2017/18 Kieran Dowell

[davek]

Where would he fit in though Dave?, he's not getting in over Walcott or Sigurdsson and we would likely bring in a left sided winger to alternate with Bolasie. At best he'll be a 15-20 min cameo and a League Cup starter unless we had an injury crisis

Sigurdsson is mediocre and on the wane; Rooney cant even get a full season in now; Bolasie is terrible. I'd say there's plenty of room for him.

 

[davek]

..I doubt very much that he lacks motivation, players will have form dips during a season and let’s not forget this is his first experience of open age football. The fact that he’s the clubs leading scorer and possibly player of the season says a lot.

Players with a bit of magic are at a premium, midfielders who score goals are at a premium. Dowell is both. I’m sure he would’ve improved our team playing right side before Walcott arrived. He already had a well defined partnership with Kenny and would have added goals and creativity when we lacked both.

I don’t know if this lad will be a top flight star but I think he has a chance. Dowell is an asset and I think it would be wise to get him on a longer contract if the player is prepared to commit to Everton. If not, we need to try and transfer him with a sell on clause.

Agree with all that apart from the first point: he looks jaded at Forest now. And why wouldn't he be? He has nothing to prove there but Everton aren't showing any inclination to keep him in the loop.

 

[originalgreaserbob]

What we have with Dowell, Davies, Kenny, Calvert Lewin, Holgate, and Connolly, together with Pickford, who is in a similar situation and knew a couple of them already from u21s, should be fostered and added too. They have have something we have missed for a while now, and that's team work, fight, and a genuine bond.

I'm not saying they are all the finished article, or that all 7 should be in the 1st team from game 1 next year, but they should all be in and around the match day squad

This sounds like a total fantasy. 7 youth players (including Lookman who you say you left out by mistake, oh and also Beni) all becoming important contributors to a team competing for top 6? You're basically saying they are one of the best groups of academy players ever. Seems unlikely to me.

This is a bellwether case for us. If they dont offer a player like Dowell a new contract and take him back this summer then we start to understand for sure that the club has spun out of control and all football affairs are anarchic and there is no plan.

To you, everything that happens at this club is proof that we have "spun out of control". You've been saying this for three years. Why do you still need more proof?

I think he proved himself at Forest first half of the season and now he's lacking motivation at that level. He needs to be around better quality players who have better movement for him to service and can bring him into the game more too.

Just spectacular. So, in your opinion, the fact that he played well at the start of the season proved that he's ready, and the fact that he's not playing well now proves that he's so ready that he's bored?

 

[davek]

No offence, but if he's lost motivation after half a season there then we are better off without him.

Where's his motivation coming from? He's proven what he can do. Forest are not in the play-offs and in no danger of going down.

 

[Charles Hawtrey]

Everyone has to start somewhere, I think he'd be made up to be getting a few games next season, coming on as a sub or even starting a few due to injuries and suspensions. He's not the real deal yet but he clearly has potential. I tire of people who only want us to play seasoned PL players in every slot every week. I mean, cuco gets a game.....

 

[originalgreaserbob]

he looks jaded at Forest now.

 

[davek]

This sounds like a total fantasy. 7 youth players (including Lookman who you say you left out by mistake, oh and also Beni) all becoming important contributors to a team competing for top 6? You're basically saying they are one of the best groups of academy players ever. Seems unlikely to me.



To you, everything that happens at this club is proof that we have "spun out of control". You've been saying this for three years. Why do you still need more proof?



Just spectacular. So, in your opinion, the fact that he played well at the start of the season proved that he's ready, and the fact that he's not playing well now proves that he's so ready that he's bored?

If you cant see the talent that lad has then that's your opinion. A staggeringly wrong opinion, but yours nonetheless.

 

[Eggs]

Agree with all that apart from the first point: he looks jaded at Forest now. And why wouldn't he be? He has nothing to prove there but Everton aren't showing any inclination to keep him in the loop.

..jaded is perfectly understandable but I think it’s wrong to suggest he’s lacking motivation. That is a slight on his character and I think he’s displayed lots of character to make an instant impact at a new club playing in such a highly competitive competition.

The lad is a talent, i’m in no doubt about that.

 

[originalgreaserbob]

If you cant see the talent that lad has then that's your opinion. A staggeringly wrong opinion, but yours nonetheless.

Sorry, my bad. I'm sure you're right. I guess I hadn't noticed how jaded he looked.

 

[davek]

..jaded is perfectly understandable but I think it’s wrong to suggest he’s lacking motivation. That is a slight on his character and I think he’s displayed lots of character to make an instant impact at a new club playing in such a highly competitive competition.

The lad is a talent, i’m in no doubt about that.

It's not a slight on his character. It'd be understandable if a lad who should be playing PL football is less than motivated playing for a team with nothing to play for having demonstrated what class he has and that he can and has contributed to Forest's season, but who is now getting stick off ex-Forest players and the local media asking why he isn't still in fine form for them and advocating he be loaned elsewhere. TBH I'd have demanded Everton take me back.

 

[Kever10]

This sounds like a total fantasy. 7 youth players (including Lookman who you say you left out by mistake, oh and also Beni) all becoming important contributors to a team competing for top 6? You're basically saying they are one of the best groups of academy players ever. Seems unlikely to me.

You sound like you are doubting that I accidentally forgot to include Lookman, as though I did it deliberately for some nefarious reason. What a strange thing to accuse me of.

As for the pure fantasy, I don't believe it is. I said they shouldn't all start, but should be in and around the squad. What part of "7 or 8 young players should be in our squad not necessarily playing every week and by no means all at the same time" sounds like fantasy to you?

Do you dream of picking 3 numbers on the lottery or something? Strange guy.

But hey, I hope you feel better after your rant. Have a nice Easter.

 

[blueblue]

He will be sold in the Summer.

If he isn't prepared to sign a new contract then I agree.

 

[Huyton Layne]

Can’t motivate himself? Then swerve and bin and file under Rodwell. He’s being paid thousands of pounds and has done bugger all in the grand scheme of things to think he’s too good for the Championship.
He needs to get his head down and earn a place at Everton.
I think he’ll just end up at a mid table Championship side scoring the odd worldie and giving as much effort as Denilson at Betis.

 

[davek]

People will only believe in him when he's on the pitch for us pulling strings and getting on the scoresheet. He's earned the right...more of a right than many in that team.

 

[Philw]

But I don't think that is the case mate in fairness to the lad. Just one posters take on it to justify his view that he shouldn't have gone on loan to the championship in the first place as it's below his level.

He's gone from 20 odd games a season for the U23s to week in week out in the hurly burly of the championship. He was playing 90 mins of almost every game without a break. He was still only 19/20 and the need to rest younger players doesn't just apply to premier games. The kid was basically knackered, I'm not surprised his form dropped. Plus he was playing under a different manager who changed his role in the team so he wasn't as productive.

In hindsight, I think the loan has done him more good than harm and I saw a better player when I watched the U21s last weekend. He's ready for a place in the first team squad next season IMO and also a new contract in the summer.

Oh, me either. I don't agree with anything Dave has posted there, he's been wrong about the loan from the start Imo.

Where's his motivation coming from? He's proven what he can do. Forest are not in the play-offs and in no danger of going down.

Can’t motivate himself? Then swerve and bin and file under Rodwell. He’s being paid thousands of pounds and has done bugger all in the grand scheme of things to think he’s too good for the Championship.
He needs to get his head down and earn a place at Everton.
I think he’ll just end up at a mid table Championship side scoring the odd worldie and giving as much effort as Denilson at Betis.

As Layne has said, if he thinks he has proven himself after one decent half season in the championship and can't motivate himself, or be bothered to put in a shift for a team sliding towards the relegation places then sell him asap. If it was Klaasen Dave would be slaughtering him.

Of course I don't believe that it's even remotely true.

Fwiw, I reckon the lad could be a special player in a few years.