2018/19 Richarlison

[davek]

....I recall you being very critical of him for bringing in Gomes and Mina because they were carrying injuries. Regardless, this is the Richarlison thread.

..and I was right. Generally speaking it's the wrong thing to do to bring in players who aren't good to go. We as a rule cant afford to have players starting the season 6-8 weeks or more into it. It's paid off with Gomes especially, sure.

 

[catcherintherye]

I went for a long bike ride and all I could think of was punching Pickford daft...or dafter than he already is...if that's possible.

You stopped your ride too early.

 

[davek]

He’s barely walked through the door - where’s the patience?

They are initial observations. I think it's legitimate caution given the spectacular elevation of him to cult status by others, dont you?

 

[Parker]

Would he?

That lad Wilson at Bournemouth is better than what we have and would be.

To argue there's no suitable players in world football for us is ridiculous, and I think you know it.

Both King and Wilson are better than our current strikers.

Would Wilson be the striker we need to take us to the next level? He has 27 goals in 76 games in the Premier League. Of course he's had his fair share of injury troubles, he's fine but he would get nowhere near any of the teams above us imo. Of course your opinion can differ, and most likely will.

To bring it back to my original point, I said suitable quality AVAILABLE. The talents there, Brands will not want to overpay for it. It's got to strike the right balance between fee and quality. I have full confidence, given the quality of the signings we have already made, that Brands will deliver us a striker. Have a little faith Dave mate.

 

[Nymzee]

They are initial observations. I think it's legitimate caution given the spectacular elevation of him to cult status by others, dont you?

I think people are just happy to see us have the makings of a plan for the first time in years.

 

[davek]

Both King and Wilson are better than our current strikers.

Would Wilson be the striker we need to take us to the next level? He has 27 goals in 76 games in the Premier League. Of course he's had his fair share of injury troubles, he's fine but he would get nowhere near any of the teams above us imo. Of course your opinion can differ, and most likely will.

To bring it back to my original point, I said suitable quality AVAILABLE. The talents there, Brands will not want to overpay for it. It's got to strike the right balance between fee and quality. I have full confidence, given the quality of the signings we have already made, that Brands will deliver us a striker. Have a little faith Dave mate.

Suitable and available. Again I say: do you really think there isn't such players in volume from the whole of world football we as one of the top PL clubs are capable of landing?

 

[Parker]

Suitable and available. Again I say: do you really think there isn't such players in volume from the whole of world football we as one of the top PL clubs are capable of landing?

There are only a select few players good enough to play at the highest level. Most of them are already snapped up by the big clubs. Who would you have gone for out of curiosity?

I suppose its about how ambitious we want to be as a club, I think Wilson would cost stupid amounts of money for a player who is not good enough imo to trouble the top 6. Its either gonna be a gamble on a young up and coming player, like a Piatek or Wesley, or its gonna be a top player who hasn't had the best time at a mega club. We aren't big enough yet to go for the best of the best. So it's tricky, I'd rather not rush into it personally and wait for an opportunity to present itself.

 

[BlueToff]

I'm not arguing that. I'm arguing the other side of his job is neglected / not in his locker: selling players for value.

There's zero evidence he hasn't got that in his locker though?

We got £15m for Klaassen. I liked Davy, but after the disastrous season last year could we expect more? We have got loan fees for other players, one of which (Besic) would have been a permanent transfer for more than we paid for him initially if not for image rights?

We got £10m for Funes Mori.

Other than that we haven't had any players to sell/that we've needed to sell?

So you must be getting your theory from his days at PSV, well let's see. All prices are Euros.

In his first season, 2010-11 PSV sold two players who were in the last year of their contracts. That was Carlos Salcido (aged 30, a defender) for 1.6m to Fulham and Ibrahim Afellay (24) for 2m to Barcelona (Afellay had 6 months left on his deal at the time).

2011/12, they signed Strootman and Mertens for a combined fee of 13m, and Wijnaldum for 5m. Those purchases were offset by the 15m sale of Balasz Dzsudzsak and 3m sale of Francisco Rodriguez.

2012/13 a lot of free transfers both in and out.

In 2013/14, there was a big squad turnaround. A combined 11m was spent on six players, including Adam Maher (a prestigious young talent), Bruma (who has been a stalwart there IIRC), Zoet (current no.1 and Netherlands international) and Santiago Arias (now at Atletico Madrid).

They sold Mertens for 9.5m, having signed him for approx 6m in the deal with Strootman, who in turn went for 19m (6m more than the COMBINED fee paid for him and Mertens). So, 28.5m compared to 13m layout - I'd say that's good value.

They also got 4m for Erik Pieters, 3.5m for Ola Toivonen, and 10m for Jeremain Lens.

Memphis Depay was the next big sale, 30m to Manchester United in 2014. Not good value? They also sold Andreas Pereira to United, while bringing in Luuk de Jong (6m), and Andres Guardado (loan).

2015/16 - Wijnaldum sold for 17m having signed for 5m.

2016/17 - Sold Narsingh for 6m, having initially signed on a free.

2017/18 - Sold Guardado after he had helped them move back to the top in Netherlands, supposed fee of 2.5m for a 32-yr-old. Jetro Willems went for 7m. Locadia went to Brighton for 16m. Davy Propper went for 6m. Hector Moreno went for 8m.

 

[Yorkie89]

There's zero evidence he hasn't got that in his locker though?

We got £15m for Klaassen. I liked Davy, but after the disastrous season last year could we expect more? We have got loan fees for other players, one of which (Besic) would have been a permanent transfer for more than we paid for him initially if not for image rights?

We got £10m for Funes Mori.

Other than that we haven't had any players to sell/that we've needed to sell?

So you must be getting your theory from his days at PSV, well let's see. All prices are Euros.

In his first season, 2010-11 PSV sold two players who were in the last year of their contracts. That was Carlos Salcido (aged 30, a defender) for 1.6m to Fulham and Ibrahim Afellay (24) for 2m to Barcelona (Afellay had 6 months left on his deal at the time).

2011/12, they signed Strootman and Mertens for a combined fee of 13m, and Wijnaldum for 5m. Those purchases were offset by the 15m sale of Balasz Dzsudzsak and 3m sale of Francisco Rodriguez.

2012/13 a lot of free transfers both in and out.

In 2013/14, there was a big squad turnaround. A combined 11m was spent on six players, including Adam Maher (a prestigious young talent), Bruma (who has been a stalwart there IIRC), Zoet (current no.1 and Netherlands international) and Santiago Arias (now at Atletico Madrid).

They sold Mertens for 9.5m, having signed him for approx 6m in the deal with Strootman, who in turn went for 19m (6m more than the COMBINED fee paid for him and Mertens). So, 28.5m compared to 13m layout - I'd say that's good value.

They also got 4m for Erik Pieters, 3.5m for Ola Toivonen, and 10m for Jeremain Lens.

Memphis Depay was the next big sale, 30m to Manchester United in 2014. Not good value? They also sold Andreas Pereira to United, while bringing in Luuk de Jong (6m), and Andres Guardado (loan).

2015/16 - Wijnaldum sold for 17m having signed for 5m.

2016/17 - Sold Narsingh for 6m, having initially signed on a free.

2017/18 - Sold Guardado after he had helped them move back to the top in Netherlands, supposed fee of 2.5m for a 32-yr-old. Jetro Willems went for 7m. Locadia went to Brighton for 16m. Davy Propper went for 6m. Hector Moreno went for 8m.

All you forgot was the mic drop. Sounds like a very good businessman if you ask me

 

[Abraders]

Spot on he is better playing off a striker be that DCL or Tosun for the time being until we find someone. I don't think Tosun is as bad as some make out he is a decent finisher he just doesn't fit our system but he can do some of the facets we need hold up the ball and take chances but lacks the pace, DCL has pace but is still raw and not reliable in front of goal. So I would rotate Tosun and DCL especially in home games until we can get a better.

I agree. Smash these tonight with one of them upfront.

 

[BlueToff]

All you forgot was the mic drop. Sounds like a very good businessman if you ask me

It beggars belief.

Bare in mind that I haven't counted players who left in 2018 either (such as Arias), and Lozano (signed for relative pittance) will probably fetch £40million when he is sold.

 

[evertonarntwe]

..and I was right. Generally speaking it's the wrong thing to do to bring in players who aren't good to go. We as a rule cant afford to have players starting the season 6-8 weeks or more into it. It's paid off with Gomes especially, sure.

you wasn't right though was you, whether or not gomes was injured at the start or not he's transformed our team, him being in the middle is one of the main reasons we've went on a boss run

say if brands/silva thought like you and went ok he's injured we'll leave it for now, we'd be playing davies or morgan every week next to gana and we would be struggling massively in the middle

same with mina, he's come in and basically kept 3 clean sheets in 3 games ( away at the bridge and anfield ) so he's done a great job so far ( I know we conceded on sunday but we all know why )

it's ok to be wrong mate x

 

[Parker]

you wasn't right though was you, whether or not gomes was injured at the start or not he's transformed our team, him being in the middle is one of the main reasons we've went on a boss run

say if brands/silva thought like you and went ok he's injured we'll leave it for now, we'd be playing davies or morgan every week next to gana and we would be struggling massively in the middle

same with mina, he's come in and basically kept 3 clean sheets in 3 games ( away at the bridge and anfield ) so he's done a great job so far ( I know we conceded on sunday but we all know why )

it's ok to be wrong mate x

Don't get him started on that in this thread as well

 

[Yorkie89]

It beggars belief.

Bare in mind that I haven't counted players who left in 2018 either (such as Arias), and Lozano (signed for relative pittance) will probably fetch £40million when he is sold.

That my friend is how to put someone firmly in their place

 

[Tel001]

Which was the failure of his summer performance as a DoF. The easy part is buying players. The hard part is selling them.

The number of loans out was something I highlighted a lot of times as a deferral of a problem that will only get worse as unwanted players' value depreciate. No one wanted to hear that, as the Cult of Brands was in full swing.

Failed? Is the team stronger? Massive yes! Did he get his first choice targets? Yes I reckon , did he get good value for money on his signings? Massive yes! He got rid of a lot of players , you really think he’s going to oversea about 20 transfers in a single window? Also Morgan was in the team at the start as gomes wasn’t ready, he addressed your most hated player in baines and signed a cheap , quality replacement. He managed to get bolasies wages off the books , and all the players you mentioned... how can you sell them if they won’t take a wage drop , nobody wants to pay their wages, and nobody actually bids? Literally every single incoming player has been good in terms of quality and price , he also got players that we wouldn’t have had a hope in hell of attracting normally. This tells me he is a very good negotiator and using that assumption I can conclude that if loaning bolasie , not managing to sell mirallas , Morgan etc happened... it’s because it wasn’t possible . He’s been excellent since his arrival imo and you have been having pops at him since the beggining, saying he talks to much etc our defence needed completely changing and he signed 3 players to do that, he got us balance on the wings allowing us to okay our record signing in his correct position and assessed the Cm by loaning gomes. He’s worked a minor miracle so far imo.