Roberto Martinez Discussion - Including Live Poll (Poll Reset 1st May)

[AJC5]

That's quite a leap of faith to putting us in a relegation dogfight. Especially putting a guilt trip on us potentially winning a cup.

I don't think so. I'm not confident we'll be able to replace Lukaku if he leaves and our form has been shocking for two years with no signs of improvement. If Niasse is our first choice striker next season I would be very worried indeed.

 

[chicoazul]

I don't think so. I'm not confident we'll be able to replace Lukaku if he leaves and our form has been shocking for two years with no signs of improvement. If Niasse is our first choice striker next season I would be very worried indeed.

A couple of points to consider:

• Money will be invested into the team this summer for the first time in a while
• It's highly likely if Lukaku does leave the that significant money generated will be used to replace him
• Because of the above there is very little chance Niasse will be our only option up front next season
• Because of all of the above there's little chance we will be in a relegation battle

 

[AJC5]

This is what I don't get about the whole Martinez conundrum. I can understand the depth of feeling on both sides but why are people so adamantly pushing for him to be sacked now. Why not wait till the summer. Considering we have a massive game coming up, wouldn't it be a bit more reasonable to say, you know what, fair play to him, he's got us this far. Let's see what happens. Ya know like, we might actually win something here. Is that so over the top?

Davek is actually responsible for most of the hysteria. If he just let people vent they would forget about it. The fact he refuses to acknowledge reality and is winding people up means their is an open wound which must be constantly picked at.

 

[AJC5]

A couple of points to consider:

• Money will be invested into the team this summer for the first time in a while
• It's highly likely if Lukaku does leave the that significant money generated will be used to replace him
• Because of the above there is very little chance Niasse will be our only option up front next season
• Because of all of the above there's little chance we will be in a relegation battle

Quite a few teams have spent lots of money and not really improved, Newcastle being the prime example.

I'm not as confident in Martinez ability to spend that money in a coherent way that improves us as everyone else. He hasn't really pulled any rabbits out of the hat on the signings front. Moyes beats him hands down in this regard IMHO.

He's basically signed known quantities that he's managed before or proven premier league players like Lennon and Barry.

The worrying thing is is that for the first time in 25 years our problems aren't solvable by signing better players. We already have good players. The issue is with the managers mentality which isn't going to change. That mentality minus Lukaku equals big trouble.

 

[chicoazul]

Quite a few teams have spent lots of money and not really improved, Newcastle being the prime example.

I'm not as confident in Martinez ability to spend that money in a coherent way that improves us as everyone else. He hasn't really pulled any rabbits out of the hat on the signings front. Moyes beats him hands down in this regard IMHO.

He's basically signed known quantities that he's managed before or proven premier league players like Lennon and Barry.

The worrying thing is is that for the first time in 25 years our problems aren't solvable by signing better players. We already have good players. The issue is with the managers mentality which isn't going to change. That mentality minus Lukaku equals big trouble.

On the contrary I don't think the problem lies with Martinez's ability to spot a player and pay money for him as those he has at Everton have been successes. The issue is if he can use them to find consistency and to move up a level as Moshiri will surely demand. It's why I have no problems been given money to spend in the summer as if he can't get the best of them then they're likely to still be good players that someone else will.

We're a much more stable entity than Newcastle and it shows. I wouldn't let your anxiety run amok too much citing them as a foreboding of doom. Their fans deserve it too for delusion, narcissism and hysteria.

 

[AJC5]

On the contrary I don't think the problem lies with Martinez's ability to spot a player and pay money for him as those he has at Everton have been successes. The issue is if he can use them to find consistency and to move up a level as Moshiri will surely demand. It's why I have no problems been given money to spend in the summer as if he can't get the best of them then they're likely to still be good players that someone else will.

We're a much more stable entity than Newcastle and it shows. I wouldn't let your anxiety run amok too much citing them as a foreboding of doom. Their fans deserve it too for delusion, narcissism and hysteria.

Lukaku - 2 successful seasons in the premier league, proved himself on loan therefore signing was very limited risk.

Barry - proven player. Loan initially therefore zero risk.

McCarthy - already a known quantity from RMs Wigan days. Good first season. Meh since.

Del - loan initially showed he can do it in the premier league. Remains to be season if he can be a starter in a successful premier league team.

Kone - known quantity from Wigan days. Has contributed very little.

Cleverly - known quantity from Wigan days. Decent value for money squad filler but nothing more.

McGeady - waste of time but cheap.

Lennon - proven premier league player. Does what he says on the tin. Good value for money.

Funes Mori - goals have hidden defensive errors. Jury is still out.

Besic - clear potential but yet to make a significant contribution.

Niasse - too early to judge for some but doesn't look great.

RM had mainly signed players initially on loan, those who he knows from Wigan and a couple of proven premier league performers.

Apart from Lukaku, he hasn't really made any signings as good as Arteta, Cahill, Baines, Pienaar, Lescott or Jags as yet.

 

[ilikecheese]

Lukaku - 2 successful seasons in the premier league, proved himself on loan therefore signing was very limited risk.

Barry - proven player. Loan initially therefore zero risk.

McCarthy - already a known quantity from RMs Wigan days. Good first season. Meh since.

Del - loan initially showed he can do it in the premier league. Remains to be season if he can be a starter in a successful premier league team.

Kone - known quantity from Wigan days. Has contributed very little.

Cleverly - known quantity from Wigan days. Decent value for money squad filler but nothing more.

McGeady - waste of time but cheap.

Lennon - proven premier league player. Does what he says on the tin. Good value for money.

Funes Mori - goals have hidden defensive errors. Jury is still out.

Besic - clear potential but yet to make a significant contribution.

Niasse - too early to judge for some but doesn't look great.

RM had mainly signed players initially on loan, those who he knows from Wigan and a couple of proven premier league performers.

Apart from Lukaku, he hasn't really made any signings as good as Arteta, Cahill, Baines, Pienaar, Lescott or Jags as yet.

Damn him for using the loan system to his advantage. F F S

Perhaps he has yano...hard to tell so early on.

 

[chicoazul]

Damn him for using the loan system to hos advantage. F F S

Perhaps he has yano...hard to tell so early on.

My fault completely for trying to have a reasoned debate. It's a futile exercise on anything Martinez related sadly.

 

[ilikecheese]

My fault completely for trying to have a reasoned debate. It's a futile exercise on anything Martinez related sadly.

Mate a reasoned debate can easily happen. Some are so agenda driven at this point they spin everything into a negative. The transfer market really isn't a stick to beat Martinez with. There are plenty of other sticks to be had.

 

[marsh]

Robertos Blue Army!!!!

 

[LinekersLegs]

Lukaku - 2 successful seasons in the premier league, proved himself on loan therefore signing was very limited risk.

Barry - proven player. Loan initially therefore zero risk.

McCarthy - already a known quantity from RMs Wigan days. Good first season. Meh since.

Del - loan initially showed he can do it in the premier league. Remains to be season if he can be a starter in a successful premier league team.

Kone - known quantity from Wigan days. Has contributed very little.

Cleverly - known quantity from Wigan days. Decent value for money squad filler but nothing more.

McGeady - waste of time but cheap.

Lennon - proven premier league player. Does what he says on the tin. Good value for money.

Funes Mori - goals have hidden defensive errors. Jury is still out.

Besic - clear potential but yet to make a significant contribution.

Niasse - too early to judge for some but doesn't look great.

RM had mainly signed players initially on loan, those who he knows from Wigan and a couple of proven premier league performers.

Apart from Lukaku, he hasn't really made any signings as good as Arteta, Cahill, Baines, Pienaar, Lescott or Jags as yet.

Err, 28 m for Lukaku was a "very limited risk"??? Lots of people were saying it was an idiotic waste of money including many blues last year!

Barry, many thought he was washed up when he joined on loan, let alone giving him the contract that he did and the fume about him last year after his injury..

And those are just the first two! Moyes was superb at transfers imo but tbh think Martinez gives him a very close run to date, you only have to look across the park at Liverpool to see how badly it can be messed up.

Edit - just for reference less than 7% of GOT were willing to pay upwards of 25m for Rom (I thought his max was 24!)
https://www.grandoldteam.com/forum/threads/would-you-pay-£24m-for-lukaku.68402/

 

[Furey1878]

I want him out in the summer regardless of what happens in the cup, although I would want it done very quickly in the hope that the new man can come in and have the full summer to identify targets and more importantly convince your Roms and Barkleys to buy into his vision for the club.

Let's be honest If you was Lukaku your not going to believe a word that will come out of Bobby's mouth when he tries convincing him to commit to the future and ignore offers from other clubs, he'll just think another season of mid table underachievement and poor defensive organisation.

Don't get me wrong, mate. I fully understand why people would want him out irrespective of whether we in the cup.

If we won the cup I'd say defo give him another year to show he can back up all his talk.

If we don't then I'm really not sure, I'm all for his long-term vision and think he can really both spot and convince players to join us. But why can't we bring through young players and make the most out of the talented players we do have at least on some sort of consistent basis?

Like I said I'm just not sure, I can't really think of any realistic replacements that could really tempt me over to the dark-side but then again I'm a clueless melt who's knowledge of football rarely extends beyond booing my own team and Fifa overall ratings.

 

[Igrok]

Martinez threads will never die..like little cockroaches thru the wall cracks they will emerge and multiply...
It will end soon, dont worry...

 

[chicoazul]

I'll keep this thread open but let's not just fall into the trap of labelling other blues just because they have an alternative view to your own.

Both sides of the argument should be able to present their case without resorting to goading or name calling.

I find some already are not participating in this thread as you asked them politely to Mr Esk.

Davek is actually responsible for most of the hysteria. If he just let people vent they would forget about it. The fact he refuses to acknowledge reality and is winding people up means their is an open wound which must be constantly picked at.

Martinez threads will never die..like little cockroaches thru the wall cracks they will emerge and multiply...
It will end soon, dont worry...

 

[Dylan]

Davek is actually responsible for most of the hysteria. If he just let people vent they would forget about it. The fact he refuses to acknowledge reality and is winding people up means their is an open wound which must be constantly picked at.

Give it up. If @davek wants to defend Martinez, he is well within his right. At no point has he ever prevented people from venting their feelings about the man.

He never budged on Moyes, so why would you even entertain the thought that he would budge on his opinion of Martinez?