2023/24 Kevin Thelwell

[Blue peter]

But signing gash like che adams is why we are where we are , a 27 year old who is gash and who’s value will go down… I’d rather have kept maupay and saved all the messing about .

I get what you’re saying but if you keep doing the same things then you can expect the same results .

The fact that Luton, sheff utd are in this league means that we only have to find one more club to finish above …

I know that’s a really crap target to have but ot is where we are right now .

The fact we have an enquiry in October also means that we had to watch our money

Yeah was not advocating Che Adams at all (he’s not what we need in terms of quality) but was just using as an example. To be clear, I want to get away from the signing 28 year old gash players whose quality is not the requisite standard, and would love to see us move into the earlier age brackets, but I just think given the lack of goals in the team, we needed to focus this summer on a PL survival transfer strategy.

In terms of the bolded bit above, I’m not sure on the logic of that, surely if we have a hearing coming up, the results of which could be a transfer ban, you try and sign some players now, and not save money. It all depends on what his budget is and cash flow position is. I have defended Thelwell on the basis that I think he has been given a near impossible hand to deal with….I imagine it is one of, if not the toughest DoF role in the PL, but if he has had money and he is just buggering stuff up, then there should be questions.

 

[Blue peter]

Thelwell reminds FB92 a lot of himself on this forum. Unappreciated, underrated, same kind of haters who refuse to give either any credit - A convenient scapegoat for the circus clowns around them if you will.

I agree with your stance on that we no longer seem to want to panic buy - I imagine we offered £25m for Gnonto and walked away when the price got silly. Long term I would like to see us pay whats needed to get a top talent in the door... but with the stadium build and FFP issues I understand why at present time its not feasible in doing so.

I agree that we’ve paid over the odds in the past…the Icelander being the prime example. I guess the question is whilst being a tough negotiator is the right way to approach business (it is part of my job role), is it right to do this when we are in the dire situation we are in.

So for example, Leeds may have wanted an additional £5m, we do not agree this represents value and walk away, which is great when you have a 10 point differential to work with above the relegation zone, and six weeks left of the window. We don’t have either of those, so do you pay the extra £5m to help avoid relegation or run the real risk of being relegated and losing £100m+.

There’s no guarantee Gnonto helps us stay up, like there is no guarantee we get relegated if he does not sign….it’s the decision we have to make based on the risk of us dropping.

 

[Neiler]

If we saw Coleman and Youngs' contracts expire and sold Godfrey, Keane and Holgate for low fees.

What would you think the overall 'savings' would be for the 5 (as a total wage + transfer total pot) bearing in mind their book values ?



Where would you see us as weaker than last season?



Its just a numbers game but it has to allow for the high potential players to develop. Its the difference of having e.g £15mil asset in Branthwaite and perhaps a £60mil+ asset.

Holgate, Coleman, Keane and Young dont carry or hold little Amortisation. Wages wise each would be on minimum 4 mill a year. So id wager close to 16 mill, Holgate and Keane Amoritsation - prob another million. £17 overall, less the book which is minimal.

Godfrey is a different story, his amortisation/book is £5mill next summer and he earns about 4 mill, so we would save 9 million before a fee.

All in aprrox £26 million before fees less book.

 

[Neiler]

I think the distinction between buying players for the here and now, and quality players or not is being conflated mate. If the quality players that improve the team, in the positions we need are not available (which in itself would be odd given it’s a big market out there) then I agree we should not buy for the sake of it. It’s better to keep our powder dry for the January window or explore the loan market.

I guess the question is do you spend for the sake of it and turn your attention to bringing in players with potential who could improve the team in the future. I would argue no, if buying that player (and only if) impacts on our ability to explore loans, or use the January transfer window.

I find it really odd, as others have pointed out that we haven’t even fully explored the loan market which would take up our full quota. Is it possible this is because loan payments are required and we did not have the money? Aside from Beto (and obviously the jury is out on him) this has been a poor window, which is a shocker for a team who has played 3 (2 at home against average opposition) lost 3 and scored no goals. Today is such a vitally important game….I think anything less than a win spells real trouble (and we all know what we are like against newly promoted teams).

Good post mate. Personally i was always expecting a battle - ive had low expectations for the season regardless of transfers - but i think we will be alright.

I suspect not using our full compliment of loans is a contingency for January mate, giving our self scope to do something temporary in that window - say if we pick up a real bad injury to a key player or we look short in a line.

 

[Blue peter]

Good post mate. Personally i was always expecting a battle - ive had low expectations for the season regardless of transfers - but i think we will be alright.

I suspect not using our full compliment of loans is a contingency for January mate, giving our self scope to do something temporary in that window - say if we pick up a real bad injury to a key player or we look short in a line.

Yes could be, the fear I have is that we will be adrift at that point, but we’ll see

 

[Neiler]

Yes could be, the fear I have is that we will be adrift at that point, but we’ll see

Its a knaw for sure mate, we've left points behind this - this run.

You know us though we will loose games we expect to win (usually by a poxy goal against the run of play or last minute), then pull of a miracle against Chelsea, Utd, Arsenal, Brighton or someone.

Would love to see McNeill today, we need 6 point from Sheff Utd and Luton - id prefer if today was at home.

 

[edge]

Well he obviously being asked to work miracles by getting players in for nothing while selling players, the ones we got in seem to be OK, and he has put a major dent in my long held wish to get rid of some of the players that have stank the place out over the last few years , pity Keane was among them to be honest but we would be miles to light at the back at the moment.
The mentality of the squad has been wrong for years.
The people at the top should be honest about the situation at the club and be open to the fans about it,(we can all see it anyway)
But the will not shower of cowards, this fella is being left out to dry .

 

[Zatara]

Holgate, Coleman, Keane and Young dont carry or hold little Amortisation. Wages wise each would be on minimum 4 mill a year. So id wager close to 16 mill, Holgate and Keane Amoritsation - prob another million. £17 overall, less the book which is minimal.

Godfrey is a different story, his amortisation/book is £5mill next summer and he earns about 4 mill, so we would save 9 million before a fee.

All in aprrox £26 million before fees less book.

So, in theory we could sell Godfrey, Holgate and Keane for £20mil total. Less £6mil amortization = £14mil.

Plus saved wages for all 5 = £20mil.

=£34mil in fees and savings.

Thats a nice conservative amount to put towards new players.

 

[Tel001]

Yeah was not advocating Che Adams at all (he’s not what we need in terms of quality) but was just using as an example. To be clear, I want to get away from the signing 28 year old gash players whose quality is not the requisite standard, and would love to see us move into the earlier age brackets, but I just think given the lack of goals in the team, we needed to focus this summer on a PL survival transfer strategy.

In terms of the bolded bit above, I’m not sure on the logic of that, surely if we have a hearing coming up, the results of which could be a transfer ban, you try and sign some players now, and not save money. It all depends on what his budget is and cash flow position is. I have defended Thelwell on the basis that I think he has been given a near impossible hand to deal with….I imagine it is one of, if not the toughest DoF role in the PL, but if he has had money and he is just buggering stuff up, then there should be questions.

The hearing would have been on his mind and would have been a major consideration in previous windows .

I was just pointing out that he has been working with major restrictions since day one and him recruiting players that will increase in value is a huge part of him being able to do the job long term and if he does ever lose his job he may actually have a chance of getting another

 

[Shibbywiggles]

I think it’s pretty clear that he’s been working with both hands tied behind his back, I’d love to know what his goals were.

It his goal was to improve the attack, especially striker position for around net zero cash without hurting other positions whilst netting around 200kpw off our wage bill I think he’s done an unbelievable job to be honest and that’s before getting into the Beto deal structure with no payment for a year.

 

[everton1953]

Well he obviously being asked to work miracles by getting players in for nothing while selling players, the ones we got in seem to be OK, and he has put a major dent in my long held wish to get rid of some of the players that have stank the place out over the last few years , pity Keane was among them to be honest but we would be miles to light at the back at the moment.
The mentality of the squad has been wrong for years.
The people at the top should be honest about the situation at the club and be open to the fans about it,(we can all see it anyway)
But the will not shower of cowards, this fella is being left out to dry .

Well said.

 

[ToffeeTim]

Good post mate. Personally i was always expecting a battle - ive had low expectations for the season regardless of transfers - but i think we will be alright.

I suspect not using our full compliment of loans is a contingency for January mate, giving our self scope to do something temporary in that window - say if we pick up a real bad injury to a key player or we look short in a line.

We were absolutely desperate for players last January and did nothing. Even with a big 45m sale.

There will be more of the same excuses thrown out in January. The club are taking the fans for a ride.

 

[Toffeepot]

1. Good financial decision re iwobi
2. Good financial decision not letting Leeds shaft us for gnonto
3. Strengthened up top end which was badly needed
4. Half fixed his maupay mistake

Would I have liked one or two more signings? Sure, but I think we will be fine once mcneil, Harrison and Dom are all fit( I know, waiting on injuries but most teams outside the top teams have to do that

I'm happy with Thelwell so far,
He and Dyche just might just be the adults in the room that we need

Let's enjoy these times as best we can coz we're winning the league in 7 years

 

[blueblood]

So, in theory we could sell Godfrey, Holgate and Keane for £20mil total. Less £6mil amortization = £14mil.

Plus saved wages for all 5 = £20mil.

=£34mil in fees and savings.

Thats a nice conservative amount to put towards new players.

I don’t even think at the moment it’s as complex as amortisation, it’s just pure profit and loss and on that front we’ve have made another significant saving on our wage bill having moved on some big earners, with more coming the end of their deals next summer. Feels like we are finally coming to the end of the cycle of aging, massively overpaid players who contribute nothing or very little.

 

[formerly manx toffee]

I am not happy with the window. I am worried. However I think Thelwell has done well. The financial and FFP position we are in is shocking and I lay that at the door of the Board and Owner