like Gray, he's the best of a massively bad bunch of wingers we currently have. His goals have got us draws, same as Gordon's tbf. What we need is match winning goals, like Maupays against West Ham.

Do you remember when Royle came in, I think Rideout scored 11-12 goals that season, but about 8 of them were match winning goals.

Kevin Campbell was the same, scored match winning goals.

Richarlison had a brilliant match-winning goal record. I think at one point under Ancelotti he had the most in the league since he joined us.

 

[banno]

Unfortunately for millionaire Bill, he bought the club (no one else was fighting to own us) when the league entered a billionaire period.
Fat Manc wanted to go, it disgusts me he is held in high regard, stop deluding yourself that it was all about the money, yes it eased the financials but it wasn't the whole story.
The new owner kept him around, how is that Bills fault? It's not. The way Moshiri runs the club with zero knowledge of football, then would hate to see the state of the club with Bill not there, it would be considerably worse.
I find it hard to take an argument seriously when I read stuff like he let Moshiri into the club. Did you voice your concerns at the time about evil Moshiri or like Kenwright did you think this billionaire businessman who was prepared to spend was a good fit. Hindsight is a great thing, but can't be used as something to clout Kenwright over the head with.

I see it slightly different and even though it is speculation I believe a conditional takeover was agreed. That condition being Kenwright is still heavily involved. Moshiri has probably gone to Kenwright for advice and we know what Kenwrights record is like. Kenwright has to go IMO and Moshiri say sod this I need people that have the experience and knowledge or running a club and go from there. Moshiri has run this club Kenwrights way and I believe is Kenwrights puppet. Moshiri has trusted Kenwright to the clubs demise IMO

 

[Marius57]

Unfortunately for millionaire Bill, he bought the club (no one else was fighting to own us) when the league entered a billionaire period.
Fat Manc wanted to go, it disgusts me he is held in high regard, stop deluding yourself that it was all about the money, yes it eased the financials but it wasn't the whole story.
The new owner kept him around, how is that Bills fault? It's not. The way Moshiri runs the club with zero knowledge of football, then would hate to see the state of the club with Bill not there, it would be considerably worse.
I find it hard to take an argument seriously when I read stuff like he let Moshiri into the club. Did you voice your concerns at the time about evil Moshiri or like Kenwright did you think this billionaire businessman who was prepared to spend was a good fit. Hindsight is a great thing, but can't be used as something to clout Kenwright over the head with.

That’s not true though is it. He was at arsenal for a long time with Uzzy.

 

[Lobster Johnson]

That’s not true though is it. He was at arsenal for a long time with Uzzy.

And they let him nowhere near the actual running of the club.