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"Review the manager in December..."

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Still hasn't learnt from his mistakes, but these mistakes aren't just recent, these go back to his Wigan days, sort it out Bobby or you'll be gone.
 
timmyistop said:
Absolutely right. I think people need to calm down a bit. It is obvious that he is building a young attacking team. Give him a bit of time. I think the messaging will be very different internally and externally. Additionally you have to think that he knows he needs a new keeper, he just hasn't had the resources to do everything in one go. He has had to prioritise. Should we have skipped buying Rom and bought a keeper, everyone would be saying now, what have we one up front and can't score more than one goal a game. Don't be surprised if he brings in a keeper in January, or almost certainly in the summer. Lastly I think all the young talented players are bought into his plan and even if things don't go great this year , they will be patient, they all have contracts. We have no need to sell unless it's on our terms.
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Most important point of all, so the manager's critics should avoid trying to cut off their noses to spite their face.
 
VentureBrosEFC said:
Yes but don't forget that you mean nearly 3 seasons on from that point and I think you'd be hard pressed to find anyone that agrees they are at that same level. To me Coleman's best season was Martinez's first so does he get the credit for that (I don't know who to credit for that)? I'm all for a frank assessment of what is happening but to me saying none of it is the players fault is as foolish as saying none of it is Martinez's fault.
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Baines may have declined slightly due to age but Coleman has gone from the league's best right back to looking like a pub player. That's not due to age. They are not at the same level because of our defensive structure.
 

Saint Domingo said:
Baines may have declined slightly due to age but Coleman has gone from the league's best right back to looking like a pub player. That's not due to age. They are not at the same level because of our defensive structure.
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How are you making that judgement? To me they both are far below what they were, not slightly declined. I'm not sure what our defensive structure has to do with the appalling final balls Coleman has been putting in of late. I think it's interesting that you've completely ruled out form as any metric of ability and are putting it down to Martinez solely. Not sure your situation but to put literally every deficiency down to Martinez makes me feel as though you never wanted him here. It's also interesting that you don't address the fact that Martinez oversaw Coleman's best season here.
 
VentureBrosEFC said:
How are you making that judgement? To me they both are far below what they were, not slightly declined. I'm not sure what our defensive structure has to do with the appalling final balls Coleman has been putting in of late. I think it's interesting that you've completely ruled out form as any metric of ability and are putting it down to Martinez solely. Not sure your situation but to put literally every deficiency down to Martinez makes me feel as though you never wanted him here. It's also interesting that you don't address the fact that Martinez oversaw Coleman's best season here.
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Ha ha comedy gold. Turning a discussion about Coleman into attributing views to me I've never held. This is a new low. Find me the post where I said I didn't want Martinez when he arrived? Coleman had a good first season under Martinez but like his defensive counterparts declined massively since. So are Stones, Coleman and Baines bad players or is it the system? Since when is the manager not responsible for form? I'll say it again. When people stop looking for excuses and start holding the manager accountable for what happens on the pitch we might actually improve.
 

Saint Domingo said:
Ha ha comedy gold. Turning a discussion about Coleman into attributing views to me I've never held. This is a new low. Find me the post where I said I didn't want Martinez when he arrived? Coleman had a good first season under Martinez but like his defensive counterparts declined massively since. So are Stones, Coleman and Baines bad players or is it the system? Since when is the manager not responsible for form? I'll say it again. When people stop looking for excuses and start holding the manager accountable for what happens on the pitch we might actually improve.
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Classic deflection. It's also going to help your arguments if you stop framing them as "either the players are crap or the manager is". To address your first point I made multiple allowances for that not actually being your view but what your words sounded like as you refuse to even acknowledge there being other factors to the equation than how you've set it up so it'd be nice if your undue indignation would cease. "A new low" jesus christ you can smell the insecurities. Again form is a bit of a nebulous word so I'll use specifics like, how is Coleman's inability to find a blue shirt with a cross Martinez's fault? If you can explain that I'll concede the point but since you won't be able to please tone down your defense.
 

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