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Hilary Benn Sacked From The Shadow Cabinet - wider political debate

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Jib in lad said:
Again you miss the point.

Thousands took the time to show Corbyn support.
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But what does that tell us that we don't already know?

We know Liverpool will vote Labour., as will the other major cities. We know a huge portion of Labours core support are very passionate about JC and will back him to the end. What does it tell you about his chances in the home counties, or his broader appeal in general?

I'd love nothing more than Corbyn as our PM, but I do fear we look at it through our metropolis bubble. The next election won't be won or lost in places like Liverpool. Step outside the big city and how popular is he?
 
Paul Davies, vice-chair of the Wallasey CLP and a retired union official with Unite
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Remember he was at a ward meeting once in the magazine alehouse, touting for our now mayor Pat Hackett (or 'Pot Haircut' as he's known to my family & a few others).

Davies was harping on about his activism to a group of us: "I remember we took over the town hall....yadder, yadder, yadder" and just generally boring the pants off everyone, when one lad (Who wasn't the sharpest light bulb in the picnic hamper) Stood up, pointed his finger an inch from his mush and said: "Unless you can it, right TF now, I'm gonna spark you clean out, you complete gobshoite"

Never seen a man turn so pale that he became transparent, before. lol

One of that number, Fiona Kelly, a teacher from Wallasey, joined the Young Socialists – Labour’s youth wing – aged 15 but left the party during the Blair years. She almost rejoined when Corbyn was elected but, now 47, has finally done so in order to vote for him. Kelly expressed frustration with the PLP for launching a coup attempt now. “I have waited a lifetime for this: when the Conservatives are in disarray,” she said. “Another chance might not come again. This should have been Labour’s moment.”
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The sad truth. Rather than concentrating on the removal of the tories, the bliarites have concentrated on making the party as tory as possible themselves.
 
Mountfield1985 said:
But what does that tell us that we don't already know?

We know Liverpool will vote Labour., as will the other major cities. We know a huge portion of Labours core support are very passionate about JC and will back him to the end. What does it tell you about his chances in the home counties, or his broader appeal in general?

I'd love nothing more than Corbyn as our PM, but I do fear we look at it through our metropolis bubble. The next election won't be won or lost in places like Liverpool. Step outside the big city and how popular is he?
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That's always the concern, aye, but I don't think it's a Corbyn-specific problem. There's no reason why he couldn't or shouldn't have a broad appeal, he's more in touch with reality than the rest of them. With Farage resigning (again) today, now is the time the PLP should be backing Corbyn to get that message out there. If Labour can get people in these disaffected areas to turn their anger on the Tories (where it belongs), then they have every chance of winning the next election.
 
Milkman said:
That's always the concern, aye, but I don't think it's a Corbyn-specific problem. There's no reason why he couldn't or shouldn't have a broad appeal, he's more in touch with reality than the rest of them. With Farage resigning (again) today, now is the time the PLP should be backing Corbyn to get that message out there. If Labour can get people in these disaffected areas to turn their anger on the Tories (where it belongs), then they have every chance of winning the next election.
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I hope you're right but I see no possible scenario in which he prevents the party splitting and turns this around as leader.

Tories are 7 points ahead in the latest opinion polls, in the midst of their worst ever party crisis. I don't think we should underestimate the strength of feeling against JC in huge areas of the UK.
 

Mountfield1985 said:
I hope you're right but I see no possible scenario in which he prevents the party splitting and turns this around as leader.

Tories are 7 points ahead in the latest opinion polls, in the midst of their worst ever party crisis. I don't think we should underestimate the strength of feeling against JC in huge areas of the UK.
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He is unelectable , I don't mind listening to him myself, but he has zero chance of winning a general election , just doesn't do it for most people and surrounds himself with the likes of Abbott , Thornberry ect who might go down well around London but offer nothing to the rest of the country ,its not about anymore its the existence of the party as a force in UK politics.
 
edge said:
He is unelectable , I don't mind listening to him myself, but he has zero chance of winning a general election , just doesn't do it for most people and surrounds himself with the likes of Abbott , Thornberry ect who might go down well around London but offer nothing to the rest of the country ,its not about anymore its the existence of the party as a force in UK politics.
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This is what keeps being said, but it is very questionable how true it is. Take the actual legacy of "New Labour" for example:

i) 220,000 members leaving whilst they were in Government
ii) 4 million votes lost whilst they were in Government
iii) 161 seats lost whilst they were in Government
iv) Scotland transformed from a safe area into one where they have one seat.

1997 is the one genuine victory they can lay claim to, and that was by far and away the most left-wing manifesto that Blair ever ran on (windfall taxes on privatized utilities, a minimum wage etc). Far from Corbyn threatening the future of the party, it is the moderates getting back in control that presents an existential threat to their ongoing existence - they are already threatening to ignore some areas (the few remaining solid Labour areas) because they are "anti-immigrant" and voted against the EU.
 
tsubaki said:
This is what keeps being said, but it is very questionable how true it is. Take the actual legacy of "New Labour" for example:

i) 220,000 members leaving whilst they were in Government
ii) 4 million votes lost whilst they were in Government
iii) 161 seats lost whilst they were in Government
iv) Scotland transformed from a safe area into one where they have one seat.

1997 is the one genuine victory they can lay claim to, and that was by far and away the most left-wing manifesto that Blair ever ran on (windfall taxes on privatized utilities, a minimum wage etc). Far from Corbyn threatening the future of the party, it is the moderates getting back in control that presents an existential threat to their ongoing existence - they are already threatening to ignore some areas (the few remaining solid Labour areas) because they are "anti-immigrant" and voted against the EU.
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1997 was astonishing tho, they won an insane amount of seats..so were bound to lose seats in future elections
 

.......I suggested a while ago that the centre left Labour and Liberal politicians might have to form a new party if ever there is to be a proper alternative to the Tories. I am hopeful of the new intake of younger Labour MPs, they seem to genuinely put public service against personal ambition. Time for a major shake up rather than extremes of the political divide led by nationalist conservatives and McCluskey's unelectables.
 
Eggs said:
.......I suggested a while ago that the centre left Labour and Liberal politicians might have to form a new party if ever there is to be a proper alternative to the Tories. I am hopeful of the new intake of younger Labour MPs, they seem to genuinely put public service against personal ambition. Time for a major shake up rather than extremes of the political divide led by nationalist conservatives and McCluskey's unelectables.
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Well, it's worked a treat for these guys.
 

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