Is Sam that bad?

[EFC78]

For me thats the long and short of it

There all after the current flavor of the month or the next fancy dan from abroad

They decided that they didn't like him before he came in. They couldn't give credit where it was due when he first came in and got us a good set of results which effectively steered us away from any relegation troubles which was a legitimate concern at the time. He then faced a load of tough fixtures which we'd been losing badly earlier on under Koeman anyway and this gave them the ammunition they craved. Sadly for them, flavour of the month manager Marco Silva was unravelling all his early good work at Watford so they couldn't convince those of us who backed Allardyce for this season that he was a better option. Hes now back to getting wins against the sides outside the top 6 but these results just get dismissed as expected and they focus on the poor Arsenal result when this side got beat by Arsenal 5-2 at home earlier on in the season.

 

[windymiller]

He's never had the funds that he will have here, im excited to see what he can do with some serious backing, he's a very clever manager and knows how to get the best out of his players, like i said before lots of the squad are full of praise for the man

You're delusional and I hope we never see Allardyce wasting our money.
Once again, given you and apparently all the players think he is an amazing manager, why has no big club in his 30 years of exceptional management given him an opportunity? Could it be because he isn't up to it?

 

[EFC78]

That is true, and my view is we should look to arrest and reverse that decline rather than accept it as our lot and settle for mediocrity. Allardyce represents surrender, not progress.

Agreed, but you can't hold Allardyce to the same expectations when coming in part way through the season when the damage had already been done by Koeman and Unsworth. He came in with us knocked out of the League Cup, out of the Europa League and in 13th (17th when he was officially appointed). Whether you want to judge him from the time he was appointed (before West Ham), or after that match, we have made clear progress under him. We aren't struggling against the poorer sides at home in general and have the 7th most points in the league since he became manager. How is that surrender and not progress from when he took us over?

 

[TonyS]

They decided that they didn't like him before he came in. They couldn't give credit where it was due when he first came in and got us a good set of results which effectively steered us away from any relegation troubles which was a legitimate concern at the time. He then faced a load of tough fixtures which we'd been losing badly earlier on under Koeman anyway and this gave them the ammunition they craved. Sadly for them, flavour of the month manager Marco Silva was unravelling all his early good work at Watford so they couldn't convince those of us who backed Allardyce for this season that he was a better option. Hes now back to getting wins against the sides outside the top 6 but these results just get dismissed as expected and they focus on the poor Arsenal result when this side got beat by Arsenal 5-2 at home earlier on in the season.

Mate you've put that across much better than I could, 100% this though

He was hated before he even arrived

 

[EFC78]

You're delusional and I hope we never see Allardyce wasting our money.
Once again, given you and apparently all the players think he is an amazing manager, why has no big club in his 30 years of exceptional management given him an opportunity? Could it be because he isn't up to it?

Like signing Walcott?

 

[windymiller]

Interested to know what you think the club should do

*awaits "sign Pep or Jose"

I would take a chance on someone like Fonseca, it might not work out but at least we would see something that resembles football. It is always better to try to succeed and fail than to never bother. That is what appointing Allardyce is, not trying. He has never won anything. He managed to lose a final against Middleborough, FFS. His only final in decades, by the way. He is a serial loser.

 

[TonyS]

You're delusional and I hope we never see Allardyce wasting our money.
Once again, given you and apparently all the players think he is an amazing manager, why has no big club in his 30 years of exceptional management given him an opportunity? Could it be because he isn't up to it?

Not really, the top 6 have mainly gone for men abroad, Arsenal/Utd/Everton wrote off because they had very long term managers, Chelsea have never appointed English under Roman and Liverpool have always liked to go for attacking style managers

He's not had the chance due to his nationality and the fact football snobs see him as an unattractive appointment

 

[windymiller]

Agreed, but you can't hold Allardyce to the same expectations when coming in part way through the season when the damage had already been done by Koeman and Unsworth. He came in with us knocked out of the League Cup, out of the Europa League and in 13th (17th when he was officially appointed). Whether you want to judge him from the time he was appointed (before West Ham), or after that match, we have made clear progress under him. We aren't struggling against the poorer sides at home in general and have the 7th most points in the league since he became manager. How is that surrender and not progress from when he took us over?

I agree that the job that needed to be done this season was one of firefighting. However, this thread is about next season primarily (or at least my comments are). Beating teams in the bottom half of the table should be our minimum expectation not the heights of our ambitions. If we retain Allardyce that would be the clearest indication that Moshiri's plan is to increase the value of his investment by developing the club's infrastructure rather by in pitch achievement as Allardyce has never won a thing and his team selections and attitude towards games against "big" clubs suggest he never will.

 

[Simon Buttle]

They decided that they didn't like him before he came in. They couldn't give credit where it was due when he first came in and got us a good set of results which effectively steered us away from any relegation troubles which was a legitimate concern at the time. He then faced a load of tough fixtures which we'd been losing badly earlier on under Koeman anyway and this gave them the ammunition they craved. Sadly for them, flavour of the month manager Marco Silva was unravelling all his early good work at Watford so they couldn't convince those of us who backed Allardyce for this season that he was a better option. Hes now back to getting wins against the sides outside the top 6 but these results just get dismissed as expected and they focus on the poor Arsenal result when this side got beat by Arsenal 5-2 at home earlier on in the season.

Yeah, he did do this but he then he decided in his wisdom to go and change the whole team about for no reason whatsoever and we started looking bloody awfull again. It's also the smug arrogance in the aftermatch interviews when it is always the fault of the players, never him despite the fact he has just made a load of changes in personel and tactically. He has an ego that makes Jose Mourinho look small at times. My view is that for now i don't want another change during the season, but i think Moshiri should be spending now until the May looking at Sam, Walsh and the recruitment setup at the club and hopefully somewhere along those lines Elstone and Kenwright might go also. We just need to grow up as club and move on a bit imo.

 

[TonyS]

I would take a chance on someone like Fonseca, it might not work out but at least we would see something that resembles football. It is always better to try to succeed and fail than to never bother. That is what appointing Allardyce is, not trying. He has never won anything. He managed to lose a final against Middleborough, FFS. His only final in decades, by the way. He is a serial loser.

Knew it

Fancy Dan from abroad over the proven Premier league manager, we need stability and to get things sorted on and off the pitch, bringing in some flash on the pan from abroad could see us dragged back into a relegation battle

 

[4737carlin]

You're delusional and I hope we never see Allardyce wasting our money.
Once again, given you and apparently all the players think he is an amazing manager, why has no big club in his 30 years of exceptional management given him an opportunity? Could it be because he isn't up to it?

Sam hasnt' wasted any

 

[windymiller]

Like signing Walcott?

If you read my earlier posts you will see I think that Walcott was a good signing. However, Mangala is a disgrace of a player and the signing of Tosun, who Allardyce tried to sign at Palace, is looking like a very expensive mistake as Allardyce refuses to play him.
The players Allardyce signed at West Ham do not fill me with optimism either.
I stand by my comments about Allardyce not being a transfer genius. Combine him with his old mate Walshy and there is a clear and present danger to this club.

 

[windymiller]

Not really, the top 6 have mainly gone for men abroad, Arsenal/Utd/Everton wrote off because they had very long term managers, Chelsea have never appointed English under Roman and Liverpool have always liked to go for attacking style managers

He's not had the chance due to his nationality and the fact football snobs see him as an unattractive appointment

So, it's a conspiracy against him but I'm the irrational one.

 

[TonyS]

I agree that the job that needed to be done this season was one of firefighting. However, this thread is about next season primarily (or at least my comments are). Beating teams in the bottom half of the table should be our minimum expectation not the heights of our ambitions. If we retain Allardyce that would be the clearest indication that Moshiri's plan is to increase the value of his investment by developing the club's infrastructure rather by in pitch achievement as Allardyce has never won a thing and his team selections and attitude towards games against "big" clubs suggest he never will.

Fonseca has won utter tripe at clubs expected to win things in very poor leagues

Sam has managed in the hardest league in the world for decades

 

[windymiller]

Knew it

Fancy Dan from abroad over the proven Premier league manager, we need stability and to get things sorted on and off the pitch, bringing in some flash on the pan from abroad could see us dragged back into a relegation battle

Yep, better to finish 10th every season for the foreseeable future. Like I said, coward.