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Guardiola to be found out in the premier league

Vic Vinegar said:
An unbelievable feat and only the 800m spent.
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Was he keeping west brom up this year? If bfs has that squad is he in the champions league places?

Not to say that there isn't a certain skill at managing the egos and playing time of the worlds best players and optimizing the tactics, but let's not pretend that having one of the most expensive teams in the world didnt get him 90% of the way there.
 
FCBarça said:
5 years matches what he did at Barca and I do not equate that to long-term. To that point, he is closer to his departure than his arrival - irrespective of the renewal. Yes he honors contracts but he also will have included a clause to permit him the freedom to walk away for Barca or for any other reason Guardiola choose. Let's not forget, apart from the ownership the rest of the management team are the same ones he had at Barca

Sancho is not an academy product of City, no more than a mercenary who simply spent a short spell there - same for Iheanacho, they flourished ultimately away from City and also why I pointed out this is not necessarily a poor formula since it has worked well for Chelsea too

It's profitable now but even at it's outset with the oil money, their aim was to build Barca-lite. If Pep leaves, you lose a considerable part of that Barca formula you count on. City are not supported at the same level in terms of fan as say the other top clubs in England. City can be discussed as a big club currently but that can quickly change due to personnel - the long standing joke has been how empty their stadium can be or traveling support. Before the sheikhs arrived, they were relegated for a period of time. They will always be quite liquid in terms of resources but how will they maintain a working model long-term without key custodians to ensure continuity of success from a coach or management team? I also think we do not know the long-term investment strategy of sheikhs

I also do not agree that Chelsea differ greatly from City in terms of ownership, both are bankrolling the club - one just has much better PR to give the illusion of financial good health. Even UEFA tried repeatedly to punish them which, at the very least, underscores the creative accounting that goes on at this level

United will, long-term, always dwarf City. Only a City fan would dispute that in all honesty. United for all the reasons to hate them, despite having no real playing philosophy will always generate revenue, have huge fan support and players who will want to play for them. Today, sure, a bonafide star would choose City. Tomorrow, once Pep is gone, then that decision becomes a bit more pragmatic (Money + club stability + sporting outlook)

Right now that harmony is ideal but there is nothing to suggest this will persist once the key architects leave
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I stopped reading at the 'permit him the freedom to walk away for Barca' :zzz:
In your dreams fella.
 
FCBarça said:
Of course things go in cycles but I am referring to the biggest clubs of this century

Maybe Dundee United will be the PSG of the next century but none of us will be here to confirm
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I mean of course, but the idea that City will never be as big as United, or more successful I find a bit unusual. I watched the Berkshire Hathaway shareholders meeting last week, and Warrem Buffet put up the 20 most successful companies 30 years ago- and not a single one is in the top 20 now. Not only can these things change but they do.

Likewise if you go back 30 years, the idea Everton wouldn't be at the top of the English game would seem bizarre, but witihn 10 years we were fighting relegation annually. If you went back to 1970 and said Liverpool will be the dominant force over Everton, again you would be laughed away. Everton had won more trophies, had more fans, a better and younger team, a better ground etc.

City have the infastucture and the money behind them to build a lasting legacy. United are on a downward trend. Trends can be reversed, but things change quickly in football and life. Another 10 years at this rate and City will be where United were probably 10 years ago.
 

FCBarça said:
Yeah, I remember similar said when Domenech opined that Garcia was open to a return last June and City fans & cynics laughed it off

Mes que en club, Pep knows
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And as I posted: You are more then welcome to Garcia.
He is bang average. However, I can't blame him for wanting to return
to his boyhood club and good on him for that. However, he will not be missed
from a footballing perspective. Many players are shining lights in the youth team
but never step up to it in the seniors. I wish the lad all the good luck in the world
but I genuinely didn't rate him. No pace, no positional sense. Yep he's only
20 years old but he isn't anywhere near Dias in a million years.
 
catcherintherye said:
I mean of course, but the idea that City will never be as big as United, or more successful I find a bit unusual. I watched the Berkshire Hathaway shareholders meeting last week, and Warrem Buffet put up the 20 most successful companies 30 years ago- and not a single one is in the top 20 now. Not only can these things change but they do.

Likewise if you go back 30 years, the idea Everton wouldn't be at the top of the English game would seem bizarre, but witihn 10 years we were fighting relegation annually. If you went back to 1970 and said Liverpool will be the dominant force over Everton, again you would be laughed away. Everton had won more trophies, had more fans, a better and younger team, a better ground etc.

City have the infastucture and the money behind them to build a lasting legacy. United are on a downward trend. Trends can be reversed, but things change quickly in football and life. Another 10 years at this rate and City will be where United were probably 10 years ago.
Click to expand...

How is it unusual? Are there fans that think Girona (owing to City involvement) are destined to be bigger than Barca? Football is indeed big business and fortunes can absolutely change quickly but legacies do not develop over night much less 20 or 30 years ago in football. Clubs I am talking about have been a factor for more than a century, not just existing but flourishing

Indeed, Everton's history has gone through waves of success but at any point in last century has Everton been bigger than United or Barca, for example, by any metric? Are they about to be?

Pep touched on this I think in either the first of his premiership titles or the 2nd of the back to back, that City needs to show patience before seeing themselves at the table of a club like Barca with tremendous history, trophies & even philosophy - the vast majority of City's trophies are in the last decade. Because as easily as their arrival just over a decade ago, sheikhs can be gone

Before Pep's arrival, the infrastructure and money ensured only that they had great resources - not that it would succeed with just any coach. Will the next coach be more Mancini? Pellegrini? Can you build a fanbase in a community that is overwhelming for United in Manchester? Not sure Buffett can weigh on those likelihoods but then again he's just a money man, not really about the overall project
 
PaulPowersTash said:
And as I posted: You are more then welcome to Garcia.
He is bang average. However, I can't blame him for wanting to return
to his boyhood club and good on him for that. However, he will not be missed
from a footballing perspective. Many players are shining lights in the youth team
but never step up to it in the seniors. I wish the lad all the good luck in the world
but I genuinely didn't rate him. No pace, no positional sense. Yep he's only
20 years old but he isn't anywhere near Dias in a million years.
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Pep values him, Lucho values him and every youth coach where he captained values him so yeah I'm devastated that keyboard warriors deem him surplus because he doesn't want to stay at City

13 years, 1 youth player in Foden. Let's see what the next 13 years produce
 

FCBarça said:
How is it unusual? Are there fans that think Girona (owing to City involvement) are destined to be bigger than Barca? Football is indeed big business and fortunes can absolutely change quickly but legacies do not develop over night much less 20 or 30 years ago in football. Clubs I am talking about have been a factor for more than a century, not just existing but flourishing

Indeed, Everton's history has gone through waves of success but at any point in last century has Everton been bigger than United or Barca, for example, by any metric? Are they about to be?

Pep touched on this I think in either the first of his premiership titles or the 2nd of the back to back, that City needs to show patience before seeing themselves at the table of a club like Barca with tremendous history, trophies & even philosophy - the vast majority of City's trophies are in the last decade. Because as easily as their arrival just over a decade ago, sheikhs can be gone

Before Pep's arrival, the infrastructure and money ensured only that they had great resources - not that it would succeed with just any coach. Will the next coach be more Mancini? Pellegrini? Can you build a fanbase in a community that is overwhelming for United in Manchester? Not sure Buffett can weigh on those likelihoods but then again he's just a money man, not really about the overall project
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I don't know enough about Barcelona to comment mate, but United have not been dominant for a century. Everton have also had multiple periods wher ethey have been more successful than Manchester United. Indeed it took until the mid 90's for United to overtake Everton's league wins. For those slightly older they have played in the 2nd division, and through the 70's/80's United were seen as a bit of a joke. When they won the FA Cup in 1977 that was like a big underdog success story.

The same with Liverpool. When my uncle grew up watching Everton, Liverpool were languishing half way up the 2nd division. Nobody was intereted in them. They didn't win the FA Cup for the first 100 years of it's existence (at a time when the FA Cup was seen as on par with the league).

Not even trophies though, up until the early 70's Everton had a higher average gate than United and Liverpool. City aren't as big as Everton historically, but they have had periods where they have had more fans than United and won more.

As for Manchester being United, I'm not rally sure thats true again. I'd imagine City have more match going supporters in the area than United, and that will only grow if they have another 10 years of success.

As for Buffet, he is very much not just a money man not interested in the overal project. He looks at fundamentals of organisations, and avoids the hype and assumptions that surround them. To coin a buffet term, United certainly had a moat, but City have basically crossed that moat now.

In relation to Barcelona, they have a bigger moat. But if they have to go into a period of selling for 10 years, akin to Leeds to service the debt, of course other teams can come and partially fill the void.
 
FCBarça said:
Indeed, Everton's history has gone through waves of success but at any point in last century has Everton been bigger than United or Barca, for example, by any metric? Are they about to be?

Pep touched on this I think in either the first of his premiership titles or

Before Pep's arrival, the infrastructure and money ensured only that they had great resources - not that it would succeed with just any coach. Will the next coach be more Mancini? Pellegrini? Can you build a fanbase in a community that is overwhelming for United in Manchester? Not sure Buffett can weigh on those likelihoods but then again he's just a money man, not really about the overall project
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Barca only overtook Everton in league titles won in the 1950s. Man Utd in the 1960s.

Are you sure United fans outnumber City fans in Manchester?
 
FCBarça said:
How is it unusual? Are there fans that think Girona (owing to City involvement) are destined to be bigger than Barca? Football is indeed big business and fortunes can absolutely change quickly but legacies do not develop over night much less 20 or 30 years ago in football. Clubs I am talking about have been a factor for more than a century, not just existing but flourishing

Indeed, Everton's history has gone through waves of success but at any point in last century has Everton been bigger than United or Barca, for example, by any metric? Are they about to be?

Pep touched on this I think in either the first of his premiership titles or the 2nd of the back to back, that City needs to show patience before seeing themselves at the table of a club like Barca with tremendous history, trophies & even philosophy - the vast majority of City's trophies are in the last decade. Because as easily as their arrival just over a decade ago, sheikhs can be gone

Before Pep's arrival, the infrastructure and money ensured only that they had great resources - not that it would succeed with just any coach. Will the next coach be more Mancini? Pellegrini? Can you build a fanbase in a community that is overwhelming for United in Manchester? Not sure Buffett can weigh on those likelihoods but then again he's just a money man, not really about the overall project
Click to expand...
Fella, I'd stop there if I was you.
You are embarrassing yourself with comments like that.
Honestly.
 

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