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Martinez new Belgium head coach

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Gwladysstreetlad said:
The answer is 23 league games in the next two seasons combined (the last of which was under Rhino and it's a safe bet we'd of lost that had Martinez still been here). Those wins included the worst ever home league win tally in the club's history during 15-16, with a disgraceful six and was only bettered by one the previous season with seven. Oh and the blatant lie that our away form was class even if our home form was crap? B.S. because we won less league games on the road then we did at Goodison in 14-15 and the same in 15-16. We finished 11th on both occasions out doing the brilliance of the managerial team that consisted of Koeman, Rhino and BFS. The football was painful to watch most weeks with endless passing around the back four that went nowhere. On the rare occasion we played the exciting football Martinez is credited with (they became less and less frequent as teams figured us out) we would often as not throw away results due to a combination of shambolic defending that would of embarrassed a team full of kids and managerial incompetence/arrogance/stupidity that would defy belief (see West Ham and Stoke for perfect, painful examples of both).
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Mate 21 wins in 75 in the next 2 seasons right?
 
hktoffee said:
He would relegate this club. His last 2 seasons league records was horrendous.
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After Koeman's atrocious start to his second season and the torture that was Fat Sam, my view on Martinez's two final seasons have somewhat mellowed.

Nevertheless, we were arguably angling towards a sustained decline under Martinez as his later signings were 'questionable' and he didn't know how to defend.
 
PhilM said:
After Koeman's atrocious start to his second season and the torture that was Fat Sam, my view on Martinez's two final seasons have somewhat mellowed.

Nevertheless, we were arguably angling towards a sustained decline under Martinez as his later signings were 'questionable' and he didn't know how to defend.
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Surprisingly we still got 8th last season which was better than 11th and 13th.
 

hktoffee said:
Surprisingly we still got 8th last season which was better than 11th and 13th.
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I feel that the last five or so years has been us swinging between effective football, where we get the results, and attractive but less effective football.

We seem unable to really find that balance and arguably only Martinez's first season and stages of Koeman's second gave that - it's often one or the other.

Unfortunately, I have a feeling that Silva's football will once again swing the pendulum towards an attractive style football yet maybe the results won't be there.
 
PhilM said:
I feel that the last five or so years has been us swinging between effective football, where we get the results, and attractive but less effective football.

We seem unable to really find that balance and arguably only Martinez's first season and stages of Koeman's second gave that - it's often one or the other.

Unfortunately, I have a feeling that Silva's football will once again swing the pendulum towards an attractive style football yet maybe the results won't be there.
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As long as we get results I don’t care whether it’s pretty or not. We should aim to break into top 6.
 
Gwladysstreetlad said:
The answer is 23 league games in the next two seasons combined (the last of which was under Rhino and it's a safe bet we'd of lost that had Martinez still been here). Those wins included the worst ever home league win tally in the club's history during 15-16, with a disgraceful six and was only bettered by one the previous season with seven. Oh and the blatant lie that our away form was class even if our home form was crap? B.S. because we won less league games on the road then we did at Goodison in 14-15 and the same in 15-16. We finished 11th on both occasions out doing the brilliance of the managerial team that consisted of Koeman, Rhino and BFS. The football was painful to watch most weeks with endless passing around the back four that went nowhere. On the rare occasion we played the exciting football Martinez is credited with (they became less and less frequent as teams figured us out) we would often as not throw away results due to a combination of shambolic defending that would of embarrassed a team full of kids and managerial incompetence/arrogance/stupidity that would defy belief (see West Ham and Stoke for perfect, painful examples of both).
Click to expand...
Thing is when faced with stuff like this Davek goes very quiet because it doesn't fit his agenda of twisting facts to suit his argument.
 
Gwladysstreetlad said:
The answer is 23 league games in the next two seasons combined (the last of which was under Rhino and it's a safe bet we'd of lost that had Martinez still been here). Those wins included the worst ever home league win tally in the club's history during 15-16, with a disgraceful six and was only bettered by one the previous season with seven. Oh and the blatant lie that our away form was class even if our home form was crap? B.S. because we won less league games on the road then we did at Goodison in 14-15 and the same in 15-16. We finished 11th on both occasions out doing the brilliance of the managerial team that consisted of Koeman, Rhino and BFS. The football was painful to watch most weeks with endless passing around the back four that went nowhere. On the rare occasion we played the exciting football Martinez is credited with (they became less and less frequent as teams figured us out) we would often as not throw away results due to a combination of shambolic defending that would of embarrassed a team full of kids and managerial incompetence/arrogance/stupidity that would defy belief (see West Ham and Stoke for perfect, painful examples of both).
Click to expand...
I love the way the two SF cup runs are conveniently left out of the equation.
 

PhilM said:
After Koeman's atrocious start to his second season and the torture that was Fat Sam, my view on Martinez's two final seasons have somewhat mellowed.

Nevertheless, we were arguably angling towards a sustained decline under Martinez as his later signings were 'questionable' and he didn't know how to defend.
Click to expand...
Players and fans got us into a tail-spin. The manager's methods were sound - if a little ambitious trusting a lot of tat to play foobtall with proficiency.

Martinez missed the boat in the summer after his first season: he needed to ship a load of rubbish out and buy better in. He didn't/couldn't and the rest is history.

What the WC underlines 1000% is that his way of playing is a winning way of playing, and that the fault was at the club in terms of bog standard technicians and a fanbase that lost the plot.
 
davek said:
I love the way the two SF cup runs are conveniently left out of the equation.
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They weren't left out, there's no conspiracy for you to worry about. The subject was his league form and I was answering a question. We all know about the none-achievement of the two semi-finals and of course the dizzy hights of the last 16 in the Europa League. Neither of those things make up for the unforgivablely bad league form we endured those seasons. Winning a cup would of got him a pass, we didn't so he doesn't.
 
davek said:
Players and fans got us into a tail-spin. The manager's methods were sound - if a little ambitious trusting a lot of tat to play foobtall with proficiency.

Martinez missed the boat in the summer after his first season: he needed to ship a load of rubbish out and buy better in. He didn't/couldn't and the rest is history.

What the WC underlines 1000% is that his way of playing is a winning way of playing, and that the fault was at the club in terms of bog standard technicians and a fanbase that lost the plot.
Click to expand...
Probably his biggest error, amongst many, was thinking Tim Howard was still a premiership goalkeeper - did a lot of damage and pulling the trigger on him should have been made priority #1. Back four was all over the shop as it stood without throwing a dodgy keeper into the mix. Just haemorrhaged morale to lose goals to Howard failing to claim a cross or getting beat from distance.

Stood out a lot at the time because we had this potentially world class spine of Lukaku, Barkley, Stones and then Howard.
 

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