Roberto Martinez Discussion - Including Live Poll (Poll Reset 1st May)

Martinez in or out?

  • In

  • Out

  • Getting splinters eating cheese on toast on the fence

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The Esk said:
I think you are correct, he'll still be here in 12 months, however the question might be in what role? Anyone who has been successful in emerging markets, like Mr Moshiri, is both a pragmatist and a realist. Clearly Martinez has many talents but he also has inherent weaknesses. It would not surprise me if Martinez becomes "head coach" with an additional coaching team alongside, specifically a defence coach,.
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That would make no difference at all as long as Martinez is in charge of in game calls.

And at this point it's a fair enough assumption that he'll never be up to the job of managing us effectively mid-game on a consistent basis.

It all comes down to the end of the season. If we finish bottom half, I think he's definitely gone, but depending on just how abject we are, he could be gone with a 9th/10th place finish too. Moshiri won't want to come in and change managers, because he'll be afraid of being seen as interfering, but a few more results like that and fan pressure will make the choice easy for him.

One thing is for sure - anyone defending him at this point are doing so for very little reason, if any at all beyond just not wanting to admit Martinez isn't the manager they hoped for after Moyes.
 
davek said:
Behave. They are all Moyes' signings barring Funes Mori. There's no qualification that can be made on that. Robles was not the problem today either. There's no steel or fight to that backline when they get pulled back in a match. Hopefully he's sorting a couple of defenders and a GK this summer.
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He's had six transfer windows.
 
The Esk said:
I think you are correct, he'll still be here in 12 months, however the question might be in what role? Anyone who has been successful in emerging markets, like Mr Moshiri, is both a pragmatist and a realist. Clearly Martinez has many talents but he also has inherent weaknesses. It would not surprise me if Martinez becomes "head coach" with an additional coaching team alongside, specifically a defence coach,.
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Never going to happen mate. He turned down Liverpool because he wanted full control. How could he possibly wear a demotion of that nature? It's not like he's an old warhorse being eased into retirement.

We have the same reactions on here after every collapse of this nature. Then it stops. It cant be taken seriously.

Martinez needs to buy some players of good character. It's clear that most we have don't have the stomach for a battle.

It's not a managerial issue, it's a playing staff issue...and more specifically finding leaders for a very good footballing outfit.
 
davek said:
Behave. They are all Moyes' signings barring Funes Mori. There's no qualification that can be made on that. Robles was not the problem today either. There's no steel or fight to that backline when they get pulled back in a match. Hopefully he's sorting a couple of defenders and a GK this summer.
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Do I need to vault you on your fullsome praise of Oviedo, remind you that Martinez wanted to sign Stones and signed Robles, or should I just shake my head and say "Oh David" ?
 

davek said:
Yes, and I think we can all agree he's bought very well. Now in the 7th he has to get a GK and a leader to marshal that defence.
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No, sorry mate, you can't say "there's no steel or fight in that backline" and then dismiss that the manager has six transfer windows to address that if it's a problem. If it IS a problem (which I'm actually not of the opinion it is), then obviously the manager has failed to construct a defence that works in three years and six transfer windows at the club.
 
Woolly Blue said:
Do I need to vault you on your fullsome praise of Oviedo, remind you that Martinez wanted to sign Stones and signed Robles, or should I just shake my head and say "Oh David" ?
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Oviedo is a solid LB and worth his place in the team. I stand by that. My point is that we have a largely inherited backline and the only one with any heart is the one he bought last summer.

The captain situation is a major problem. I identified it as such over a year ago and it was marginalised in importance. Well I think we can see after the collapses of this season that it is a massively important issue and needs to be addressed this summer. Jagielka needs stripping of the armband and that defence reconfigured.
 
davek said:
It's not a managerial issue, it's a playing staff issue...and more specifically finding leaders for a very good footballing outfit.
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It has to be both surely?

Yes we need more leadership on the pitch but the way we lose shape towards end of games, defend deeper, and fail to stop crosses coming in must be due to a lack of preparation, fitness and tactical awareness? All areas that the manager must take responsibility for.

For me, if Martinez wants to continue to be part of the Everton project (my words, no-one else's) then he has to accept that he alone can not get us to where we want to be, and most important where our new owner (as he will become) wants us to be.

I'd love Martinez to be part of our success, he's got so many positive attributes, but he needs others around him to fulfil his and our dreams.
 
davek said:
Oviedo is a solid LB and worth his place in the team. I stand by that. My point is that we have a largely inherited backline and the only one with any heart is the one he bought last summer.

The captain situation is a major problem. I identified it as such over a year ago and it was marginalised in importance. Well I think we can see after the collapses of this season that it is a massively important issue and needs to be addressed this summer. Jagielka needs stripping of the armband and that defence reconfigured.
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Did a little bit of wee come out when you saw Stones lining up in midfield?

I thought about you then.
 

The Esk said:
It has to be both surely?

Yes we need more leadership on the pitch but the way we lose shape towards end of games, defend deeper, and fail to stop crosses coming in must be due to a lack of preparation, fitness and tactical awareness? All areas that the manager must take responsibility for.

For me, if Martinez wants to continue to be part of the Everton project (my words, no-one else's) then he has to accept that he alone can not get us to where we want to be, and most important where our new owner (as he will become) wants us to be.

I'd love Martinez to be part of our success, he's got so many positive attributes, but he needs others around him to fulfil his and our dreams.
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But look, where were these arguments over the past 13 games or so before today when we conceded just 8 or 9 times? They were nowhere to be found. We don't have a defensive set up problem so much as we have a failure to remain composed in tight situations. It's all about being professional. We went all game and with 10 men until the last 10 minutes defending pretty well. Then we concede a daft one and the roof falls in, as it has on a few occasions. It's not about defensive skills or setting them up, it's about focus, concentration and spirit to see out games in their closing minutes.

Let's not miss the blindingly obvious here just because we lost in a stupid manner.
 

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