Luke Garbutt

Try to keep him, or let him leave ?


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The 'favourite' in question is England's LB.

I dont see what Martinez has done wrong here:

offered Garbutt a good contract (by all accounts) - check
given Garbutt game time - check
ignored idiotic snide retweets by Garbutt that would have earned a kick in the bollocks from most other managers - check

This lad is being overly accommodated, imo. Personally I'd punt the no mark prima donna a long way down the road. Get a fee off the tribunal and move on is what Everton should do. I've heard enough about this feller to have alarm bells ringing about his attitude.

Some friggin haircut dictating terms to Everton and people defending him for it and attacking the manager - unreal.
I wouldn't be bothered if Baines hadn't looked a player on the slide this past year or so, but he has. Someone less popular would have been hammered by the fans for the performances he's put in; particularly when it's come to defending crosses.

Obviously that's just opinion, but what is a fact is that if Everton are going to continue to be skint in return for the privilege of being owned by Kenwright, they need to be shrewd with what resources they have available.

Allowing Baines to see out his career here at the expense of a younger player would be fine if it was likely there would be money for an adequate replacement when he finally does a Distin and makes himself unpickable.

However, Martinez knows the score when it comes to finances at Everton, so I'd expect him to plan ahead and avoid having to blow a significant chunk of a future budget on a left-back.

I'm aware that you won't accept any criticism of Rinus Michels 2.0, so I should point out that I believe this is part of an ingrained culture at Everton which I thought he'd do away with. Too few players leave this club at the right time, which is why we're still handing bumper contracts to members of a team that peaked with a cup final defeat and a fifth placed finish in 2009.
 

Besic has played 29 games. Are you on drugs ?
He gets off the bench a lot, yeah.

He was also promptly dropped once Barry and McCarthy were both available again, despite playing very well once his opportunity to get a run in the side finally came.
 
He gets off the bench a lot, yeah.

He was also promptly dropped once Barry and McCarthy were both available again, despite playing very well once his opportunity to get a run in the side finally came.
Ok. He played ok.
Done well for a young fella in his first year in the league in a relatively new position, but he's still got plenty of mistakes in his game and things to work on.
 

I wouldn't be bothered if Baines hadn't looked a player on the slide this past year or so, but he has. Someone less popular would have been hammered by the fans for the performances he's put in; particularly when it's come to defending crosses.

Obviously that's just opinion, but what is a fact is that if Everton are going to continue to be skint in return for the privilege of being owned by Kenwright, they need to be shrewd with what resources they have available.

Allowing Baines to see out his career here at the expense of a younger player would be fine if it was likely there would be money for an adequate replacement when he finally does a Distin and makes himself unpickable.

However, Martinez knows the score when it comes to finances at Everton, so I'd expect him to plan ahead and avoid having to blow a significant chunk of a future budget on a left-back.

I'm aware that you won't accept any criticism of Rinus Michels 2.0, so I should point out that I believe this is part of an ingrained culture at Everton which I thought he'd do away with. Too few players leave this club at the right time, which is why we're still handing bumper contracts to members of a team that peaked with a cup final defeat and a fifth placed finish in 2009.

All opinions mate but I think Baines is a better all-round player than he's ever been. His international experience, coupled with the manager now, has seen him turn from the focal point of an entire team's attack to a player who is far more balanced and composed on the ball and has developed a far wider passing range. Just one example - under Moyes, Baines was quite clearly under instructions to be at the by-line and cross the ball dead centre into the six yard box. These days he mixes this with that pull-back pass he does.

What he's missing is a partner who actually wants to utilise him. Pienaar and he have a great relationship, yes, but when players like McGeady and Kev play ahead of him they don't care about getting the best crosser in the league into an effective position, all they care about it beating their man so they look the part.

I think I can remember two or three incidents all seasons when Baines hasn't defended a cross well as you say, and if I remember correctly they were all after a few games out injured - to me rustiness is just normal. But then again I don't think Barry, Osman, Coleman have warranted the huge criticism they have received this season.

Anyway Garbutt, to bring it back on topic, is a good prospect but nothing more. His positional play is pretty bad defensively and, although I understand it will improve by playing games, it's not like he's a John Stones where his raw talent shines through.

I'd keep him but he isnt good enough yet.
 
He gets off the bench a lot, yeah.

He was also promptly dropped once Barry and McCarthy were both available again, despite playing very well once his opportunity to get a run in the side finally came.

Besic: 22 year old who'd previously never played in a decent league in his first year in arguably the best league in the world.

Honestly, he's played more than I thought he would.

He'll play a lot more next season.
 
Garbutt is OK like, but he's not better than Baines. I even doubt he's better than Oviedo when he's back fully fit. He's certainly not good enough yet to start bouncing around like he owns the place. Imo, if he doesn't want what he's been offered he can jog on. £25kpw for a youth whos not established yet, and still has a lot to learn? No way. Certainly when you consider if he does play more next season, he'll only be looking for a new, more lucrative contract anyway.
 
The 'favourite' in question is England's LB.

I dont see what Martinez has done wrong here:

offered Garbutt a good contract (by all accounts) - check
given Garbutt game time - check
ignored idiotic snide retweets by Garbutt that would have earned a kick in the bollocks from most other managers - check

This lad is being overly accommodated, imo. Personally I'd punt the no mark prima donna a long way down the road. Get a fee off the tribunal and move on is what Everton should do. I've heard enough about this feller to have alarm bells ringing about his attitude.

Some friggin haircut dictating terms to Everton and people defending him for it and attacking the manager - unreal.

I think some people might point to the fact he played Hibbert over Garbutt earlier in the season as poor management. As it happens Hibbert played very well that game (oddly he hasn't let us down once this season).

We don't know what the score is with Garbutt. We don't know what he's been offered, and if it's about money or opportunities. I am inclined to give Martinez the benefit of the doubt though, the way he talks about him is not of a manager who either wants (or expects) Garbutt to leave. He has tried to give other young players a chance, notably Browning, Barkley and Stones.

If we have offered him 25k per week and given some guarantees going forward that seems fair enough. If we have tried to scrimp on him with 8-10k per week people will be disappointed.

I suspect this will run and run. Even if a side has intimated they might take Garbutt at a higher wage between now and July lots can change. I still don't think it's cut and dried that he will leave.
 
I think some people might point to the fact he played Hibbert over Garbutt earlier in the season as poor management. As it happens Hibbert played very well that game (oddly he hasn't let us down once this season).

We don't know what the score is with Garbutt. We don't know what he's been offered, and if it's about money or opportunities. I am inclined to give Martinez the benefit of the doubt though, the way he talks about him is not of a manager who either wants (or expects) Garbutt to leave. He has tried to give other young players a chance, notably Browning, Barkley and Stones.

If we have offered him 25k per week and given some guarantees going forward that seems fair enough. If we have tried to scrimp on him with 8-10k per week people will be disappointed.

I suspect this will run and run. Even if a side has intimated they might take Garbutt at a higher wage between now and July lots can change. I still don't think it's cut and dried that he will leave.
Hibbert didn't play well against West Ham. Jenkinson rinsed him. Not really Hibbert's fault considering he's not a left back.
 

Hibbert didn't play well against West Ham. Jenkinson rinsed him. Not really Hibbert's fault considering he's not a left back.

The fact that he didn't give 5 goals away means he "played well" apparently. Despite the fact that he looked genuinely terrified every time he got the ball and wouldn't move an inch with it. Had to just stop dead and pass to whoever was nearest to him. It was painful
 

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