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2023/24 Nathan Patterson

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I could be wrong but playing Godfrey was more tactical than anything, up agains lt Robinson and then Werner and Udogie. He’s not a viable option as a RB.

The other two are getting closer to retirement by the day. He’s made 25 appearances, I think he steps in next year full time.
 
The lad has tools, I’ve explained them in detail in this thread. But I think if you’d played the game at a decent level, you can see his in game decision making and general systemic defending needs to be honed. Arguably you could put him where Branthwaite was before his loan.

The lad has never really had a run of games week in week out in games of jeopardy beyond being a back up option, he’s never had the opportunity to make a mistake @nd learn in application the next day out, he’s never had to be relied on really and he’s never had to teaching week to week over a run of games. He needs road minutes for me, were he can get the experience he needs beyond being a back up.

I said at the start of Jan that if he wasn’t starting most games for us, we need him out on loan, similar to Branthwaite that would evolve his game, I felt it was best for the lad but also the club, because we may need to go reaching for August and I’m not sure he’s ready to play 38 games and hang your hat on him.
It seems to me like very often people always think the way young players are being treated is the wrong way it doesn’t matter what it is. If they play all the time like Gordon and Davies did then we’re asking too much of them and putting them under too much pressure people will say we’re throwing them in. If they come in and out of the team like Patterson then they should be playing every week and we don’t trust them enough it’s never just that they aren’t playing well enough the club has to be doing something wrong.
 
It seems to me like very often people always think the way young players are being treated is the wrong way it doesn’t matter what it is. If they play all the time like Gordon and Davies did then we’re asking too much of them and putting them under too much pressure people will say we’re throwing them in. If they come in and out of the team like Patterson then they should be playing every week and we don’t trust them enough it’s never just that they aren’t playing well enough the club has to be doing something wrong.

Thus I suggested a middle ground a loan…..good for the lad, good for the club (you would hope).

Forget about popular opinion, it’s about making the right decision, the club has been run on popular opinion for too long.

The horse has bolted here, so no point banging the drum, I think he would and the club would have benefited from a loan - but obviously the club feel differently, so nothing to do but back the lad now.

He won’t ever go now he will succeed or be sold.
 
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Thus I suggested a middle ground a loan…..good for the lad, good for the club (you would hope).

Forget about popular opinion, it’s about making the right decision, the club has been run on popular opinion for too long.

The horse has bolted here, so no point banging the drum, I think he would and the club would have benefited from a loan - but obviously the club feel differently, so nothing to do but back the lad now.

He won’t ever go now he will succeed or be sold.
Oh ok I might have got the wrong idea I’m sorry. I also want to say though I don’t just mean whether people think they should play for Everton or not I mean the whole development thing in total so if somebody isn’t playing a lot people say he’ll never get better if he doesn’t play either loan him or play him but if they do play and don’t do well then they say we’ve thrown them in and people are expecting too much and they aren’t getting enough support. It’s just armchair experts I suppose.
 
Oh ok I might have got the wrong idea I’m sorry. I also want to say though I don’t just mean whether people think they should play for Everton or not I mean the whole development thing in total so if somebody isn’t playing a lot people say he’ll never get better if he doesn’t play either loan him or play him but if they do play and don’t do well then they say we’ve thrown them in and people are expecting too much and they aren’t getting enough support. It’s just armchair experts I suppose.

I get what you’re saying from a macro point of view - I was very critical of how we treated Gordon, i.e. put to much responsibility on him for his developmental needs.

But it more about individual profile, Gordon needed support, not responsibility, he got that at Newcastle and is thriving. That was his developmental need.

Patterson, individually I feel, has ability and tools that if honed and applied, should see him as a very good PL player. Yet there are deficiencies in the nuts and bolts of his game, decision making and systemic defending - I think that only improves with constant repetition in match expierence in a game with jeopardy.

His best run in my opinion was under Lampard at the start of last season, until injury, I saw him grow, game on game - I feel he needs that now he needs that run of games p, he needs the experience, he’s never had it in his career and I fear without it he will just stagnate.

That said, if Dyche is good at anything it’s producing defenders - so hopefully my shout on a loan is wrong! ;)

Overall though, while I take on board your point on development - I do feel you may be generalising from a macro point of view a bit, I think lads developing have different needs and that’s ok, Gordon needed support and less responsibility to develop, Patterson needs more games and experience in my opinion - I think lads can have different needs and they can be judged on individual profile rather then just applying generally. ;)
 

I get what you’re saying from a macro point of view - I was very critical of how we treated Gordon, i.e. put to much responsibility on him for his developmental needs.

But it more about individual profile, Gordon needed support, not responsibility, he got that at Newcastle and is thriving. That was his developmental need.

Patterson, individually I feel, has ability and tools that if honed and applied, should see him as a very good PL player. Yet there are deficiencies in the nuts and bolts of his game, decision making and systemic defending - I think that only improves with constant repetition in match expierence in a game with jeopardy.

His best run in my opinion was under Lampard at the start of last season, until injury, I saw him grow, game on game - I feel he needs that now he needs that run of games p, he needs the experience, he’s never had it in his career and I fear without it he will just stagnate.

That said, if Dyche is good at anything it’s producing defenders - so hopefully my shout on a loan is wrong! ;)

Overall though, while I take on board your point on development - I do feel you may be generalising from a macro point of view a bit, I think lads developing have different needs and that’s ok, Gordon needed support and less responsibility to develop, Patterson needs more games and experience in my opinion - I think lads can have different needs and they can be judged on individual profile rather then just applying generally. ;)
I would think we can only talk from a macro view myself I wouldn’t be so bold as to pretend I had any idea what the best way to develop an individual player I’ve never met would be!
 
I would think we can only talk from a macro view myself I wouldn’t be so bold as to pretend I had any idea what the best way to develop an individual player I’ve never met would be!

We can though look at available evidence on player’s thriving with different individual developmental profiles:

With the playing support and unburdening of responsibility Gordon has turned into one of the the most productive midfielders in the league.

Equally we can say with confidence that 18 months ago Branthwaite needed to go and play games to hone his ability with decision making and experience.

Both players had their individual but contrasting developmental needs met and are thriving individually.

Which is were we land on young Nathan and in what best to get him ti where we want him, where Branthwaite and Gordon are the individual stepping stones of pathway to achieve and support him.
 
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Little confusing whethet they wanted to buy, loan or put him through a training period :o

They must see a bargain.

He's currently behind Godfrey, Young and Coleman in the pecking order. If we're sticking with Dyche i'd have no worries in letting him go if we got our money back.

How much has he really developed in 2 years?

We dont know whats happening behind the scenes. What hes being trained on & also hes had some great games then been dropped or picked up injuries.

Young & Coleman will go in the summer. Then we have Godfrey on a one year deal + Patterson.

It seems to me like very often people always think the way young players are being treated is the wrong way it doesn’t matter what it is. If they play all the time like Gordon and Davies did then we’re asking too much of them and putting them under too much pressure people will say we’re throwing them in. If they come in and out of the team like Patterson then they should be playing every week and we don’t trust them enough it’s never just that they aren’t playing well enough the club has to be doing something wrong.

If a player has a good game they shouldnt be dropped.
 

And claiming after 1000 posts that contradict it that you “like the lad”
"Effing hate him and hope he breaks his legs just cuz he's from the blue team in Glasgow and from Scotland not Ireland, the useless little knobgoblin. Unworthy of kicking a ball despite having quite a few good games now and please give us more pensioners and I insist he should be 1523th choice behind the canteen lady.

Like the lad though."
 

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