New Stadium- How to size it?

[gorgeousgeorgeEFC]

Not sure where you got the figures from for Arsenal at Highbury as they were pretty much sold out every home game for the last ten years before the move.

The official capacity was 38.5k and from 1996-2006 there average was between 37550 - 38150.

It's also been widely reported that in recent seasons the attendance listed (at the Emirates) was given as 60k whereas in reality only 52-57k attended (police figures).

I broadly agree in what you wish for Everton to have but I just think that using Arsenal is probably a bad example.

In four of those ten years, Arsenal's average attendance was over 37,000 but well under 38,000, despite the fact that Highbury held 38,500 people. And Arsenal never finished outside of the top 4 during those four years, so it's not as if fans were staying away in protest at their team under-performing.

Today, Arsenal's average attendance is over 60,000, unless your conspiracy theory is correct. Personally, I very much doubt that Arsenal are regularly falsifying their attendance records. The Emirates has always seemed packed to the rafters whenever I've been there.

 

[gorgeousgeorgeEFC]

Would we fill 60,000? Genuinely would we be able to fill that number? Even 15k more fans a week? Especially when things are not going too well for us, and we aren't selling the place out?

Nothing worse than not having enough fans in the ground, we can't even sell all our season tickets every summer, so where would the extra 20k fans come from?

At the moment we're getting capacity crowds almost every week, despite the fact that a quarter of the seats at Goodison (according to the club) have an obstructed view. Just imagine how any Blues would be attracted to a state-of-the-art stadium on the docks.

West Ham's average attendance has just shot up by almost 25,000 after their move to a new stadium.

Besides mate, having a couple of thousand empty seats every now and then would hardly be the end of the world.

 

[Trueblue1878]

In four of those ten years, Arsenal's average attendance was over 37,000 but well under 38,000, despite the fact that Highbury held 38,500 people. And Arsenal never finished outside of the top 4 during those four years, so it's not as if fans were staying away in protest at their team under-performing.

Today, Arsenal's average attendance is over 60,000, unless your conspiracy theory is correct. Personally, I very much doubt that Arsenal are regularly falsifying their attendance records. The Emirates has always seemed packed to the rafters whenever I've been there.

Like I said I agreed with you that we should be looking at 60k + however it's widely known and acknowledged that arsenal quote tickets sold as opposed to actual attendees (attendance).

In fact one of there own even went so far as to go to the Met for a FOI on actual attendees at the Emirates
http://aisforarsenal.blogspot.no/2014/08/arsenals-actual-average-attendance-last.html?m=1

I personally don't feel the need to get hung up on every game being more or less sold out in a bigger stadium. Barcelona and Real cope quite well and seldom sell out.

 

[Furey1878]

1000000 seater super dome with its own gravitational pull please, Moshiri.

 

[Callum_efc]

It's all been said before but we sold roughly 38500 home tickets for a Friday night game this year against a crap team like palace as they only took 1 tier.

If you presume that the new stadium would see an increase in corporate seats say 4k that takes us to 42500, add in the full away allocation that takes us 44000 without selling a single extra general admission seat.

Even with the obstructed views and the poor facilities I'd be pretty confident of selling an extra 6k seats this season the way we are going. We are selling out televised games at crap times weeks in advance. That's before you take in the obvious attendance boost that new stadiums always get.

I'm not saying your wrong. Your putting facts out there but i honestly can't see it. I obviously hope that we fill more than 50k but that little thing in the back of my head says it won't be the case.

 

[gorgeousgeorgeEFC]

I'm not saying your wrong. Your putting facts out there but i honestly can't see it. I obviously hope that we fill more than 50k but that little thing in the back of my head says it won't be the case.

Pessimism. Comes with the territory of being a blue.

 

[Callum_efc]

you're *** damn.

 

[RusDub]

I think the club has done a fair job in growing the number of young fans attending games. It's fair to assume that they (and more like them) will support us in a state of the art stadium. Many more fans will come where they can enjoy great views and a better match day experience - better F&B, pre match entertainment, ease of access, good transport links and parking. Corporate hospitality will help grow those numbers further, and especially the coffers. Liverpool is a big commercial city, the premier league is a great product and I have no doubt we can raise significant corporate revenues - which helps pay for the stadium and is a very welcome addition to what we currently offer.

Whilst the article speaks at some length about historical attendance figures, I don't think they are very relevant. The premier league and match day experience now is very different to when I grew up in the 80s. We are selling a record number of season tickets and our 5 home matches this season have been sold out (and mostly against average teams too).

I know we have an emotional attachment to Goodison Park, but it really isn't a great stadium. I've been to stadia like Wembley, Emirates, Sunderland and abroad at Milan, Barcelona, Borussia Dortmund and Bayern Munich and they put our effort to shame.

Coming to size, the point of this discussion. With a new stadium we should easily be able to sell 50,000 season tickets (we have 35k currently, plus 4k corporate and 11k new season tickets) and (after allowing for 5000 away fans) with a 60,000 stadium that will still give us 5,000 seats for occasional ticket purchases.

I also want to give a shout out to those suggesting a safe standing area - we could have our own 'Blue Wall' on the New Gwladys Street end...

 

[Trueblue1878]

I think the club has done a fair job in growing the number of young fans attending games. It's fair to assume that they (and more like them) will support us in a state of the art stadium. Many more fans will come where they can enjoy great views and a better match day experience - better F&B, pre match entertainment, ease of access, good transport links and parking. Corporate hospitality will help grow those numbers further, and especially the coffers. Liverpool is a big commercial city, the premier league is a great product and I have no doubt we can raise significant corporate revenues - which helps pay for the stadium and is a very welcome addition to what we currently offer.

Whilst the article speaks at some length about historical attendance figures, I don't think they are very relevant. The premier league and match day experience now is very different to when I grew up in the 80s. We are selling a record number of season tickets and our 5 home matches this season have been sold out (and mostly against average teams too).

I know we have an emotional attachment to Goodison Park, but it really isn't a great stadium. I've been to stadia like Wembley, Emirates, Sunderland and abroad at Milan, Barcelona, Borussia Dortmund and Bayern Munich and they put our effort to shame.

Coming to size, the point of this discussion. With a new stadium we should easily be able to sell 50,000 season tickets (we have 35k currently, plus 4k corporate and 11k new season tickets) and (after allowing for 5000 away fans) with a 60,000 stadium that will still give us 5,000 seats for occasional ticket purchases.

I also want to give a shout out to those suggesting a safe standing area - we could have our own 'Blue Wall' on the New Gwladys Street end...

I think it's fair to say the away allocation for Premier league games will be 3k

The ruling for the allocation of away tickets in the Premier League is as follows: "3,000 tickets or, if the capacity of the home club's stadium is less than 30,000, such number of tickets as is equal to 10 per cent."

 

[gorgeousgeorgeEFC]

I think the club has done a fair job in growing the number of young fans attending games. It's fair to assume that they (and more like them) will support us in a state of the art stadium. Many more fans will come where they can enjoy great views and a better match day experience - better F&B, pre match entertainment, ease of access, good transport links and parking. Corporate hospitality will help grow those numbers further, and especially the coffers. Liverpool is a big commercial city, the premier league is a great product and I have no doubt we can raise significant corporate revenues - which helps pay for the stadium and is a very welcome addition to what we currently offer.

Whilst the article speaks at some length about historical attendance figures, I don't think they are very relevant. The premier league and match day experience now is very different to when I grew up in the 80s. We are selling a record number of season tickets and our 5 home matches this season have been sold out (and mostly against average teams too).

I know we have an emotional attachment to Goodison Park, but it really isn't a great stadium. I've been to stadia like Wembley, Emirates, Sunderland and abroad at Milan, Barcelona, Borussia Dortmund and Bayern Munich and they put our effort to shame.

Coming to size, the point of this discussion. With a new stadium we should easily be able to sell 50,000 season tickets (we have 35k currently, plus 4k corporate and 11k new season tickets) and (after allowing for 5000 away fans) with a 60,000 stadium that will still give us 5,000 seats for occasional ticket purchases.

I also want to give a shout out to those suggesting a safe standing area - we could have our own 'Blue Wall' on the New Gwladys Street end...

Bang on.

 

[gorgeousgeorgeEFC]

I think the club has done a fair job in growing the number of young fans attending games. It's fair to assume that they (and more like them) will support us in a state of the art stadium. Many more fans will come where they can enjoy great views and a better match day experience - better F&B, pre match entertainment, ease of access, good transport links and parking. Corporate hospitality will help grow those numbers further, and especially the coffers. Liverpool is a big commercial city, the premier league is a great product and I have no doubt we can raise significant corporate revenues - which helps pay for the stadium and is a very welcome addition to what we currently offer.

Whilst the article speaks at some length about historical attendance figures, I don't think they are very relevant. The premier league and match day experience now is very different to when I grew up in the 80s. We are selling a record number of season tickets and our 5 home matches this season have been sold out (and mostly against average teams too).

I know we have an emotional attachment to Goodison Park, but it really isn't a great stadium. I've been to stadia like Wembley, Emirates, Sunderland and abroad at Milan, Barcelona, Borussia Dortmund and Bayern Munich and they put our effort to shame.

Coming to size, the point of this discussion. With a new stadium we should easily be able to sell 50,000 season tickets (we have 35k currently, plus 4k corporate and 11k new season tickets) and (after allowing for 5000 away fans) with a 60,000 stadium that will still give us 5,000 seats for occasional ticket purchases.

I also want to give a shout out to those suggesting a safe standing area - we could have our own 'Blue Wall' on the New Gwladys Street end...

You've just smashed it out of the park.

 

[EFC78]

You've just smashed it out of the park.

lol You enjoyed that post didn't you!

It's becoming apparent that the club is as popular as ever among the fans given our ticket sales for both home and away games. We used to sell out a few home games a season, i.e the derby and Man United, even during seasons of finishing 5th and 6th under Moyes.

We haven't won anything for 21 years and the fanbase (especially on here) seem to be growing increasingly more frustrated with our failure on the pitch, and yet ticket sales are as good as they've ever been in the Premier League era.

Claims by some that we wouldn't sell out 50,000+ is massively underestimating our support in my opinion.

 

[DerbyshireAndHarper]

60000 minimum. Can't be any less than West Ham.

Don't give me the London argument either, because there's 18 million clubs in London and West Ham are a nothing club.

 

[EFC78]

60000 minimum. Can't be any less than West Ham.

Don't give me the London argument either, because there's 18 million clubs in London and West Ham are a nothing club.

You only have to look at both clubs away support to see the difference in support. The other season, we played them in the cup when they were 7th in the league, and they struggled to bring 1,000 to Goodison midweek. We had 6 days notice for a replay and sold over 3,000 for the return game whilst we were sat in 13th and just had that run of 4 straight defeats over the Christmas period.

Last season we had another awful campaign and sold out nearly every away and they started selling out most places cause they finally had a decent season so got very deluded about their status in the game. Now they're back to normal and doing poorly and they are struggling to sell 3,000 tickets for Old Trafford on Sunday, same kick off time as us going to Southampton where we have sold 3,300 and we're on TV and they aren't.

Before this season, the best average attendance they'd ever had was just under 35,000, so even when there was standing and much bigger stadiums they never averaged above that, whereas our best is 51,000+ and we've averaged over 35,000 loads of times. I was having a read of their forum the other day (KUMB) and some were saying that they think some of these "season ticket holders" are just cheap £99 tickets where a lot of people don't even bother turning up to some games anyway. And there was also this from the Met Police when they played Middlesbrough earlier on:

"The Met said more than 40,000 people had attended Saturday's match against Middlesbrough, and the "vast majority" had been good natured."

So it's debatable as to whether they even have been getting the 50,000+ crowds for some games that the club is declaring. If a club like West Ham can get the crowds they're now getting at the Olympic Stadium then we can certainly do better with the right Stadium design and pricing.

 

[Kaiser Soysauce]

An interesting article here on our front page from @catcherintherye - have a read and let us know what you reckon.

https://www.grandoldteam.com/2016/10/26/fan-view-new-stadium-size/