Install the app
How to install the app on iOS

Follow along with the video below to see how to install our site as a web app on your home screen.

Note: This feature may not be available in some browsers.

  • Participation within this subforum is only available to members who have had 5+ posts approved elsewhere.

Martinez new Belgium head coach

Status
Not open for further replies.
hktoffee said:
Yes the first season was excellent but it was a fluke that's why RM can't sustain it. His bad time is twice the length of the good time so for many posters, this bad memory remains longer.
Click to expand...

Meh. Facts versus emotions I guess.

So weird to me that Moyes gets such a pass for being a negative meff and talking us down whenever he could. I am made up he's been a massive failure three jobs in a row now. Totally wasted at least three seasons on him.
 
a bell maul said:
Cannot argue with you there mate. I was initially a Martinez fan. (But as I mentioned in the Rooney thread, my football IQ ain't all that)
Click to expand...

My issue as I've stated over and over is the over the top recap of his tenure.

I don't think anyone disagrees that he wore out his welcome and sacking him was the right move.

It's the OTT appraisals of his tenure that piss me off.
 
Last edited:
ilikecheese said:
My issue as I've stated over and over is the over the too recap of his tenure.

I don't think anyone disagrees that he wore out his welcome and sacking him was the right move.

It's the OTT appraisals of his tenure that piss me off.
Click to expand...

Got to say people will remember his failure a lot more because how it turned out after his good first season. Don't forget bad time is twice the length. When RM himself blamed the players...thus losing the dressing room and blaming the fans at home, you know he had lost it and won't last much longer.
 
hktoffee said:
Got to say people will remember his failure a lot more because how it turned out after his good first season. Don't forget bad time is twice the length. When RM himself blamed the players...thus losing the dressing room and blaming the fans at home, you know he had lost it and won't last much longer.
Click to expand...

Fair enough. I seem to remember a deep (as deep as we've done since 1985) Europe campaign followed by two deep cup runs.

It didn't work out. He stuggled balancing the competitions badly. No issue saying that. It's pretty damn obvious he did.

Weird that league places seem to have become more important than trying to win something. He gave us sniffs of CL, EL success, and Cup successes.

Yes just sniffs but we've had so few it troubles me that so many discount it as meaningless.
 
ilikecheese said:
Managers are judged on all competitions.

Moyes 42%...Martinez 43%.
Click to expand...

OK, I can see where you are going with this, using his win percentage rate as a debating point which in your eyes does not make him out as bad as many make out.

But when you strip that back and look a little deeper, and realise

a) he inherited a much better side and a consistent top 7 team which Moyes had left him which was dramatically improved from the one Moyes took over.
b) year by year in the 2 that followed his good first season it is hard not to see with your own eyes that he took that team and destroyed it with his clueless ideas of defending and emphasis on tepid, toothless and pointless over egging of possession.
c) Most of his signings were awful bar a small handful (Lukaku, Barry, McCarthy being his saving graces, with Besic a hard one to call due to injuries)
d) At the end of the day, he won zero, same as Moyes and only qualified for Europe 1 season in 3.

So all in all, he was a bit of a disaster once he had ruined the side he inherited and had undone all of the work his predecessor had done in establishing us as a top of the table side again, after years in the bottom half of the table prior to his arrival.

I could go on, but it's probably pointless, I am not going to change your mind and you nor mine. The man was a complete disaster after his first season IMO, no cup runs are going to gloss over that, any half decent side can have a cup run with the right draw.

Oh and by the way, I was all for his appointment as I thought he seemed like he deserved a chance. In hindsight the cup run somehow managed to gloss over his relegation for some reason, don't think I thought that one through at the time!
 

Thomasc said:
OK, I can see where you are going with this, using his win percentage rate as a debating point which in your eyes does not make him out as bad as many make out.

But when you strip that back and look a little deeper, and realise

a) he inherited a much better side and a consistent top 7 team which Moyes had left him which was dramatically improved from the one Moyes took over.
b) year by year in the 2 that followed his good first season it is hard not to see with your own eyes that he took that team and destroyed it with his clueless ideas of defending and emphasis on tepid, toothless and pointless over egging of possession.
c) Most of his signings were awful bar a small handful (Lukaku, Barry, McCarthy being his saving graces, with Besic a hard one to call due to injuries)
d) At the end of the day, he won zero, same as Moyes and only qualified for Europe 1 season in 3.

So all in all, he was a bit of a disaster once he had ruined the side he inherited and had undone all of the work his predecessor had done in establishing us as a top of the table side again, after years in the bottom half of the table prior to his arrival.

I could go on, but it's probably pointless, I am not going to change your mind and you nor mine. The man was a complete disaster after his first season IMO, no cup runs are going to gloss over that, any half decent side can have a cup run with the right draw.

Oh and by the way, I was all for his appointment as I thought he seemed like he deserved a chance. In hindsight the cup run somehow managed to gloss over his relegation for some reason, don't think I thought that one through at the time!
Click to expand...

Any crap side can too, as evidenced by the other semi final being Crystal Palace v Watford last year.
 
ilikecheese said:
Fair enough. I seem to remember a deep (as deep as we've done since 1985) Europe campaign
Click to expand...
You keep saying this and it's not true. We reached the exact same stage under Moyes in 07-08 and we didn't crash out in embarrassing style like we did under Martinez. Not to forget the fact that in the same season we also reached the semi finals of the league cup and finished fifth.
 
ilikecheese said:
Fair enough. I seem to remember a deep (as deep as we've done since 1985) Europe campaign followed by two deep cup runs.

It didn't work out. He stuggled balancing the competitions badly. No issue saying that. It's pretty damn obvious he did.

Weird that league places seem to have become more important than trying to win something. He gave us sniffs of CL, EL success, and Cup successes.

Yes just sniffs but we've had so few it troubles me that so many discount it as meaningless.
Click to expand...

Didn't Martinez only go one round further than Moyes did?

What round was that Fiorentina game when Osman scored and we went out on pens?
 
Mikey_Fitzgerald said:
Didn't Martinez only go one round further than Moyes did?

What round was that Fiorentina game when Osman scored and we went out on pens?
Click to expand...
The last 16, we hammered SK Brann 6-1 at Goodison (8-1 on arragate) in the last 32. We went out at the exact stage Martinez reached but we didn't get humiliated in the process like the second leg in Kiev.
 

Gwladysstreetlad said:
Different season though. We're being told that Martinez lead our best season in Europe since 84-85 and it's factually incorrect.
Click to expand...

It is not incorrect either.

Comparing Moyes and Martinez by embarrassing European defeats really is not the way forward.

Actually comparing them full stop is a bit odd.

They are both losers.
 

Status
Not open for further replies.

Welcome to GrandOldTeam

Get involved. Registration is simple and free.

Register
Back
Top